Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Miscellaneous/2007 June 4

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June 4

how do you pronounce this??

how do you pronounce "Papahānaumokuākea Marine National Monument"?

I would say "papa hana u moku a KEE a". -- JackofOz 00:51, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

"That nice, green place over thataway." Clarityfiend 09:26, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

I would have said Papaha naw mok wa kea. It might work.

I would have said "that Papa monument." 192.41.95.1 00:19, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Break it down into syllables (each vowel ends a syllable). Pronounce the vowels as in Spanish or Italian. Hold the ā longer. —Tamfang 04:14, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Isn't the second last sylabble that ends in a vowel longer, and what happens if you have two vowels next to each other, is this two sylables :( HS7 14:20, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

I think you mean stronger, not longer, but I don't know about Hawaiian stress rules. And yes, adjacent vowels are distinct syllables. —Tamfang 05:22, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Colour Inkjet Refill

Hello. When I refill an HP 28 Colour Cartridge that is low on ink as indicated to me on my computer, I can only refill about 1 mL of each of the three colours (magenta, cyan, and yellow). The cartridge says it can hold up to 8 mL. Why can't I refill 8 mL of each colour? Thanks. --Mayfare 23:58, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

Just speculation, but, if it's an airtight container and you are using a needle to inject new ink, you will need to draw air out to allow room for the new ink. StuRat 01:21, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for your speculation, StuRat. However, I am not sure if my colour ink cartridge is airtight. I went on HP's website and couldn't find any information on it. I even tried searching on Google. No luck there. Does anybody know if an HP 28 Colour Cartridge airtight? --Mayfare 02:45, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Why not do an experiment and use the needle to draw some air out first, and see if that doesn't allow you to inject more ink ? StuRat 02:55, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

I experimented. Drawing out colour ink does not allow me to inject more colour ink. Why can't I refill 8 mL of each colour. --Mayfare 00:40, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Is it actually empty? It could just be that the cartridge is mis-reporting its status to the printer driver. Does it print OK? --YFB ¿ 02:33, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Editing while drunk, EUII

Are there any documented cases of people editing Wikipedia while drunk or under the influence of intoxicants? What are the penalties for this offense and how many. I'll take my anser over the air. Firat time caller, long time listener. NoClutter 01:22, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

I daresay that people frequently edit WP while drunk or stoned. Unless they start spouting gibberish, flaming, posting random rants or telling everyone *just how drunk/stoned they are* in their edit summaries, I doubt that anyone would even notice most of the time. --Kurt Shaped Box 01:31, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

It's hard to tell whether some of the incomprehensible and/or amazingly mis-spelled edits we often get are attributable to alcohol, other mind-altering substances, mental decline, relative unfamiliarity with English, the lack of modern educational standards, or some combination of these factors. -- JackofOz 01:44, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

If it's not that, it's friends of homosexuals performing e-shoutouts to their gay buddies (there was an essay on that somewhere, wasn't there?)... --Kurt Shaped Box 01:58, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Friends of gays should not be allowed to edit articles. --YFB ¿ 02:35, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Yeees. Drunk, stoned homosexuals are the worst of all.  :) JackofOz 03:18, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Ha! We need to have more of those form letters completed. bibliomaniac15 An age old question... 03:29, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

[1] My all-time favorite drunk edit. --69.144.232.61 06:40, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

See Wikipedia:Editing Under the Influence (not only do we have an article on everything, but a project page on everything too!) Laïka 07:17, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Ahem; no comment. --TotoBaggins 14:19, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

yuo meen yer sopposed to cont ediu ge yer anwser sober? hells belllss Perry-mankster 15:07, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Well, who hasn't been there? A Breathalyzer interfaced to a USB port (or a Merlot filter in series with the keyboard could prevent a lot of unfortunate edits. I suspect that a rambling misspelled Wikipedia edit where an editor tells someone off, while it might lead to a WP:NPA warning, or even a ban, would be less detrimental to life, liberty and personal fortune than if the same energy went into a late-night call to one's boss, significant other, or high government official, or a drive in the car. Inappropriate edits can be and are quickly reverted. God Blesh Murka! Edison 17:25, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Spoiled children study

Can someone direct me to research detailing the effects of spoiling a child? I need studies detailing evidence of children who are given every single thing they demand, never told to ask please, say thank you etc. etc. Since experiments of this nature might violate ethical standards, I imagine such research must be done "in the wild". NoClutter 01:26, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Look no further than the entire season of My Super Sweet 16. After watching an episode of that I swore my children would live on bread and water until the 18th birthday. Rockpocket 03:58, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Try a Web search (e.g. via Google) on the term "permissiveness" + childrearing. -- Deborahjay 22:54, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Sega

Why did Sega stop making consoles?

See History of video game consoles (fifth generation):

The Sega 32X, an upgrade for the Mega Drive/Genesis and Sega [Mega-]CD that was enhanced for 32-bit gameplay, was released a year prior to the release of the Saturn, which angered consumers who bought it and then had to buy a Saturn when the 32X eventually failed and died due to the Mega Drive/Genesis failing in the first place in Japan's videogame market, and the need for Sega of Japan to release a new system to compete against forthcoming Nintendo's Nintendo 64 and Sony's PlayStation, ultimately leading to an almost complete lack of Japanese development for the Super 32X. This fiasco severely damaged Sega, and has been considered a major factor in Sega eventually dropping hardware development entirely to focus on games.

Rockpocket 04:07, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

It wasn't so much that as it was the unpopularity of the Dreamcast. --69.144.232.61 06:33, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Actually, the Dreamcast did decently well. The problem was that the Dreamcast was launched at a bad time, a year before Sony's PlayStation 2. Due to Sega's track record however (Sega saturn, Sega cd, Sega 32x), game developers were hesitant to release games, and waited instead for the much more popular PlayStation 2. Sega probably didn't have the resources for a long term battle with Sony, which they probably would have lost anyway.--GTPoompt 15:04, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Can you still buy Sega stuff :? HS7 19:21, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Sega still creates games for other consoles (including Wii/PS3/Xbox360), or do you mean old consoles? --Wirbelwindヴィルヴェルヴィント (talk) 21:46, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Yes, the old ones, they're much better than modern junk :) HS7 14:19, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Yes, your best bet is ebay. Brand new 10 year old consoles are unlikely to be found, so you'd have to settle for a used one. I believe you can get dreamcast's new from Sega direct, unsure of how to go about doing that.--GTPoompt 16:25, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Seasoned wok, or not?

So I've been trying for the last little while to season a wok, in order to be able to approximate authentic Chinese stir-fry.

This is a non-stick, carbon-steel wok, that I initially seasoned by scrubbing it down, wiping it over with peanut oil and then heating it on a very high temperature until it changed colour. (See photos)

On a day to day basis, I heat the wok until its hot, then add the oil, then proceed to cook. After the end, I scrub it out with a soft sponge and hot water, dry it on low heat, apply a film of oil and burn it off on high heat.

The surface works well, but I find that fried rice (with the egg added in) appears to be deadly on the seasoning.

Have I achieved a seasoned wok? There are some faltering areas, as you can see in the closeup... should I start over?

Thanks for the advice 65.94.166.17 03:12, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

I love wok cooking and have seasoned a couple of woks, however I'm not Asian so this may not be strictly correct. From what I can tell in the photos, you are doing a good job, but you've really only just started. Your wok appears about 50% seasoned. I don't think you have to start again and I don't think you necessarily have to force the process along, but your wok will really be seasoned when the entire surface to the edges looks like the very middle does currently. This is quite hard to do on a regular western kitchen stove without a purpose "wok burner", but it will happen eventually, just don't be shy with the heat. But very seriously now, always, I mean ALWAYS keep the wok lid near by when you cook, very hot oil can ignite and be VERY dangerous, a flash can be harmless but if it ignites proper throw the lid on and take it off the heat, never try to pick it up, the worst thing you can do is spill boiling burning liquid also NEVER pour water onto a hot wok. If you are serious into wok cooking, I'd recommend a fire blanket and even a small extinguisher, I've never used mine, but better be safe then sorry. Vespine 06:35, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

• Don't clean it so thoughly.hotclaws 09:25, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Also, part of the reason why your fried rice is deadly on the wok might be because it's a flat bottommed wok. For cooking, do you use an electric stove? If not, I would recommend getting a wok ring and a round-bottom wok for better authenticity, and probably let you cook foods without burning them a bit easier. But I actually haven't used a round-bottomed wok myself, since I haven't lived in a house with a gas stove since I left Taiwan. --Wirbelwindヴィルヴェルヴィント (talk) 21:58, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Oh, and this guide appear to be very good, and the tips at the bottom of this site is worth a look. And now I just noticed that you're using a non-stick wok, which the pages say don't season. --Wirbelwindヴィルヴェルヴィント (talk) 22:08, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

There's non-stick and then there's non-stick. A carbon steel "non-stick" wok doesn't have a non stick coating, which is the type they say not to season, seasoning a teflon wok even once can completely ruin it. Vespine 22:25, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

my parents threw away a really well seasoned wok... the whole thing was black (though I can't be sure if it was like that all along since the wok was even older than I am!)Coolotter88 23:11, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Skating with ice hockey skates and figure skates

I have ice skated a few times using rented skates that resemble figure skates and can get around the rink fairly well. However, I recently tried to use hockey skates and found it very difficult to move forward. Do you need a different technique to skate with hockey skates or are general figure skates more forgiving / easier to skate with? Is it recommended to skate with hockey skates or should I stick to figure skates?

In general, in Canada, for pleasure skating, males skate wearing hockey skates (unless they are training in figure skating) and females wear figure skates (unless they are playing hockey). Figure skates have toe picks (triangular notches at the front curve of the blade) that you can use to push yourself off with, a feature that hockey skates do not have. That may be why you found the figure skates easier to move forward in. Bielle 05:27, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks, I guess I didn't realize I was using the toe picks to push off. I guess I should try and learn to use hockey skates properly!

There is no need to push off with toe picks. A teacher or coach can show you how to place your weight on one skate and push off with the other skate's blade, behind and at an angle. The toepick is more for jumps, in my experience. Edison 17:17, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Edison is quite right. Only the newest of skaters tends to use the toe picks for pushing, and, more often that not, they then catch and send you tumbling. I assumed the questioner was an extreme novice. Bielle 18:09, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

united airlines website

The UAL website is not working. Is anyone able to get on it.--logger 05:24, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

You mean [2]? Yes, I can get on it. You may want to call up your ISP's tech support if you're having issues. -- Consumed Crustacean (talk) 05:25, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Works for me. Dismas|^(talk) 05:26, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

i am in a hotel using wifi provided by the hotel. every site works except united.--logger 05:28, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Click here. If it still doesn't work, you might try a proxy server, like this one. --69.144.232.61 06:42, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

holy t-shirt batman!

hi all, for several months now i have noticed that small holes have started appearing on the front of my t-shirts, reminiscent of 'rock burns' caused by 'hot rocks' falling from a joint (not the cause, man ) the holes have a ragged edge, not clear edged like a rock burn, but are all in the usual place you would expect them - at the front about navel 'height' so far i have ruled out:

-clothe moths

-the washing machine

-my belt

-the new leather jacket i received at Christmas (the zip of said jacket - prime suspect for a while)

-a stoner, stealing my t-shirts, smoking soapbar, burning holes in my t-shirt, washing them, ironing them and returning them back to my wardrobe [3]

as you can see i am getting desperate to find the answer (not that you have to be desperate to ask at the ref desk) any suggestions would be very much appreciated Perry-mankster 14:35, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Sound like some sort of bugs to me.... --24.147.86.187 15:10, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Anyone who irons t-shirts is bound to have something else odd happen to them. If the t-shirts are all old, and cotton, then cotton tends to wear at weak spots, in addition to wearing thin generally. The weak spots you can usually see if you hold something cotton up to a strong light.(I have cotton sheets that developed the same tiny, ragged-edged holes, but only after about 15 years of wear and washing.) Bielle 18:05, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

I've had this problem with quite a few t-shirts; in my case, it seemed to be due to accidental spray of caustic chemicals in school chemistry lessons - unless they are washed immediately, the holes can develop very quickly; even very weak stuff, such as dilute sodium hydroxide and vinegar seems able to do it - but then maybe I need to get some better quality t-shirts! Laïka 19:33, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

I'm assuming you don't have a belly ring or something. However, habit can also cause holes in shirts. From experience, most of my shirts used to develop a hole at the same area (left shoulder) due to the way I carry my backpack. It takes years to develop, but they all get one there eventually. It's possible that some minor habitual thing where you constantly stretch or tug on the cloth located by your navel, which goes back to what Bielle said above. --Wirbelwindヴィルヴェルヴィント (talk) 21:13, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

At your work do you lean against a table or countertop at about that height? Do you work in some sort of metal fabrication profession where parts may come in contact with your clothing and snag very slightly? What you describe sounds slightly like holes that welders get in their clothing from the sparks while working. Dismas|^(talk) 21:20, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

I noticed the same issue with shirts of my own, and I think that the cotton thread just gets a tiny snag on something and becomes a weak spot, as Bielle mentioned. Mostly my snags came about by something simple like a wall corner touching my chest. Simply unnoticeable. It happens as a T-shirt gets older. That's why they get so cheap at times. 192.41.95.1 00:48, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

If you have a cat, you will find that they are very good at introducing such snags into your clothes. Thryduulf 08:28, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

First off a big heart felt thank you to all the suggestions, i am truly amazed at the collective knowledge available on these desks [and disappointed i didn't get a complete break down of the history of holes in t-shirts{with references}from clio LOL :)] - i think laika may have hit on something as i have recently started cleaning our a bathroom on a saturday - meaning i have to do it v quickly between other regular things we do at the weekend - and have become a bit slapdash with the cleaning products, also i lean against the side of the bath to clean inside it and my T touchs the bath at the point of the holes (as dismas and wirbelwind suggested) i will just have to start wearing a pinny thanks again Perry-mankster 12:23, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

You could decide on one shirt to designate as your cleaning shirt. That way the holes only appear in one shirt that you don't care about as much as the others. You already have holes in one of those. No point in getting a pinny just so you can put holes in that as well. In my case, I have wear baseball caps rather often and I have one specifically for when I work on the Jeeps. I call it my oil changing hat since it keeps dirt out of my hair when I'm crawling under the vehicle. P.S. I guessed correctly on what a pinny is! Dismas|^(talk) 12:49, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

I will take your advice Dismas, and well done! it was not an easy reference :) Perry-mankster 13:14, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Help required on Plasma(Component of Blood) collection centre

There are various regulation governing the Plasma collection centers.

I would like to know the regulations involved in the Plasma Collection centers in Germany.

Thanks in advance Nandini

This question requires a level of specialized expertise that you are unlikely to find among Reference Desk editors. It also calls for legal expertise, which we cannot offer. Your best course would be to contact an attorney specializing in medical or public health law in Germany. Marco polo 20:05, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Incidentally, laws can vary from one state (Bundesland) to another in Germany, so it would be best to contact an attorney practicing in the state where the plasma collection centers in question are or would be located. Marco polo 20:10, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Or a lawyer. (The word "attorney" does not mean "lawyer" outside the US, and unless the individual in question watches American legal shows without subtitles he or she may not recognize the term.) --Charlene 06:24, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Hi, Nandini, depending on the level of detail required for your research, you may find out what you want simply by contacting a local plasma collection center and (assuming you are not already in Germany) ask them if they have a facility and donor number for Germany. If yes, then just ask them what kinds of regulations they are expected to follow. If you are not satisfied with that write down the donor number and contact the German Health Authority. dr.ef.tymac 06:45, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Shepard-Risset Glissando

I'm not sure which Reference Desk this would be best posted under, so I have decided to post it here. I have been looking at the articles on Shepard tone and Shepard-Risset glissando and I would like to create my own. Unfortunately, I am not entirely sure how best to go about this. I have seen a good Java applet on one of the external links that I could use to make a Shepard tone, but I ideally want to make a glissando, similar to how this chap has done [4]. Unfortunately, the website is in French and I am not entirely sure about the formulae he writes about. Do I just need to input the forumlae in the programming language of my choice (probably Processing with the Minim audio library) and then make a sine wave out of the function s? Alternatively, are there any other ways I could implement this? Thanks for any help you can give. --80.229.152.246 21:13, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

I'm sure I've missed something here, because I do not see how one sine function is going to give me a multitude of tones. Oh, and ChucK is one heck of a strange language... --80.229.152.246 21:34, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

So this is a kind of 'acoustic illusion'...and optical illusion for your ears. The effect is a sound that appears to get higher and higher in pitch without limit (or lower and lower in frequency). The idea is to play many sine waves at once - spaced out exactly an octave apart. Now, all of the tones are continually increased in pitch - keeping them spaced apart by exact octaves. Now comes the sneaky part - each wave starts off quiet (when it's very low in frequency), gets gradually louder and then fades out to nothing as it's frequency hits some upper limit. Once each one of your sine waves reaches maximum frequency (but has faded out to zero volume), you can snap it down to one octave below your lowest frequency tone and start all over again. So each sine wave is increasing in frequency (which your ears can clearly detect) - but fading the volume in and out means that you never clearly hear a new sound entering at the low end of the frequency range or a high frequency sound leaving at the top end. Furthermore, when you add sine waves at octave spacing, what you get is a Sawtooth wave - so you ears don't even clearly hear a set of separate sine waves - but instead, one somewhat distorted sawtooth. The little loudspeaker on my laptop freaks out and distorts horribly when I play one of these acoustic monsters. As for programming one - there are a million ways - you could write the code in C++ and link to the 'OpenAL' library - then you can compose your sinewaves in a big memory buffer and just tell the audio library to play it or save it to disk. Or you could write out a MIDI file - there are all sorts of possibilities. In the end, it's hard to give advice because it depends on your final application and on what programming languages and experiences you have. You could actually make a sound snippet of this in a program like Audacity without doing any programming at all! SteveBaker 02:59, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Hi, 80.229. If you are uncomfortable with the likes of ChucK (admittedly, it is still a "young" language) you might also try something like Snack or FL Studio. This kind of software can be very cumbersome if all you are after is "lab" for basic sound experiments. dr.ef.tymac 06:58, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the answers everyone. Actually, I was more interested in what I should do to make the volumes of the sine waves correct. I have so far been able to calculate the volumes for a primitive Shepard tone rendition, but I would like to know if there was a better way of doing it for a Shepard-Risset Glissando. Although I think I could write a function for each sine wave to calculate its frequency and amplitude at each moment, I would like to know if I could achieve the same effect with a bandpass filter with a Gaussian curve. Any ideas? --80.229.152.246 20:54, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

From what I recall of the time I tried this, it took a bit of experimentation to get the volume sweep just right - I'm not 100% sure what the rule is - I just hacked around until it worked. That suggests that it's not absolutely crucial - so a bandpass filter might well work OK. You'll have to experiment I think. SteveBaker 02:40, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

The IDF checkpoint on the way to Ramallah

I've gathered you aren't supposed to say you are headed to Ramallah. But Bethlehem is in the opposite direction. So what do you do? Choose your own adventure!

128.54.75.57 21:37, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Rephrase? 213.161.190.228 10:54, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps the questioner wants to know of a place he can claim he is going to, to hide his real intentions of going to Ramallah. I don't see why he can't just say he is going to Ramallah and explain why he is going. They may detain you a few minutes longer and ask a few question, but it is nothing compared to how long they will detain you if they know you are lieing to them. Also Bethlehem is also an arab town and would also raise suspicion. Bet El is close and I think uses the same road, but as I said above, it is a bad idea to lie. Jon513 14:22, 5 June 2007 (UTC)