User talk:Sjschen/Archive 1

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Welcome!

Hello, Sjschen/Archive 1, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Where to ask a question, ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Again, welcome!  -- Longhair | Talk 09:42, 10 August 2005 (UTC)

Tofu

Yeah, it's fun! I'm not sure I get, though, that part of the article...it sounds as if the writer doubts that tofu can be fried. But it certainly can and I eat it that way all the time, either soft or firm tofu. Badagnani 06:32, 31 August 2005 (UTC)

Hey Sjschen, I was in the Chinese supermarket today and I saw a jar of pickled tofu with a bunch of whole soybeans and short-grain rice (it looked like "sticky rice") sitting on top of the tofu cubes. Does this represent another type not described? You had added something about a paste made of rice and soybeans, but in the jar I saw, the rice and soybeans were whole, not pulverized.

As always, excellent work on the article. I think the "tofu" article should get "featured article" status eventually.  :) Badagnani 10:25, 5 September 2005 (UTC)

Korean "sundubu"

Check this out: [1] Not sure if this is a separate variety (some websites call it "uncurdled soft tofu") but I think in modern times it might just be the Korean name for soft/silken tofu. If they use seawater to make it curdle (at least the variety that's described) then it's not uncurdled. "Sun" means "pure" in Korean, by the way. I like how they say it takes "a lot of sincerity" to make.

I'd like to add a section about "tubu chorim" (a Korean recipe consisting of tofu cubes that are sauteed with soy sauce, garlic, and pepper paste or powder until the sauce mixture impregnates the tofu and the tofu cubes become smaller and firmer as the water burns off. This is a great recipe and I think it should be described. If you have familiarity with it maybe you could write it. Badagnani 06:03, 11 September 2005 (UTC)

There are many references online to sundubu as "uncurdled bean curd" but the recipes for making it include seawater. Thus, I think "uncurdled" isn't a correct usage but what they probably mean is that they just gather the raw curds and serve them "as is" without removing moisture or pressing into blocks. In any case (esp. if we could get more info from Koreans who know more about this) I think "sundubu" deserves a mention. Thanks for the recommendations about "tubu chorim"; that's a good idea. Probably there should be an article on "chorim"s in general and tofu can be discussed alongside the various meat chorims, with a redirect from the tofu article. Badagnani 19:29, 12 September 2005 (UTC)

I guess I was right -- it is "uncoagulated," not uncurdled. The Korean-English dictionaries those other websites used must have had the wrong translation. See if this makes any sense and see where it should be placed in the article--I guess under "soft tofu."[2] Badagnani 19:34, 12 September 2005 (UTC)

Actually, both terms are used in modern Korean. Asked about the difference between 연두부 (which I guess is silken tofu) and 순두부, a Korean just told me they're not the same. Not sure about how they are different from each other, the speaker said that 순두부 is mainly used in soups, while 연두부 is not.
It might be the same thing coming with different labels. Wikipeditor 10:06, 2 November 2005 (UTC)

Coagulants

I'm wondering if you mean that the coagulant salts have little taste in the finished tofu or on their own. I have a feeling that if you chewed on some nigari you'd taste something (if not very pleasant, hence the link to the term "bitter," as you've written), so maybe the wording should be adjusted. Badagnani 23:50, 14 September 2005 (UTC)

OK, so it should probably say that there's no detectable taste of the coagulant in the finished tofu (instead of saying there's no taste to the coagulant itself). Badagnani 19:43, 15 September 2005 (UTC)

User Categorisation

You were listed on the Wikipedia:Wikipedians/Ontario page as living in or being associated with Ontario. As part of the Wikipedia:User categorisation project, these lists are being replaced with user categories. If you would like to add yourself to the category that is replacing the page, please visit Category:Wikipedians in Ontario for instructions.--Rmky87 04:32, 10 October 2005 (UTC)

Do me a favor?

Can you correct the pinyins in this article?--성혀니

Okara nomenclature

Hi, just wondering if the first name you gave in pinyin for okara (snowflake vegetable) is actually an exclusively Japanese/kanji usage. If so, that should be made clear. BTW looks like the person who moved okara to "soy pulp" hasn't responded to our comments yet. Badagnani 01:45, 12 December 2005 (UTC)

I just tried but it wouldn't let me as there was already an okara page. We have to have an admin do it. Anyway, the original editor admitted his/her error and said s/he would move the page back. Maybe s/he had the same problem I did. I'll try to submit to an admin to do. Badagnani 02:16, 12 December 2005 (UTC)

OK, I checked Wikipedia:Requested moves and Wikipeditor has already recommended the move. We can just sit back and wait for it to move back. Badagnani 02:21, 12 December 2005 (UTC)

  • Sjschen said: "Maybe just copy all the Soy pulp content to the Okara page then?"

I've tried this before but it's not a good idea because you lose the "history" of the page. Having an admin do it, unfortunately, is the best way. Badagnani 02:23, 12 December 2005 (UTC)

Oops… I should have read this before. Instead, I was also thinking copy+pasting would be the easiest way to go about it and did it. I am sorry for destroying the history and making invisible all effort you had put into the article until then. If you need the old history or want to see how the article looked before I started to mess with it, see the history of Soy pulp where it is perfectly preserved. Merry Christmas!—Wikipeditor 21:11, 26 December 2005 (UTC)

Yuba

I just noticed, also, that "yuba" needs pinyin in the tofu article. Badagnani 01:47, 12 December 2005 (UTC)

Can't see third tone mark

I have a question...on my computer I can't see any characters with caron (third tone mark) on Wikipedia (I just see an empty box where that character should be), though on some other computers I can see them. But, on my computer, I can see all the 3rd tone characters with carons here: http://www.math.nus.edu.sg/aslaksen/read.shtml . I can also see them when editing, but not on the finished page. I think it might be a problem with the programming of the Wikipedia website. Do you have any idea why this is happening to me? Thanks, Badagnani 02:04, 12 December 2005 (UTC)

Thanks--I see identical square empty boxes. But on the website I gave you above, I see the vowels with carons perfectly. That leads me to believe it's a problem with the Wikipedia programming/display which some newer computers are able to transcend, so people don't seem interested in fixing it. I've asked at pinyin several times, but unfortunately nobody there (I thought that would be where the experts would be) was helpful. Badagnani 02:11, 12 December 2005 (UTC)

I checked, and my encoding is set as Unicode UTF-8, which is what it should be set to to see pretty much any/all diacritics. Badagnani 02:13, 12 December 2005 (UTC)

Thanks, but I'm not really sure how I can override the font my IE uses to display Wikipedia. Wish I knew who to complain to. Badagnani 02:24, 12 December 2005 (UTC)

I took the plunge and downloaded Firefox, at your recommendation. It works almost the same as IE, not bad. I don't like the way the Chinese characters display, though; grainy and hard to read even when increasing the font. All pinyin issues are resolved. Looks like Microsoft, supposedly the geniuses of the computers, can't do as well as Mozilla in this regard? Amazing. Badagnani 11:26, 15 December 2005 (UTC)

Gluten

Did you know all this stuff in your head or are you looking it up? Your knowledge of obscure vegetarian foods is amazing, as usual. Badagnani 02:34, 13 December 2005 (UTC)

That, and I guess being immersed in a food heavy engineering family since birth really soaks this kind of obsure stuff into your head.

You just added "fu" to the fu disambig page, but it was already there -- "foo"!  :) Badagnani 03:33, 13 December 2005 (UTC)

I was just kidding about the "foo" part. You are my "sensei" of vegetarian meat substitutes. Badagnani 04:00, 13 December 2005 (UTC)

The air cells in the Chinese kao fu gluten I ate were big (that's why the texture visually reminded me of rice noodles or tripe). Badagnani 01:16, 14 December 2005 (UTC)

The photo might be related to what I had; it's hard to tell. I didn't know it was supposed to be put in broth and I was trying to get them to put it with some chiezi (eggplant) I also saw in the line, but they didn't want to do that. The color was white, just like wide mi fen or he fen noodles, but they told me it was gluten. I'm not exactly sure what kind it was.

In New York the gluten consists of lumps of homemade gluten that tastes just like it would if I made it myself from the powdered mix. They seem to be steamed, fried, and braised, with donggu/xianggu, like you describe. Very hard to chew (and equally hard to digest)! Vegetarian Paradise 3 on Mott Street makes blocks of "ham" (even colored pink) made out of a similar type of gluten, very dense and chewy. Badagnani 02:10, 14 December 2005 (UTC)

No digital camera (yet), unfortunately (and my computer's old so I have no USB port either)... Here's the mix -- http://www.veganstore.com/index-store.html?deptid=17118&parentid=40&stocknumber=245&page=1&itemsperpage=12 -- this contains gluten plus some other ingredients, but you can also buy vital wheat gluten from Arrowhead Mills http://www.steviasmart.com/armiviwhgl.html and it comes out similarly. I buy something called "gluten flour" which is pretty much the same thing. I haven't made it in at least 6 years; lately I buy the White Wave Chicken Style Seitan http://www.whitewave.com/index.php?id=93 (just ate some today), which is really delicious. Badagnani 02:52, 14 December 2005 (UTC)

Found a new Chinese grocery store that just opened up and got some Japanese sukiyakifu, some jarred mian jin with peanuts (I'll have to make some jook, I guess), some Chinese gluten puffs (dried, in rectangles), and some dried "big gluten balls" (the size of lemons but weighing almost nothing). I felt I'd better try some of these things we've been writing about :0. Badagnani 11:28, 15 December 2005 (UTC)

I made that dish with the Chinese & Japanese kao fu, broth, some mijiu, soy sauce, some chayote (Buddha hand squash), some butternut squash, and some Laotian sour bamboo. I just told a friend in Beijing and she said that combination sounded very strange. I'll have to blame it on you.

By the way, the "big gluten balls" I bought are "da qiu mian jin." Are you familiar with this and does this represent a 4th kind of Chinese gluten? If so, can you add this in the article? Badagnani 05:55, 16 December 2005 (UTC)

These "big gluten balls" aren't that big (grapefruit size); they're the size of lemons. Can you add the info? These are different enough from the "fake abalone" kind that they deserve treatment. Hard to know what's in 'em, because there are no ingredients listed. Total Fat is 15 grams for a 50 gram serving and they appear oily on the surface. Badagnani 23:32, 16 December 2005 (UTC)

Changes to Template:User dvrk

Hi, I am trying to figure out the reasons for the changes to the Dvorak user box template. Now there seems to be two auto-category-adders within different <includeonly> tags. After I made a mod to my userpage today, I noticed that within Category:Dvorak keyboard users I am now listed under "U" rather than "E" and think your edit had something to do with it. I am not complaining exactly, yet I am tempted to revert to the old version, but first want understand the goal of the additional code. — Eoghanacht talk 17:53, 20 December 2005 (UTC)

Noodles

I've realized that Wikipedia has a serious deficiency in Asian noodle articles: mi fen, he fen, la mian, etc. There's very little information except at Chinese noodles and thought you might want to approach this now that you've conqured tofu and wheat gluten. Badagnani 09:32, 26 December 2005 (UTC)

Also, Chinese wine could do with an article on each individual wine. Badagnani 09:32, 26 December 2005 (UTC)

Zha cai/jar choy

Oh, I just realized that you made the zha cai article! I couldn't find it and accidentally made a duplicate article under jar choy, the name I know it under due to the prevalence of Cantonese food here. I recommend merging everything to jar choy; what do you think? Badagnani 00:42, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

Wikimedia Canada

Hi there! I'd like to invite you to explore Wikimedia Canada, and create a list of people interested in forming a local chapter for our nation. A local chapter will help promote and improve the organization, within our great nation. We'd also like to encourage everyone to suggest projects for our national chapter to participate in. Hope to see you there!--DarkEvil 04:21, 3 February 2006 (UTC)

Image copyright problem with Image:Centuryegg12.JPG

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Please signify the copyright information on any other images you have uploaded or will upload. Remember that images without this important information can be deleted by an administrator. If you have any questions, feel free to contact me. Thank you. Nv8200p talk 18:05, 4 February 2006 (UTC)

Image copyright problem with Image:Centuryegg12.JPG

Thanks for uploading Image:Centuryegg12.JPG. However, the image may soon be deleted unless we can determine the copyright holder and copyright status. The Wikimedia Foundation is very careful about the images included in Wikipedia because of copyright law (see Wikipedia's Copyright policy).

The copyright holder is usually the creator, the creator's employer, or the last person who was transferred ownership rights. Copyright information on images is signified using copyright templates. The three basic license types on Wikipedia are open content, public domain, and fair use. Find the appropriate template in Wikipedia:Image copyright tags and place it on the image page like this: {{TemplateName}}.

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Operculum

I don't care much either way. You can change it or keep it as it is. All other uses of the term are biological. Therefore I wanted to keep the non-biologial separate. It doesn't matter all that much.Barbara Shack 15:11, 17 February 2006 (UTC)

Doufu tone

Hi, just saw your addition of 3rd tone for "doufu." LDHan says on tofu's "discussion" page that it's neutral (fifth) tone. Badagnani 00:54, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

He looked it up in his dictionary. I guess putonghua. I thought the "fu"'s 3rd tone was dropped (like in Lao Zi or Sun Zi) when putting the two syllables together. Badagnani 00:58, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

I just did a Google search and found both dou4fu3 and dou4fu5. I think the dou4fu5 is for ease of pronunciation, the way you say "ni2hao3" instead of "ni3hao3" -- too many 3rd tones are difficult. Badagnani 01:04, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

If you're interested, we could start a discussion about the neutral tone on the Standard Mandarin talk page and see what others think. LDHan 12:45, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

"Greenish"

I'm not certain that it can't be applied to smells, but I don't think it has a readily comprehensible meaning to your average person, and so is confusing to use in a general-readership encyclopedia. --Delirium 06:20, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

I suppose so, if you think it's a useful piece of information, and no "normal English" word would suffice. I generally think jargon serves more to obfuscate than to educate, but if absolutely unavoidable then I suppose using it with an explanation must suffice. --Delirium 06:44, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

Shaojiu

Though Wiktionary has "burned" or "scorched" as a definition for "shao," does your change to Chinese wine mean that the reason for this name (and thus soju and shochu is that the alcohol content is so strong that that's what it does to one's mouth? If so, I'll make that change to all the articles. Let me know. I had assumed the name was because a burning/scorching process was used to produce the liquor. Badagnani 18:20, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

I've always thought 烧酒 is called 烧酒 because the wine is traditionally heated in a water bath til slightly under the boiling point of alcohol before being consumed. As well, in minnan "烧" is the word used two say hot(temp.), whereas in mandarin the terms that are used are "烫"(tang4) or "热" (re4). It's to my understanding that this dialect and wine heating tradition is where the term 烧酒 arises. I'm not sure about the burning/scorching process. Do have a linke for it? Sjschen 19:00, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

That does make more sense but watch out: your substitution of "hot liquor" does make it sound to a native English speaker that it's called such because it makes your mouth feel that way. Badagnani 19:09, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

I don't know enough about Chinese usage or meanings in various dialects but it seems to me that "hot liquor" might not be the literal meaning of the "shao" in "shaojiu," even in Min Nan. Maybe "heated liquor"? I'd check the meanings on Wiktionary and just pick one or two of those. Badagnani 19:26, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

Chinese wine classification

Re: your additions to Chinese wine classification systems, a Chinese friend told me that Chinese wines are classified according to a "color" system, with subsystems below that. Yellow, red, white... This is actually described elsewhere in the Chinese wine article but should probably be under the classification system section. Also, the aromas listed on the talk page (originally at maotai), if they're legit, should be added to the classification area. Badagnani 19:36, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

Chinese wine

Hi, I need some Chinese language help at Chinese wine. I found three more forms of baijiu on this page: http://home.hkstar.com/~chnwine/111.html -- but I don't know how to spell them in characters or pinyin. They are: Pi lu chiew, Dah Chu chiew, and Imperial lotus white (you can find info about them by clicking on the bottles). Otherwise I think we've covered all the forms of baijiu I've been able to locate online, though I'm sure there are others out there. If you can add the info in the baijiu section of Chinese wine, that would be great. Badagnani 05:35, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

You're good at hanzi! Your Chinese teacher would be proud that you're putting your knowledge to work in such a good article. ha ha Thanks, I've put the three new liquors in Chinese wine; could you check my work? Can you think of any other yellow or white liquors that we've forgotten? Badagnani 06:48, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

薏米水

If there's a drink called 薏米水, does that mean that 薏米 is another synonym for Job's tears in Chinese? Badagnani 07:13, 5 May 2006 (UTC)

Thanks -- you might as well add those name permutations to the article, if you think they belong there. When you say "unshelled grain" do you mean the hard ones that are used as beads? Badagnani 23:10, 5 May 2006 (UTC)

Korean wine

If you're interested, I think you might enjoy checking out the Korean wine article (which I have also been working on) and help with it if you would like. Badagnani 23:12, 5 May 2006 (UTC)

No, just the end products. I assume that the processes are quite similar to those used in China and Japan. Badagnani 00:43, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Lotus seed

Done. It was quite well written. Was that a new one? Badagnani 23:41, 5 May 2006 (UTC)

Acorn/acre

A scan of Wiktionary shows that you're correct that the terms are related, going back to the common Indo-European roots of Latin and the Germanic languages. But "acorn" is "fruit of the field" and "acre" is "field," so probably "acorn" is related to "acre" but "acre" doesn't come from "acorn." http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%C3%86cer http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/acre Pig book sounds interesting! -- but I'm a vegan! Badagnani 04:05, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Raku

Re: your question about styles of raku. I left a long answer on my talk page, which I hope you saw. However, success!! I stole a 16th century raku tea bowl image from the Chawan article. The strong differences in style and appearance between the two images make a good contrast, I think. WBardwin 02:15, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

Chinese wine question

Hi, can you help me identify this Chinese wine? I bought a bottle of it (in a tan-colored ceramic bottle in the shape of a basket) in Beijing but don't know quite what it is because the characters (in the red diamond on the box) are hard to read. I think it's a special type of gaoliangju. I'd like to add it to the Chinese wine article, if you can help me figure out what it is. I found the company's website here -- I have the fat bottle that looks like a basket but if they have other varieties below that are different, maybe you could tell me what those are, too. Thanks! http://www.xiangjiugui.cn/web/index.php Badagnani 22:34, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

You're good! Thanks for the identification help. Would you check my work at Chinese wine to see I've listed it right? There seems to be no end to these Chinese wines, and ones like these seem to be mainly "famous" local variations on the baijiu theme. Regarding 湘泉酒, 玉金湘, and 三千年, are these all ones we haven't covered yet?
On another note, I think we might want to start migrating the lists of baijiu brands into the baijiu article. Badagnani 02:00, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
Well, I don't favor deleting anything from any of the articles (unless it's moved to another article instead), becuase this information (the things we've been building into the articles) are extremely, extremely hard to find in English, even for the most common wines and liquors. Like articles on vodka, whisky, or any other distilled beverage, production techniques are only one important item, among the beverage's history, cultural significance, manner of drinking, substyles/brands, etc.
I think the styles of baijiu are finite, at least less infinite than Western grape wines (or beers), of which there may be thousands if not millions of varieties. It's probably closer to single malt whiskeys -- there are probably only about 100 of them being produced anywhere in the world, and they all do taste different and merit their own articles. The more info people can get about these foul-tasting Chinese beverages the better, I think!  ;) Badagnani 04:09, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
As far as maotai jiu, even though it has wheat in it I'd consider it a subcategory (particularly famous brand) of gaoliang jiu. So far we just have both of them under the generic heading of "unflavored white liquor." Badagnani 04:20, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
I am sipping some maotai jiu right now, as we type, as I do from time to time, wondering if it will taste better the next time. It does not. The various flavor elements (read: impurities/probably toxic substances) do not reflect well on this beverage, in my opinion. The "jiugui" is not much better, nor is the bottle of Xinjiang baijiu I also brought home from Beijing. The only similar liquor that is tolerable to me is the Korean "okloju" (jade dew liquor), which has almost a cocoa taste and a bit of sweetness. I don't know what it is about these residual flavors in the Chinese wines but it seems that with the elaborate processes you outline it should taste more natural, somehow, but it definitely has a taste that my subconscious mind tells me, "Stop drinking this now; it could be carcinogenic." Yet the stuff still has a mystique to me. Maybe it's something about the packaging, or the fact that it's so difficult to find here. I've heard that some Chinese liquor producers adulterate their beverages with industrial ethanol, which is not an inspiring thing to hear any more than it is to hear that some producers of Longkou fensi added lead to their noodles to make them more clear. Badagnani 04:32, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
Reflecting on Western vs. Eastern tastes in clear liquors, it's interesting to note that Europeans and Americans prefer their vodkas to be distilled many times (up to 5 or more) to get a perfect neutral taste which sometimes has a bit of sweetness (as in my favorites, Finlandia and Svedka). But the Asian ones have those strong residual tastes. I don't know whether it's a question of the former inability of traditional Asian producers to purge these flavors (no carbon filters), leading to drinkers developing a taste for them (as American beer drinkers developed a taste for the metallic taste imparted by the petroleum distillate that was formerly used to lubricate beer cans, leading some producers to add an artificial flavor when drinkers complained years later that the taste was missing, after producers had ceased to use that lubricant).
Oh, I just remembered that erguotou isn't as bad as some, as far as the "off" flavors go. Badagnani 04:37, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
I didn't know this further distinction between the two distilling processes. Probably, then, Chinese liquors taste similar to early European distilled beverages from hundreds of years ago (or moonshine, which I've tasted in the mountains of Eastern Kentucky and it tasted similar to the Chinese and Thai liquors I've tried. In my experience some vodkas taste "sharper" than others (they feel like they're attacking your tongue and palate), and others are smooth and not as "sharp."
On a side note, my inquiries to experts regarding why rum has that tanginess that other liquors don't have is that there are certain residual volatile chemicals called fusel oils and other chemicals which persist through the distillation. But I also found out that the colorants (often caramel) can also impart a sweetness or molasses taste to the rum. There are a lot of variables. I'd like to see a detailed chemical/spectrographic analysis of some of the Chinese liquors to see exactly what chemicals these flavor components come from, and whether they're all "natural." Badagnani 05:19, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
Jesus, isn't methanol TOXIC? I've also recently read that Barbancourt Haitian rum was banned in Canada due to containing ethyl carbamate. But it's an outstanding rum...
The only vodka distillery in Texas (with the unlikely name of "Tito's") makes some interesting claims on its label, which I think has something to do with what you say about leaving out the "head" and "tail" of the distillate, using only the "heart." Strangely, it's not the smoothest or best tasting, although it should be, from what they say. To me, it tastes fairly "clean" but industrial in a rubbing alcohol, hospital-scent sort of way. See what you make of this:
from http://www.swankmartini.com/vodka_pages/titos.htm:
"Tito's Handmade Vodka is designed to be savored by spirit connoisseurs everywhere. It is micro-distilled in an old-fashioned pot still, just like all those fine single malt scotches and high-end French cognacs. This time-honored method of distillation requires more skill and effort than modern column stills, but it is well worth it. The handcrafted technique offers more control over the distillation process, resulting in a spectacularly clean product of incomparable excellence. Only the heart of the run called "the nectar" is taken, leaving behind residual higher and lower alcohols. The vodka is cleansed of phenols, esters, congeners and organic acids by filtering it through the finest activated carbon available. Tito’s end product is like nothing you’ve ever had before..." Badagnani 05:50, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
I have a bottle of Serbian slivovica which is in a nice round bottle and has a lovely yellow color with a picture of a plum on it, but the flavor is equally intolerable to me as Maotai jiu -- these two must be in the same league. I had had my eye on it for it for some time at the local liquor store and my then-girlfriend bought it for me, I think for my birthday, a few years ago. I was very disappointed that it didn't taste anything like plums the way Calvados tastes like apple or French poire brandy tastes like pears.
The more I read, I think you're right that a lot of the most tantalizing flavors can be hazardous. This is especially true of the umami flavors which have been used in the form of aji-no-moto/weijing in such abandon by Asian chefs in the last 50 years. I'm finding out that a lot of my favorite flavors (including a certain brand of seitan--White Wave) include hidden glutamic acid compounds under names like "natural flavors" or "hydrolized vegetable protein" or "yeast extract" or things like that. They taste great but I don't feel so great a few hours later. Badagnani 06:40, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
I've never had the opportunity to try kirsch. I originally thought it was a cherry liqueur but reading the article I think it must be more like slivovitz, with little trace of the original cherry flavors. Badagnani 06:42, 16 May 2006 (UTC)

Another baijiu classification system?

Does this website represent another classification system for the aromas of baijiu? Badagnani 23:06, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

Yellow/white

OK, I agree with you. Put it how you think it looks best, but somehow the way you had it looked strange. Badagnani 04:18, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

essential oils & flavor chemistry

My first reference is the site I mentioned about cola chemistry -- Notes On Making Cola

A good explanation of beverage stabilizers and the criteria for their use can be found at Food Product Design: Application Notes - October 2000 - Herbs and Flavors for Teas

Also patent texts such as this one are useful for a very precise technical explanation: [3]

Dforest 12:44, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

How/Howe

At Women's studies, and perhaps elsewhere, you changed "Florence Howe" to "Florence How". Given the Florence Howe Award (Google it) this seems very unlikely. Could I ask you to please check into this? At the very least, it suggests that "Florence Howe" is a perfectly acceptable spelling; I'm not sure I see a basis for saying that "Florence How" is. - Jmabel | Talk 16:30, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

Now I remember, I saw the article Florence How and thought that the citation with "Howe" is a typo. Which is the right one or are they two different people? Sjschen 05:27, 7 June 2006 (UTC)
I strongly suspect that "How" is simply an error, but it could be an alternate spelling. The award is "Howe", easily verifed with Google. I think that is where the article on her should be. - Jmabel | Talk 05:32, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

Do you suggest that the article move from "Florence How" to "Florence Howe"? Sjschen 05:36, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

Yes. We know that spelling is correct, and obviously was favored by the people who give the award. The other is at best an alternate spelling. - Jmabel | Talk 05:41, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

Flavour etc.

Hi Sjschen. Thanks for contacting me. I know a little about flavors and fragrances (more about flavors than fragrance) and if I can ever find the time and motivation I may try and expand those entries a little. Of course, I can only really talk in general terms since a lot of what companies in those industries do is quite closely guarded. Wjousts 01:27, 9 June 2006 (UTC)

Shou Wu Chih

Hi, I'm having a bit of confusion at Shou Wu Chih. Can you help with some of the questions I've asked in "discussion"? Badagnani 01:03, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

List of vegetable oils

I've submitted List of vegetable oils for Feature List status. Just thought I'd let you know in case you were interested in registering an opinion, a vote or a suggestion on improving it. --Waitak 14:57, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

Color of huangjiu

Hi, in the Chinese wine article can we change this sentence: "The two main varieties of Chinese wines are fermented wines or "yellow liquor" (黄酒; pinyin: huáng jiǔ), which may be reddish-brown to beige in tone..." -- because mijiu is clear. Or is mijiu not a form of huangjiu? Badagnani 05:25, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

Also, in the Huangjiu article, can you add a sentence about why the term "yellow liquor" is used in the lead paragraph? (And that not all huangjiu is yellow in color.) Badagnani 05:28, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

Doesn't the color also sometimes come from red yeast rice? I don't doubt that caramel is used in the modern day (probably to duplicate the coloring that would ordinarily come from long aging)--but it's probably not a traditional technique. This technique used extensively in production of whisky and rum, and probably also brandy, and apparently can also introduce other flavors (such as sweetness). Such colorings are usually a closely guarded trade secret, though, so it's hard to determine specifics about this. Badagnani 05:35, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

Chinese herbology

Thanks 1,000,000 for helping with Chinese characters at Chinese herbology. Why, though, did you remove most of the characters for 供应野生紫菀提取物? That's the way it appears in every website I looked at. Badagnani 12:46, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

Ha ha! Thanks for that info. Badagnani 18:55, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

Spare ribs

Hey, nobody made an article on this popular food until today! Could you help me out with it? Badagnani 22:49, 12 August 2006 (UTC)

Ear pick

Appreciate your write-up. Just a few suggestions for the future... 1. First tag the article at the top with {{inuse}} if you plan on a major rewrite like that. 2. Then create a new article, either Ear pick/temp or User talk:Sjschen/sandbox or something similar. Then use that until you are done. 3. Use Preview. 4. When done, copy the text back into the main page (without the inuse tag of course). I ask you to do this because it makes it a lot easier for other editors to see the change - right now there are 16 incremental changes that could have been 1 major edit. Thanks! — RevRagnarok Talk Contrib 10:53, 28 August 2006 (UTC)

Mung bean

Excellent organization at mung bean. By the way, I just tried cooking some urad dal (black gram) like mung beans, and they really don't taste as good. Badagnani 03:33, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Manchow soup

Hi, can you add hanzi to Manchow soup? Badagnani 05:19, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Lung fung soup

Could you perhaps add hanzi for Lung fung soup? Badagnani 04:31, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Korean wine made with red koji

Look at this: a Korean wine made with red koji. http://www.soolsool.co.kr/English/product.htm Badagnani 04:41, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

鹵水料

Hi, I want to get your thoughts before beginning a new page on "master sauce" or "master stock" (not sure which to call it). Apparently it's a Chinese sauce/stock made with cassia and other spices. Read this and see what you think. http://www.uni-graz.at/~katzer/engl/Cinn_cas.html The thing is, I think there are other "master stocks" that might not resemble this one. I defer to your expertise as the "master" of Asian soups here. Badagnani 07:56, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

That's fascinating. You do know a lot more than me, so I'll leave it to you to start the stub. But do you think "lu shui" is the best title to use for English Wikipedia (rather than "master sauce" or "master broth"? Your point about the spice website article getting it wrong in that there isn't a specific singular "master sauce" in China is well taken! I wonder, then,, if there's a specific name for the kind with the cinnamon and all the other spices (maybe similar to that used to make Vietnamese pho)? Badagnani 02:25, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

New Chinese template box

Hi, check out the new Chinese template at Template:Chinesename -- an example of how it looks is Five-spice powder. I made it comparable to the Korean boxes, such as at Nokdumuk. Feel free to use it in any articles you make. Badagnani 10:01, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Real ingredients of red pickled doufu

OK, this is a hard one. I'm running out of a jar of red doufu (several years old) and notice that the English ingredients say "BEAN CURD, SALT, CHILI, RED DATE." But the Chinese ingredients say "黃豆, 紅糟, 鹽. Only three ingredients. None of them says hongzao (red jujube) and none of them says chili. The next time you're at the Asian market, could you check the hanzi on the ingredients if you can find the brand made by HWANG RYH SHANG CO., LTD. of Tyo-Yuan, Taiwan? If I knew what 紅糟 meant, maybe I could figure this out. I have a feeling that 紅糟 is some kind of red yeast rice (a by-product of hongjiu production?), but it's been mistranslated as hongzao (red jujube). Badagnani 10:28, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks, I've never tried that dried tofu; I think I've had something like that in the past but it doesn't usually agree with American tastes (even vegetarians!). So does that mean that we can treat the presence of red jujubes in pickled tofu as spurious, based on a mistranslation? I'm the one who first added it to the article, based on that one jar I have. Badagnani 18:34, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

"Red date" (in English) is in the title of the product on the jar ("FERMENT RED DATE BEAN CURD WITH") as well as the ingredients list. I now, after finally going through the Chinese list of ingredients, believe jujube to be false. Badagnani 18:41, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

Should 紅糟 be added to the Red yeast rice article as another Chinese name? I didn't see it there. Badagnani 18:55, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

The way I see it used on the Internet (did you do a Google search) is as a by-product of huangjiu production: sort of like dregs. Perhaps it's not an orthodox way of saying red yeast rice. Look here http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=%22%E7%B4%85%E7%B3%9F%22 and tell me what you think, in context. Badagnani 22:23, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

Here's the Rosetta Stone -- looks like they're the same: http://www.google.com/search?q=cache:3oAao38Q_D0J:www.bytemall.com.tw/red-process1.htm+%22%E7%B4%85%E7%B3%9F%22&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=5 Badagnani 22:24, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

I am still very curious as to what genius at the Huang Ri Xiang company decided to label red yeast rice as "red date." That seems to be a willful misinformation. It seems that despite their famous reputation one or two of their products have been seized by the US FDA for unsanitary conditions. I'm going to buy a new jar and see if they've fixed the labeling; if not, maybe I should write them a letter. Badagnani 22:28, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

Hokkien term? Makes sense! Badagnani 22:29, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

OK, see my fix here: Pickled tofu Badagnani 23:35, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

I've made a fix at Tofu as well. Badagnani 23:40, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

Okay, A-cai at Wiktionary has confirmed that 紅糟 in Taiwan can mean red yeast rice. But I'm still wondering whether 紅糟 might be a by-product of huangjiu production (dregs/sediment), while the normal red yeast rice might be made from rice cultured with the red bacteria, from scratch? Badagnani 07:45, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

The thing is, the articles I looked at translate it as "vinasse." I've never encountered this English word but guess it comes from the root "vin" (wine). What do you make of this? http://www.v-touch.com/menu/menu_chinese_simplified/cn_05_red_vinasse.htm Badagnani 11:53, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Oh, here it is: http://www.bartleby.com/61/41/V0104100.html Badagnani 11:55, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Well, you have greater access to the Chinese sources than I so if you ever take a tour of Huang Ri Xiang maybe you can ask about their trade secrets! Badagnani 12:01, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Hot and sour soup

I notice that Hot and sour soup doesn't mention vinegar. Most English-language online recipes mention that white vinegar is used, but I don't believe distilled white vinegar is a traditional Chinese product. Do you have any idea what is used in the traditional recipe? Light Chinese rice vinegar? Black chinkiang vinegar? Something else? Badagnani 03:33, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Preserved Tofu

Hello,

I've found that you started the above article. I was wondering if you were born in Canada.


Thanks100110100 22:31, 7 November 2006 (UTC)

Cool! How did you learn the stuff bout the preserved tofu?100110100 07:59, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

Article about Wikipedia Users

Hello,

Wikipedia user David Badagnani directed me to your user page. I am a freelance writer working on an article about the wide array of people who make Wikipedia their life, their passion, their pastime. Wikipedia “addicts” if you will. I’m looking for people just willing to tell their story of how they got sucked into the intellectual whirlwind that is Wikipedia; how you got started editing, how the obsession grew, and what you spend your time focusing on these days? Do you write articles from scratch? Is your main push toward one particular type of article? Do you patrol for typos and errors, or spend your time diligently fixing vandalism? Do you take part in the “social aspects” of Wikipedia; engaging in animated discussions or decorating your user page with all sorts of internet memes? Have you ever forced yourself to take a “Wikipedia break”? If so, what’s your 20/20 hindsight on the obsession? Basically I’m just trying to get an idea of what it’s like for various Wikipedia “addicts.” If you are interested in participating, please email me at brianwrites@gmail.com

If anybody else, other than this user is interested in participating, feel free to email me as well. This article is intended to be a light informational piece, nothing too heavy or controversial, just merely introducing readers to a subculture that they likely had no idea existed. So please don’t email me with your conspiracy theories, or your grudge against the Wikipedia hierarchy… unless it directly applies to your overall experience with the site. This article is about the USERS, not about the pros and cons of the site itself.

Thanks,

Brian68.39.158.205 01:32, 11 November 2006 (UTC)

Pu-erh

That pu-erh article is so long that it almost killed me! I hope you don't mind that I gave your username to this writer from California who is putting together an article about Wikipedians. Could be interesting. I gave him names of about 10 editors who I think are the best ones. Badagnani 08:06, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

I can't even say I enjoy pu-erh much, from the pu-erh I've had in Cantonese restaurants. They boil it so much you can't even taste or smell the tea, even though it looks dark in color. Maybe I just need to try some good pu-erh.

Watch out for the heavy image deletion campaign that's coming around. I've had my hands full trying to defend our fair use of promotional images of Chinese and Korean wines. As if any of those companies would come running demanding that we take the photos of their wines down.

Tuvan throat singers (Chirgilchin) come to town tomorrow night! Badagnani 08:08, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

Weren't bolay, bonay, etc. given as alternate names in the article? I can't find it now and those are important names. These could be added in the box up top right. The thing is, the Cantonese reading at Wikipedia for "erh" is "yi" so I don't know where they get "lay" or "nay" out of it. Badagnani 08:21, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

Good question. I have no idea how he found me. He originally apparently wrote to about 20 Wikipedians' user pages (most seem to have been not serious editors except for Gamaliel, who has edited some pages I've worked on). He said he'd gotten bad responses, mostly people who were angry at something or who had some problem with Wikipedia, and he said he wants an interesting article about the people who edit here, not a negative piece. Since he said it was to be a lighthearted piece I emailed him directly as he'd asked and made sure it wasn't going to be a jokey piece at the expense of Wikipedians (i.e. in the style of the Borat film) and he assured me it would not. He doesn't have a publisher yet but wants to write the piece then try to sell it to some outlet. So I sent him the names of a few editors whose work I respect who might give interesting responses. Badagnani 08:24, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

What do you mean by this?: bolay and bonay are now bolay tea and bonay tea I think the "bolay" and "bonay" names should be explained and put in a more prominent spot of the article, probably up top. That's what they often call it in English on the boxes, and in Cantonese-run restaurants in North America. Badagnani 22:47, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

There are a lot of spelling/hyphenation/spacing variations. http://www.foojoytea.com/specialt.html Badagnani 23:00, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

Can you add this: "Whenever I go to have dim sum, I usually order "guk bo", which is a combination of chrysanthemum ("guk fa") tea and "bo lay" tea." Badagnani 23:02, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

I'll try it, thanks for the recommendations. Foojoy seems crappy to me, like a very low grade but is widely available. The teas (not just pu-erh) that come in the PRC-produced tea tins seem even worse (full of twigs, etc).

I've just put in some more redirects: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/Badagnani

To your knowledge, is pu-erh tea, though produced in Yunnan, most popular in Cantonese culture? That was always my impression. This could be added to the top paragraph as well. Badagnani 23:24, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

Guk bo / Ju pu

If the section deals with Cantonese flower/pu-erh mixtures, why add the pinyin? Perhaps the Cantonese pronunciation should come first, then the pinyin in parentheses with the hanzi. Badagnani 00:13, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

Cantonese pronunciations

Interesting: http://www.cantonese.sheik.co.uk/phorum/read.php?14,56185 Badagnani 00:18, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

Relationship of pu-erh tea to Yunnan black

Hi, could you develop at Dian Hong tea about the relationship of that tea to pu-erh tea? Badagnani 02:01, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

Capitalization of Dian Hong and Orange Pekoe

Nice work at Dian Hong tea and Orange Pekoe tea. Is there any reason for either of these to have the second word capitalized? Badagnani 05:17, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

I think maybe "Dian" should remain capitalized as it's the name of a place. Although we don't capitalize "hamburger" or "frankfurter"... Badagnani 05:41, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

Oh, I've changed orange pekoe. It isn't a proper noun and doesn't refer to a place or person, so I think it should be small. Probably in marketing publicity it's capitalized to give it more clout. Badagnani 06:00, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

Wolfberry

My friends in China told me people *never* eat them hand to mouth like you're describing. I used to do this (as western marketers recommend it) but got worried when I was told this. Apparently fats bring out some of the important nutrients so maybe boiling wolfberries with the package of other herbs in chicken soup has some validity western science is only now catching up to. Badagnani 05:21, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

My friend was so emphatic about them never being eaten "as is" got me worried that there was indeed something wrong with doing that, but then again maybe it's just the Chinese cultural bias against raw vegetables in general (I guess for fear of contamination). Probably some foods are better cooked and others better uncooked. I'm not a raw fooder, though!  :) Badagnani 06:29, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

New Chinese surname categories up for deletion

A new editor has just added a number of categories for Chinese surnames, which I believe to be very useful, particularly in grouping individuals who share a common surname but use different romanizations. As is usually the case at the Categories for Deletion area, the people who frequent that place generally try to delete every new category, regardless of whether they understand its use. In this case, they seem not to understand the utility of being able to have a category for everyone with the name "Liu," for example. Please voice your opinion here. Badagnani 04:27, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

Thanks! Just one thing, it's the individual East Asian surname categories, not articles, that are up for deletion. Such as Category:Chén (陳) (surname). Badagnani 06:30, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

Pork

Ha ha! I just edit through Internet Explorer. I haven't heard of any other way. Badagnani 06:46, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, voice (or thought) activation would be nice. Badagnani 06:55, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

Into what, the world of computer geeks? I know just enough to get by, I guess. Working here one gets an education. Just like Americans are always marveling at how wonderful they think their Constitution is, I think the Wiki software is just beautifully designed. Working with HTML, WS-FTP and all that on regular websites, Wiki makes it so incredibly easy to do nearly everything. So I say "Bravo" to the programmers who thought it up. Badagnani 07:09, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, good points, though I always worry that all our work is going to be put toward some kind of for-profit thing in the future (like this Version 1.0 CD-ROM project or whatever they're calling it). Regarding politics, I have a friend at law school at Renmin University and they're making her take classes in the "Three Represents" and the "Two Develops for the Greatness of the Nation" and all these self-serving yet half-baked political philosophies that all the supreme leaders feel they have to invent in order to measure up to their predecessors. I hate to get them in trouble by telling them it's all a bunch of nonsense. Badagnani 07:20, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

Tonic soup

Hi, you know the herbal "tonic" soup Chinese make from chicken or pork, plus gouqizi, shanyao, dangshen, huangqi, ginger, etc.? Do we have an article about that? You can buy the pre-packaged mix of dried Chinese herbs in the Asian market, then you have to boil it with your selected meat. I just read that such a soup is called yangshengtang but I'm not sure that's true. Can you help make an article about this kind of soup? Badagnani 08:42, 24 November 2006 (UTC)

Maybe "nurse health." I don't know if it's a correct name. I'm just interested in this general type of medicinal soup. I see this mixture of dry herbs in the grocery store all the time and think it's very popular among Chinese everywhere. Badagnani 21:03, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

Does the photo at the left give the name of this soup or herbal mixture?[4] Badagnani 09:55, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks, well, astragalus would only be one of 7 or 8+ herbal ingredients in that kind of soup. What do other Chinese people you know call 1) the finished soup, and 2) the package of herbal mixture? What is the name given on the package in the Asian market? Just curious (as usual). We're often the first ones to document these things on the Internet in English. You might notice the "Tibetan/Himalayan Goji Berry" section in the Wolfberry article, which I contributed to. Badagnani 20:50, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

When you say you looked around, does that mean you looked at some of these herbal mixtures in the Asian grocery store? I can do that but it's an hour's drive for me so I'm not over there more than a couple of times a month. Just look for the one with the dried chalky looking slices of white yam, wolfberries, licorice root, I think there's some dongguai in there, that kind of thing. I just want to see how it's called. The fact that yangshengtang seems so scarce on a Google search in Chinese isn't a good sign that this is the most common term for it. Badagnani 00:59, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Wolfberry

The berry is mainly produced in Ningxia and neighboring regions. Some quack doctor/marketer with great PR starts calling it "Himalayan," probably because nobody ever heard of Ningxia let alone can pronounce it, and the ball starts rolling. Mindell even says it's from the Tian Shan but nobody knows where that is either, so the exotic and mystical Himalayas will do, because who's going to check? More PR people start claiming it actually comes from Tibet but Ningxia is near Inner Mongolia so the American PR idiots with no geography knowledge start saying it's from "the Tibetan and Mongolian Himalayas," "from valleys that have never known chemicals." Hey, Ningxia is sorta halfway between Mongolia and Tibet and nobody's heard of Ningxia so it's fine to say it's from "Tibet and Mongolia," right? In a word: a mess. Badagnani 22:51, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Liu An tea

Hi, I notice there's no article for Liu An tea. It's advertised at http://www.houdeasianart.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1_43 but I'm not sure if it's a brand name or a style of tea. I'm going to order some of the pu-erh you recommended. There are so many varieties available (and at such high prices!) at that website it's mind-bending. But I'm sure they're all much better than supermarket (and Asian market) varieties. Badagnani 05:48, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Long An tea

How about Long An tea? I don't see an article for that one either. Badagnani 06:16, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

FoShou

What is your impression of this tea? I'm thinking of trying it. Badagnani 06:19, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Pu-erh/tea bricks

Thanks for the additional recommendations. A friend from Beijing just emailed me this about pu-erh tea:

It's so popular here now and becomes the recommand tea for goverment ,you know ,tea itself could avoid the body to absorb the fat,people now in the offices always don't take sports and have lots of high energy's food,they think it could be make them more heathy.I like green tea better,although it 's very ordinary and not so dear.Some Pu er is very expensive, you may have special tool to cut them down from the "brick",I once saw from my classmate who from Yunnan.

I didn't realize how popular it was in Beijing. I don't know what she means by recommended for government, whether that means that the government recommends that its citizens drink it, or whether government employees like to buy it to drink on the job. What is this tool she's referring to? I don't see that mentioned in the tea brick or pu-erh tea articles. Badagnani 08:35, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Gunpowder tea

Gunpowder tea needs the hanzi for gang pao de -- do you know it? Badagnani 22:24, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Will the real gunpowder please stand up?

Well, how can we determine what "real" gunpowder is? Does the PRC have something like a denomination, like Cognac, Champagne, or Balsamic Vinegar of Modena? If not, I'd guess the situation is similar to Dragonwell tea, in that it's supposed to be from a single province but other provinces produce it and fraudulently purport it to be from that province. Probably the vast majority of gunpowder tea marketed under the "Temple of Heaven" and similar brands are produced in a single area, though. Who would know this info? Badagnani 22:03, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

OK, I did some research. Gunpowder tea is a specialty of a few counties in Zhejiang, you're right. But, like many mainland teas, since the 19th century the Taiwanese have begun producing it as well ("Formosa gunpowder"). So there's at least the Zhejiang one and the Taiwanese version. This site says that it's a large souchong leaf that's used. Badagnani 22:26, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

This site has some definitions of "gun" and "gunpowder" and this one has a mid-19th century article that mentions gunpowder tea. Badagnani 22:30, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

I'm headed out for some Indian food now, but there's some good info here. This site has some good background on the marketing of gunpowder tea, this one describes black gunpowder tea, and this one mentions Sri Lankan and Javanese gunpowder]! This should help expand the article. Badagnani 22:36, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

One more: this page lists some other producing provinces. Not sure how widely distributed these are, or whether the Zhejiang manufacturers buy from these other provinces if demand is high, then market it as produce of Zhejiang. I wouldn't be surprised, though. Badagnani 22:38, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Are you of a similar opinion as I in that "gang pao de" is 99% sure to be a fanciful folk etymology?

Also, are you saying that the tea leaves in the red bags is being turned into "pearls" in a collective manner, by shaking the bags? I would have imagined that the leaves would be individually turned around a spindle or something, but this makes sense. But the question is how does it get so shiny? I just looked at some and the individual pellets do appear almost buffed to a glossy finish. Badagnani 19:24, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

When hydrated, there's no stem projecting past the leaf itself but the vein within the leaf is visible (a light green color) for about 1/3 to 1/2 its length). The leaf itself is medium green, finely textured and just over 3 cm in length. Badagnani 08:47, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Maple syrup

Funny about maple syrup being marketed as an exotic tonic. I suppose sugar maples could be grown in China, though, and maple syrup produced if they felt like getting into it. Birch syrup is also marketed overseas in such a way, but I don't know if the mineral content of either is that significant to warrant the claims. Badagnani 23:05, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Bak kut teh

Holy crap -- the recipe for this broth is almost the same as Vietnamese pho! Do you think there's a relationship? Pho is made from beef bones, plus ginger, star anise, cloves, cinnamon, and I think also garlic. Sounds almost the same -- like the difference between Jajangmyeon and Zhajiangmian! Badagnani 01:24, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Well, I meant that the "fingerprint" for the broth of the "pork rib tea" (which I'd never heard of before, sounds like Min Nan language) is essentially the same as for pho. Maybe, then, this is something originally of Fujian/Chaozhou origin that spread down to Vietnam. It would be conditional, of course, on ready access to star anise, cloves, and cinnamon, and cinnamon is indeed grown in northern Vietnam. Vietnam seems to have acquired a taste for beef since the coming of the French (as water buffalo and oxen are valuable animals needed for farm work); before that probably pork was "king of the rou." It may turn out that the broth for both the pork rib tea and pho has a "common ancestor." Badagnani 01:38, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Archiving talk

BTW do you need help figuring out how to archive your talk page? Badagnani 01:24, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Probably when your talk page gets as long as it is now, it's good to archive. It took me a while to figure out how to archive my own talk page the first time I did it, but someone helped me do it. That saves bandwidth, too, as each time it's modified the old text gets saved again as well. Badagnani 01:39, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

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