Talk:List of Mughal empresses
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Question/suggestion[edit]
Some of the women in this article died before their husband succeeded to the throne and thus were never Empresses.
So is it okay to keep them here? I think this would be misleading to categories them as Empresses.
It probably would be better to change the title of the article or removed the ones who died.
Also one more thing, Queen consort of Samarkand and Fergahana Valley as well as Queen consort of Kabul are redirected here. While Kabul was indeed part of Mughal Empire, Samarkand and Fergahana valley were lost before it's establishment, thus weren't part of it. So is the redirection valid?
Also two of Babur's Queen were only Queen of Kabul but not Empress of Mughal Empire as they died long before the establishment of Mughal empire.
Manavati (talk) 18:55, 29 March 2022 (UTC)
- A user gave a suggestion to us a way to point out the ones who weren't actually Mughal Empresses instead of removing them.
Keeping this suggestion in mind, I have a suggestion to put forward - Can we create a table and color code Mughal Empresses to distinguish them from the one who weren't Empresses of Mughal Empire?
Manavati (talk) 12:15, 1 April 2022 (UTC)- I agree with Manavati that the name of the page itself seems somewhat misleading. My main question is: what is an Empress? Is it only the primary wife of the ruling emperor? Is it any consort of an emperor? Would it be better to have, say a "list of Mughal imperial consorts" and then indicated which ones were emperors vs concubines vs secondary/tertiary wives? Also, a page like List of Ottoman imperial consorts might give a good idea of a format that has been used and works. -Evansknight (talk) 16:48, 1 April 2022 (UTC)
- The Mughals don't seem to differentiate explicitly between legal wives (all legal wives are mentioned usually as mentioned either by name or as someone's daughter/sister) and few other books (secondary sources) refer to all legal wives as Empresses/Queens and the unmarried ones simply as concubines or sometimes as dancing girls. Using the format like List of Ottoman imperial consorts and changing the title as EvansKinght suggested seems good. For the table, we could color code (same way the wives into Empresses/wives who lived into husband's reign, wives who died before their husband accession and unmarried ones/concubines to differentiate or any other suggestion to differentiate is welcomed.
Manavati (talk) 19:38, 1 April 2022 (UTC)- I transferred all of the data on the previous page to a chart based on the ottoman imperial consorts chart. These are only the individual wives listed on the page as it was, I was looking at the individual pages of the various emperors and many seem to have had substantially more wives than were listed there, and are listed here, but as Manavati, the distinction between legal wife and empress seems to be an ambiguous one. From here, how do you propose to color-code or otherwise differentiate different individuals? Should we add all of the wives? -Evansknight (talk) 19:38, 4 April 2022 (UTC)
- Evanskinght. I made an maiden attempt to create one similar to Ottoman Imperial consort on my sandbox. I changed things a bit since ottoman ones have distinction and covered all wives and concubine (till Shah Jahan except Shahryar) I could find. How do you think of it? Manavati (talk) 19:54, 4 April 2022 (UTC)
- VERY nice!! I like the idea of including all of the wives and using color to indicate their different statuses. My one suggestion would be to use maybe less neon colors, perhaps a pastel blue and pastel red, like we see so often in charts, but other than that, we are of one mind. -Evansknight (talk) 19:58, 4 April 2022 (UTC)
- Evanskinght. I made an maiden attempt to create one similar to Ottoman Imperial consort on my sandbox. I changed things a bit since ottoman ones have distinction and covered all wives and concubine (till Shah Jahan except Shahryar) I could find. How do you think of it? Manavati (talk) 19:54, 4 April 2022 (UTC)
- I transferred all of the data on the previous page to a chart based on the ottoman imperial consorts chart. These are only the individual wives listed on the page as it was, I was looking at the individual pages of the various emperors and many seem to have had substantially more wives than were listed there, and are listed here, but as Manavati, the distinction between legal wife and empress seems to be an ambiguous one. From here, how do you propose to color-code or otherwise differentiate different individuals? Should we add all of the wives? -Evansknight (talk) 19:38, 4 April 2022 (UTC)
- The Mughals don't seem to differentiate explicitly between legal wives (all legal wives are mentioned usually as mentioned either by name or as someone's daughter/sister) and few other books (secondary sources) refer to all legal wives as Empresses/Queens and the unmarried ones simply as concubines or sometimes as dancing girls. Using the format like List of Ottoman imperial consorts and changing the title as EvansKinght suggested seems good. For the table, we could color code (same way the wives into Empresses/wives who lived into husband's reign, wives who died before their husband accession and unmarried ones/concubines to differentiate or any other suggestion to differentiate is welcomed.
- I agree with Manavati that the name of the page itself seems somewhat misleading. My main question is: what is an Empress? Is it only the primary wife of the ruling emperor? Is it any consort of an emperor? Would it be better to have, say a "list of Mughal imperial consorts" and then indicated which ones were emperors vs concubines vs secondary/tertiary wives? Also, a page like List of Ottoman imperial consorts might give a good idea of a format that has been used and works. -Evansknight (talk) 16:48, 1 April 2022 (UTC)