User talk:Abraham, B.S./Archive 11

Commander Australian Fleet

I don't think a separate article for Commodore, Flotillas (COMFLOT), is really required, but what do you think of mentioning him in the article as the designate seagoing battlegroup commander? Buckshot06 (talk) 06:26, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Hmm, sounds like a fair idea, the only problem is trying to dig up any sources! Will have a poke around to see if I can spot anything. :) Cheers, Abraham, B.S. (talk) 06:53, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

I had a look though the RAN website, but couldn't find anything relevant. Do you, by any chance, have any sources on this? Cheers, Abraham, B.S. (talk) 00:51, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

You really have to run 'COMFLOT' through Google repeatedly. COMFLOT took the first deployment to the Gulf (I), and then succeeding deployments were led by captains. He ought to have been CFMCC INTERFET as well (http://www.defence.gov.au/adc/Cdclms/Command%20evolution.doc and http://www.defence.gov.au/news/NAVYNEWS/EDITIONS/2000/03_06_00/story01.htm), and there are sources around giving task group numbers etc. Buckshot06 (talk) 07:57, 3 February 2010 (UTC)

No worries. I'm working on the Iraqi Army right now, so will put it on the long-term to do list. Buckshot06 (talk) 05:03, 7 February 2010 (UTC)

award confusion

no problem! I saw it twice, and realized once from you and once from Roger, and figured, okay, signals at the best of times can get crossed.  :) I figured it would eventually disappear. cheers! Auntieruth55 (talk) 00:41, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

Lol, sorry about that, and the good nature you took it in. ;-) Cheers, Abraham, B.S. (talk) 00:44, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

The Military history WikiProject Newsletter : XLVI (December 2009)

The Military history WikiProject Newsletter Issue XLVI (December 2009)
From the coordinators Happy New Year to all! I shall take this opportunity to reflect upon the past year. In 2009 our project grew impressively, adding nearly 100 new featured articles and doubling the total number of featured lists. Overall the total number of articles within our scope surpassed 95,000 in 2009, and if these numbers hold steady we will surpass 100,000 articles in 2010. Thank you all for your outstanding efforts. We are currently working on several proposals to improve the project for 2010. These include bringing the Milhist Academy up to full operational status, as well as spicing up and streamlining the task force structure. Also, any help you can offer to clear the current backlog of Military History good article nominations would be appreciated. For the Coordinators, TomStar81 (Talk) 11:10, 26 December 2009 (UTC)	Articles of note New featured articles: Battle of Morotai Castle North Carolina class battleship Xa Loi Pagoda raids New featured lists: List of Brigade of Gurkhas recipients of the Victoria Cross List of World War I aces credited with more than 20 victories New featured pictures: After the War a Medal and Maybe a Job Lincoln assassination conspirators execution National Fund for the Welsh Troops USS Annapolis in the Arctic Yiddish World War I poster New A-Class articles: Battle of Bita Paka Battle of Ostrach Charles Eaton (RAAF officer) Design A-150 battleship Dutch 1913 battleship proposal Helmut Lent Henry Wrigley James Harold Cannan James Whiteside McCay Lebaudy Patrie Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-3 Thomas Baker (aviator)
Project news The Henry Allingham World War I contest has entered its second phase with the following users qualifing: Abraham, B.S., Backslash Forwardslash,Carcharoth, Dana boomer, Durova, Eurocopter, Hawkeye7, Ian Rose, Labattblueboy, Redmarkviolinist, Sturmvogel 66 and XavierGreen. Coordinator Emeritus Kirill Lokshin has been re-elected to the Arbitration Committee for a two-year term in the 2009 elections. Kirill is one of four present or former coordinators of the project to be appointed to the Arbitration Committee; he was originally elected to a three-year term in 2007. The others are YellowMonkey (2007–2008), FayssalF (2008–2010), and Roger Davies (2009–2011). The Contest Department has completed its thirty-second month of competition; and its fourth month under the new scoring system. A total of 45 articles were entered by seven editors. Sturmvogel 66 came first with 82 points, followed by Auntieruth55 with 74 points. They receive the Chevrons and Writer's Barnstar respectively. Honorable mentions go to Ian Rose (51), Abraham, B.S. (21) and Parsecboy (16). Ed! and Binksternet also fielded entries. Please submit any articles you are working on for the January contest.
Awards and honours The WikiChevrons with Oak Leaves has been awarded to Auntieruth55 in recognition of her excellent work on three featured articles, detailed A-Class reviews, high levels of participation, and for always helping other contributors. She also receives the A-Class medal for her work on Hermann Detzner, Cologne War and Battle of Ostrach. MisterBee1966 receives the A-Class medal for his work on Egmont Prinz zur Lippe-Weißenfeld, List of Knight's Cross with Oak Leaves, Swords or Diamonds recipients of the Waffen-SS and Helmut Lent. Hawkeye7 and Ian Rose both receive A-Class medals with Oak Leaves for their work on Iven Giffard Mackay, James Harold Cannan and James Whiteside McCay, and on Frederick Scherger, Henry Wrigley and Charles Eaton (RAAF officer) respectively.
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grammar

Thank you. That is MUCH better than either of the predecessors. Pdfpdf (talk) 03:27, 3 January 2010 (UTC)
"the gramma was fine" - No, the grammar was incorrect.
"and the wording better" - Irrelevant POV.
"a significant proportion of bios/publications use similar wording." - Relevance? - A significant portion of the population use the phrases "youse guys" and "your wrong". However, that grammar is also incorrect. Pdfpdf (talk) 03:27, 3 January 2010 (UTC)
P.S. Happy New Year to you, too. Pdfpdf (talk) 03:27, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

Mmmmmmm. I prefer "later had", but at least it's not incorrect grammar. Another alternative you may prefer is "went on to have"? Pdfpdf (talk) And another: "subsequently had". Pdfpdf (talk) 04:04, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

Re:Contest points

Happy New Year to you as well! The article improvement contribution for that article has been started (by yourself) at the level of stub class and has been promoted till A-Class during the first round. In the second round the article has been promoted from A to FA and according to Article Creation and Improvement Points table you get 18 more points for this. If all this happened in a single round, the points awarded for this contributions would raise from 27 points (to A) to 45 points (to FA). All the best, --Eurocopter (talk) 12:10, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

Well mate, this doesn't seem quite fair to me considering that I've checked the edit history of the article and it seemed that you did not make any major improvements during this round (only few tweaks). In my opinion the Article Improvement chart system should be applied throughout the contest and not only for individual rounds (plus I can assure you that the rule will apply for everybody in the same manner). If you don't agree with this feel free to start a new thread on the contest main talk page and we shall do as the majority of participants desire. --Eurocopter (talk) 12:45, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

You should have no worries and be confident that I'll double check any article improvement submissions and the system will be applied consistently to anyone. However, if you find any mistakes keep noticing me. Cheers, --Eurocopter (talk) 14:13, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

Richard Minifie

Heh, great minds... Richard Minifie was on my list of WWI aces but I hadn't made any start, the first two in my sights were in any case Edgar McCloughry and Alexander Pentland unless you were particularly keen on doing them (there's still Edgar Johnston of the +20 Australians but of course we can negotiate)... ;-) Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 10:41, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

Lol, I did notice that we both seemed to be working through the list of Australian flying aces of the First World War. ;-) You're welcome to McCloughry and Pentland, the former of which seems to be completely up your ally being an AVM and all. In regards to Johnston, I'll just put my gloves on while you can ring the bell ... just kidding. :) I was thinking of possibly working on Cedric Howell soon, if you have no vested interest or were keen on working on it yourself, that is? Cheers, Abraham, B.S. (talk) 11:07, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

WWI Contest review

Hi mate, is there any chance that you'll have some free time to review Horses in World War I GAN? Is one of the few articles of considerable importance to be promoted during this contest. Cheers, --Eurocopter (talk) 19:05, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

Military Historian of the Year - 2009

		2009 "Military historian of the Year"
		By order of the Members of the Military History WikiProject, for "great bios" and being an "all-round active participant/reviewer", I award you this Golden Wiki. -- TomStar81 (Talk) 09:29, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

Thanks Tom! This is such an unexpected honour, and I extend my deep gratitute to all those who voted for me. :)) Cheers, Abraham, B.S. (talk) 09:57, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

Congratulations! Nick-D (talk) 09:59, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, Nick! And congratulations to you as well! Abraham, B.S. (talk) 10:02, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

It was a pleasure to vote for you.  :) Auntieruth55 (talk) 22:34, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, Ruth! It was indeed a pleasure to vote for yourself as well. :) Cheers, Abraham, B.S. (talk) 00:41, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

Your review of list of Knight's Cross with Oak Leaves recipients

Thanks for your review comments! If possible could you have a second look and let me know if this is progressing in the right direction. Thanks MisterBee1966 (talk) 18:46, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

I made the merge you suggested. It has a caveat now that I can't cope with at the moment (see A-Class review page). Please have a look. Thanks MisterBee1966 (talk) 16:50, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Andrew Cowper

On January 10, 2010, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Andrew Cowper, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check ) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 00:00, 10 January 2010 (UTC)

Howell

In fact prior to 1943 (or thereabouts) you had to have been mentioned before you were eligible for the DSO, so he must have been mentioend at least one. His RAF service record is online-I'll try to have a look next week that should mention all his honours (although it might not if he got it before the formation of the RAF - have you tried his Aussie service record?) - they normally give a date for the Gazette as well. Although forum posts aren't reliable sources you might find http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=139769 interesting, and it will maybe point you toward a few more sources. David Underdown (talk) 10:33, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

Bingo, thanks tot he service record I was able to track down http://www.london-gazette.co.uk/issues/31106/supplements/287 (6 January 1919). If you look back to the first page of this supplement you'll see the actual despatch is dated 26 October 1918, before the DSO, but I can't quite work out how best to explain this in the article - we know the Mention and DSO must be for the same thing, but citing that might be tricky. You may find the rest of the record will help you a bit, so drop me a line if you want a copy. David Underdown (talk) 14:25, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

Drop me an email, and I should be able to send the record over by the end of tomorrow. David Underdown (talk) 15:12, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

Villers-Bocage

I have only just got around to really working through the points you raised and addressing them. Thanks for the review!--EnigmaMcmxc (talk) 11:41, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the comments, the only thing that comes to mind that needs to be clairfied is the emdashe bit you raised in your planning subsection of the review; cant for the live of me find anything remotely like that lol!--EnigmaMcmxc (talk) 12:07, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

Thanks allot bud!--EnigmaMcmxc (talk) 12:16, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Cedric Howell

On January 19, 2010, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Cedric Howell, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check ) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 18:00, 19 January 2010 (UTC)

Fred Birks

FYI. Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 15:01, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Cheers, Abraham, B.S. (talk) 03:58, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

Horses in WW1

Would you still like to review Horses in World War I? I'd rather step down and take down "my" review (say, to article talk page) - busy in RL. NVO (talk) 17:35, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

Hi Abraham. I am the main editor of the Horses in WWI article, and I just saw your reply to this request on NVOs talk page. If you have not already dropped a note to the other reviewer you mentioned, would you be willing to do that? NVO has (obviously) stepped down from the review, and it would be nice to get it moving again! Thanks in advance for you help. Dana boomer (talk) 16:53, 28 January 2010 (UTC)

A belated thanks for the note to Eurocopter. At this point I'm just hoping I can get this article to GA status at all, much less within the contest period :) Thanks again for your help, Dana boomer (talk) 00:42, 2 February 2010 (UTC)

Self assessments

No problem, to be honest I didn't realize it was that big of a deal for the B class and below to self assess but I will be more mindful of that in the future. Here is a bit of a quandry though, I have recently been going through and cleaning up some of the assessments for the Medal of Honor recipients because there are a lot with problems (there were a lot that said stub that I made start and several that were at B that I downgraded to Start, etc). Since I am an active editor in ALL of the Medal of Honor recipients, that was probably inappropriate. If you find one that does not appear to rate B just let me know what its missing and I will see if I can get it up to speed. If your interested I have been building a couple pages to track the statuses of the Medal of Honor recipients (so its easier to work on them and get them promoted as well as add the ones that are missing) Here are the American Civil War recipients and Here are the rest (Not quite done here yet but I should be in the next week or so. I have also added notes to some of them that I plan to work on to get them to the next level. I also wanted to suggest something, I know that the milhist project doesn't use the C class but I think we really should. I have found quite a few that are assessed as start that to me are really much more than start, but also arent quite B. Here is one example Zenas Bliss--Kumioko (talk) 05:42, 24 January 2010 (UTC)

Thanks again, I doubt you'll find too many that don't have me as the primary editor but I will submit them to that link you gave me. If it becomes a major issue I will withdraw from the contest, the contest really isn't that big of a deal to me anyway and with the activity of some of the contetants, yourself included, its unlikely I will ever win anyway. To be honest I entered it more to increase the visibility of the articles that I edit more then me getting credit for editing it. In regards to the assessments I have made, by all means if someone feels that one of the articles doesn't meet the qualifications please remove it. --Kumioko (talk) 07:09, 24 January 2010 (UTC)

Yet another one of these for you

		The Military history A-Class medal with oak leaves
		For prolific work on – Walter Peeler, Thomas Baker (aviator) and Cedric Howell – promoted to A-Class between November 2009 and January 2010, by order of the coordinators of the Military history WikiProject, you are hereby awarded the A-Class medal with Oak Leaves. -MBK004 03:53, 26 January 2010 (UTC)

Thanks! Abraham, B.S. (talk) 05:07, 26 January 2010 (UTC)

WT:FAC

You might want to check the proposal there. One of the provisions there would restrict you, and me too. YellowMonkey (bananabucket) 04:20, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the notice, mate. Some them were just silly, crackpot ideas. Cheers, Abraham, B.S. (talk) 04:32, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

Seems to have provoked a flurry at some entries at WP:AWNB/A, so it was a good thing I guess for those articles YellowMonkey (bananabucket!) 06:42, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

Hughes

I've been a away this week, I'll try to take a look next week. Tracking down the AFC recommendation probably falls over the line into OR. The documetns are (I believe) in existence and open to the public, but they're not indexed by name or anything, simply filed in batches according to when they were submitted, and organised by the RAF/RFC wing or brigade the squadron came under, so it would take quite a bit of hunting. The service records seem to simply record the Gazette date and page number. David Underdown (talk) 14:47, 31 January 2010 (UTC)

Thomas Baker

		Four Award
		Congratulations! You have been awarded the Four Award for your work all through on Thomas Baker (aviator).

Thanks! Abraham, B.S. (talk) 09:51, 6 February 2010 (UTC)

Display of military ribbons in articles

You recently voiced disapproval with displaying military images (such as I did with Smedley Butler) and referred to them as imaeg cruft. I have an alternate possibility, and although I personally do not agree this might be an accesptable alternative that is more encyclopedic. If you look at the article for Ross A. McGinnis the ribbons and badges are displayed in a table vice a visual display. What is your opinion on this? --Kumioko (talk) 14:32, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

The Military history WikiProject Newsletter : XLVII (January 2010)

The Military history WikiProject Newsletter Issue XLVII (January 2010)
From the coordinators It's only a month into the New Year, and we've already made changes to the project's infrastructure, merging and improving several task forces (see below). Much content within the project's scope has also been improved: eleven new featured articles, two featured lists, two featured pictures, a featured sound, and seventeen A-class articles. Thanks and congratulations to all editors who contributed and/or nominated these items. In other news, the elections for new project coordinators are coming up in March. Think about whether you would like to run or not, and self-nominations will be coming up at the beginning of next month. Lastly, our project's A-class review process is desperately in need of new reviewers. Please consider looking at least one and leaving comments, no matter how small or trivial. It will be greatly appreciated by the article's nominator(s). For the coordinators, —Ed (talk • majestic titan) 03:32, 3 February 2010 (UTC)	Articles of note New featured articles: Battle of the Nile Bodiam Castle Charles Eaton (RAAF officer) Frederick Scherger Helmut Lent James Whiteside McCay Johann von Klenau Peter Heywood The Battle of Alexander at Issus Thomas Baker (aviator) Walter Peeler New featured lists: List of Asian American Medal of Honor recipients Order of battle at the Battle of the Nile New featured pictures: Return of the Great White Fleet SMS Moltke (1910) New featured sounds: It's a Long Way to Tipperary New A-Class articles: Alexander Pentland Battle of Osan Battle of Winterthur (1799) Cedric Howell CFM International CFM56 Florida class battleship Friedrich Freiherr von Hotze HMS Lion (1910) List of battlecruisers of Germany‎ List of Knight's Cross with Oak Leaves recipients: 1940–1941 Max-Hellmuth Ostermann Operation Windsor Petlyakov Pe-8 Robert Peverell Hichens Smedley Butler USS Hawaii (CB-3) Vernon Sturdee
Project news Congratulations go to Abraham, B.S., Nick-D, and Durova, who placed 1st, 2nd, and 3rd, respectively, in our annual Military Historian of the Year contest! Thanks to all who voted, and congratulations to our runners up: Auntieruth55, BilCat, Hawkeye7, Ian Rose, MBK004, MinisterForBadTimes, Parsecboy, Sturmvogel 66, and The ed17. Our thanks go to all editors who participated in our recent task force housekeeping discussion and to EyeSerene who implemented the technical side of the approved changes. The new line up is as follows: The Military science and the Military technology and engineering task forces have been merged to form the Military science and technology task force. The Indian and Pakistani task forces have been merged, and re-scoped, to form the South Asian military history task force. The Taiwanese task force has been merged into the Chinese military history task force. The Lebanese task force has been merged into the Middle Eastern military history task force. The Romanian task force has been merged into the Balkan military history task force.
Contest department The Contest Department has completed its thirty-third month of competition; and its fifth month under the new scoring system. A total of 91 articles were entered by ten editors. Sturmvogel 66 came first with 152 points, followed by Kumioko with 98 points. They receive the Chevrons and Writer's Barnstar respectively. Honorable mentions go to Auntieruth55 (87), Abraham, B.S. (48), Parsecboy (41), and Ian Rose (41). Binksternet, Radeksz, Ed! and D2306 also fielded entries. Please submit any articles you are working on for the February contest.
Awards and honours The A-Class medal has been awarded to: Auntieruth55 for her work on Johann von Klenau, Friedrich Freiherr von Hotze and Battle of Winterthur (1799). Sturmvogel 66 for his work on Sd.Kfz. 10, Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-3 and Petlyakov Pe-8. The_ed17 for his work on Design A-150 battleship, Dutch 1913 battleship proposal and USS Hawaii (CB-3). The A-Class medal with Oak Leaves has been awarded to: Abraham, B.S. for his work on Walter Peeler, Thomas Baker (aviator) and Cedric Howell. Parsecboy for his work on SMS Nassau, Florida class battleship and List of battlecruisers of Germany.
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Ribbon debate

Thanks for the return comment and it seems as though well just have to agree to disagree on this one. On the OR issue, I can add references to the ribbons, thats not a problem. --Kumioko (talk) 03:52, 7 February 2010 (UTC)

Possible A class list

I was thinking about submitting a couple of the Medal of Honor lists for A class, but I wanted to ask for your advice first. There are three that I think are ok for A class that don't meet the criteria for featured yet.

1. ) The main list List of Medal of Honor recipients is the first. I think it generally meets the criteria for A class but since it contains a number of forks for I wasn't sure if it would qualify.
2. ) The second is List of Medal of Honor recipients for the Spanish–American War. This one needs a bunch of articles created but I think it probably meets A class.
3. ) The last is the List of Medal of Honor recipients during peacetime. I need to expand the lead but other than that I think its A class.

Could I get your advice on these three before I submit them. --Kumioko (talk) 01:17, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

Its bery helpful thanks. You should see the first of the three in the next couple days. Also, if you are interested the List for the Boxer rebellion recipients and Vietnam war recipients are in FLC review know. The hispanic recipients list will likely be next up. --Kumioko (talk) 01:52, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

Urgent

Hello, Abraham, B.S.. You have new messages at Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Military_history/Coordinators#Major_milmos_incident.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

TomStar81 (Talk) 06:39, 12 February 2010 (UTC)

Congratulations

You are one of the six editors advancing into the final round of the Henry Allingham World War I Contest. The final round started at 00:00, 11 February and ends 23:59, 10 March. The top three ranked players at the end of this round will become winners of the contest and receive special prizes! Keep up the good work! --Eurocopter (talk) 12:20, 12 February 2010 (UTC)

John S. Loisel ACR

I think I've addressed most of the issues, with one remaining question on awards.

Max-Hellmuth Ostermann has a similar awards section, without the images. I would like to keep this section if possible. Part of the problem is the references that I have on his awards are in summary form, without the citations or orders. I have requested information from the military, but I'm afraid that his records may have been destroyed along with thousands of others in the St. Louis fire in 1973.

I appreciate your help and comments on this. (GregJackP (talk) 20:52, 15 February 2010 (UTC))