Talk:List of Michael Jackson records and achievements

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UK Number One Singles[edit]

I have removed Man In The Mirror, it should not go back on until an official source has been found. I in fact know that it wasn't number one as I paid particular attention at the time. It peaked at #2, held off by Cascada's Evacuate The Dancefloor.79.69.203.4 (talk) 13:37, 24 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Michael Jackson's achievements[edit]

When I look at how he is described, the title "American musician" doesn't cover who he was. It should say "Michael Jackson is the most successful musicians and composers in the history of popular music (Guinness World Records). He was a multiple Grammy Award winning African American singer-songwriter, poet, composer, multi-instrumentalist, entrepreneur, record producer, film producer, painter, human rights, and peace activists (Guinness World Record Most charitable entertainer ever)." Javanette (talk) 07:51, 29 July 2009 (UTC) Javanette (talk) 07:53, 29 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Michael was not named artist of the millenium[edit]

Michael Jackson was not named Artist Of The Millenium by MTV. On a MTV Special Show which aired in Mexico on August 2005 (and in many other places of the world)they talked about this, the producers of that year's show said they didn't name Michael Jackson the Millenium Artist and they never intended to. They clarified that Brtiney said, and i quote "to me Michael Jackson is the artist of the millenium...happy birthday Michael" she said to her, and MTV never told her to say that, that was spontaneous. We now what happened next, Michael came out and didn't even thank anyone for his cake (which was the whole point of the section) and he said something about he couldn't believe he was named Artist Of The Millenium by MTV (which in fact they didn't).

I've put this back on as MTV now say Michael Jackson was indeed the true recipient of the award. I have added an MTV source.79.69.203.4 (talk) 13:33, 24 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

ITS WRONG!![edit]

He was not voted artist of the millenium by MTV, why is it there, I am removing it and here are several links that prove it is not true[3] [4] [5]81.155.77.170 13:11, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

== NUMBER ONES FROM ONE ALBUM ==


He isn't the only artist to have 5 number ones from one album - Westlife did it, I think the Spice Girls did it too.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ MICHAEL WAS HONORED AS ARTIST OF THE MILLENIUM AWARD Bold text Please watch youtube for proof of this award. Prince Albert presented Michael Jackson the 2000 World Music Millenium Award! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q05eanhuEik&feature=related —Preceding unsigned comment added by Fancyapple (talk • contribs) 04:25, 27 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

HIStory- biggest seling multi-disc album ever?[edit]

This is very untrue. According to a wikipedia article on the biggest selling albums ever, Pink Floyd's "the wall" sold more and was 2 CDs.81.156.66.226 01:14, 26 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

No it's fairly true all-right. The Wall had 23 million units in the United States and just over 30 million worldwide. HIStory, however, had 36 million worldwide. The Wall easily crushes HIStory in the US, but HIStory outdoes it internationally. This MSNB article says it explicitly: "1995’s “HIStory: Past, Present, & Future” is the best-selling multiple-disc album of all-time, with 18 million copies sold worldwide."UberCryxic 22:55, 3 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

"1979 - Pink Floyd released The Wall, a rock-opera concept album, written and sung by Roger Waters. It became one of the best-selling albums ever, with around 30 million copies sold." http://www.metro.co.uk/showbiz/27273-on-this-day-in-entertainment Mads Højer (talk) 16:29, 30 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

This article is crap[edit]

Looking through this article, there were countless questionable statistics and many of them contradict things that I've heard before. The worst one is where is says that The Beatles and Elvis both sold more albums than him. I'm pretty sure he sold more than anyone.

  • He's outsold Elvis, not The Beatles. His certified sales have remained stagnant even with massive surges here and there, especially when he passed away. After bombarding Sony with mail to put in requests to update his certified sales I've gotten nowhere except a "we're looking into it." Put simply: In terms of album and single sales alone (no movies, videos, ringtones or anything else included) The Beatles have sold 450-500 million, Michael has sold 400+ million (including J5 stuff) and Elvis has sold 330+ million. These three are BY FAR ahead of the next closest contenders. Record sales are exceptionally hard to track as a whole because it's hard to know what should count as a "record" sale and Michael's early work was out before most tracking was done using charts. It's surely over 500 million though, but The Beatles would be probably somewhere north of 600 million and again most of their work was before charts tracked sales. Mc8755 (talk) 16:18, 21 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

RECORD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!![edit]

CNN has talked about 2500 millions of viewers, rather than the Olympic Games

So, this funeral, which can be considered the final performance of Michael Jackson has been:

Most Viewed EVENT OF THE HISTORY OF MANKIND WORLDWIDE !!!!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.42.167.207 (talk) 10:10, 8 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

No references?[edit]

How has this article existed for so long with so few references? I'd go through and delete everything without a reference, but someone would just revert it and claim it was vandalism. Trivialist (talk) 02:02, 9 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Good point. The most questionable statement was that Michael's peak was determined to be in the 1980s and 1990s. No source was included. That makes that a subjective statement. Vichenry371 (talk) 17:51, 17 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Bad album's run in the top five[edit]

How can his album be the longest running album in the top five with 38 weeks if Westside Story spent 58 weeks at number one? 75.21.84.236 (talk) 04:28, 29 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Because 'Westside Story' is in a different category (Soundtracks) and that is where you are confused.

Star is Here's edits & reversions[edit]

The reasons for deleting the material in question are as follows:

1. The claims about Michael Jackson's Turkish sales totals are unsourced, and possibly unsourcable. A page specifically devoted to Jackson's international sales numbers (http://www.mjjcharts.com/MichaelGlobalAlbums.htm) has a blank listing for sales of "Bad" in Turkey. I could not find confirmation of this claim. What source are you working from?
2. The success of the "Thriller" album is already detailed in the article's top section. The additional text is repetition, which is commonly culled from Wikipedia articles. Likewise for the success of the "Bad" album.
3. The "biggest selling New Jack Swing album of all time" is a strangely limited category that constitutes fancruft. The genre's heyday was less than five years. It may be instructive to note that in the aftermath of Jackson's death, there was no discussion of New Jack Swing's losing its biggest star.
4. "HIStory" is not the biggest-selling multi-disc record of all time; "Saturday Night Fever" is. Pink Floyd's "The Wall" and the soundtrack to "Grease" have also substantially outsold "HIStory."
5. The "biggest selling remix album of all time" is another problematic category that may constitute fancruft, because the number of high-profile remix albums is few, and complete sales figures are fewer. Wikipedia only lists 8 remix albums that have sold as many as a million copies. 5 of these have matched or surpassed Jackson's U.S. sales. (U.S. sales totals are considered more reliable than overseas ones.)
If you dispute the above, A Star Is Here, please explain why. Thanks.208.120.7.152 (talk) 19:09, 9 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
A Star Is Here-- Your response was ill-tempered enough that another editor deleted it, and two editors left warnings on your talk page. If you would like to leave a second response, rebutting my comments in a more civil manner, I would be happy to read it.
You appear to be a newer user, if the debut date of your user page is any indication. If so, you may not be aware that ["removing warnings for vandalism from one's talk page is also considered vandalism,"] and that ["actively erasing personal messages without replying (if a reply would be appropriate or polite) will probably be interpreted as hostile."]
Incidentally, even though your previous message has been deleted, it may be to your benefit to actually read the content of the edit summarized as "Hee hee!"208.120.7.152 (talk) 05:38, 10 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
1. The successs of thriller was Us detailed or UK and has no mention of the complete worldwide sales.
2. New Jack Swing being limited category doesnt make it irrelevent. I dont really see that much talk when article says biggest selling rap album, or country album, so lets not make this into a double standard. Saturday Night Fever is in a limited category(Soundtrack). So its classifaction is a soundtrack album not studio multiple disc album. Same thing with grease. The wall has sold 38 million units not actual albums.
3. Us sales are not always reliable in MJ's case. Bad 8mill worldwide 30mill, Dangerous 7mill worldwide 32 million, History 7 mill worldwide 40 million units same with blood on the dance floor. Remix albums are relevant enough to get there own article.
4. I dont believe what you posted above constitute fancruft. The article is called Records and achievements of Michael Jackson. Record sales for an album, which became number one in its category, or album type, or what ever it may be is relevant and noteworthy in an article of achievements. Regards A Star Is Here (talk) 20:56, 10 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
It's your edit that keeps removing the worldwide sales for "Thriller" from the very first section of his records and achievements (and leaving behind a partial sentence). I've restored the information at the top of the page. If you disagree, perhaps you'll explain why you believe that the best-selling album of all time is an achievement better saved for the article's 75th paragraph.
Comparing New Jack Swing as a music genre to rap or country is a stretch and a half. Rap releases have charted for more than 30 years, country releases have charted for more than 80. Meanwhile, New Jack Swing was a brief subgenre in music history, and a minor facet of Jackson's career arc. Michael Jackson's biographical infobox on Wikipedia lists four distinct genres associated with Jackson: R&B, rock, pop, and dance. Remix albums pose a different notability problem, because the scope of the so-called competition is simply too thin to support a notable "achievement." We might also glorify Jackson by claiming, correctly, that his achievements include fronting the most successful quintet in Indiana music history.
I'm afraid that you're simply wrong about the double albums. Soundtracks are not classified separately from other types of albums for the purposes of all-time Billboard/RIAA recordkeeping. To become Billboard's longest-running chart album ever, "Dark Side of the Moon" surpassed Johnny Mathis' "Greatest Hits" (#1) and the original cast album for "My Fair Lady" (#2). Furthermore, if you're counting separate sales, you appear to have halved Pink Floyd's total while doubling Jackson's. By most reports, "HIStory" has sold 10 million copies worldwide, not 40. "The Wall" has sold 11.5 million RIAA-tabulated copies in America alone. 40 million sales for any kind of album would rank in the all-time top 10. Should Jackson ever catch up to the Eagles (42 million-plus) for the highest-selling "greatest hits" album of all time, it will certainly make the news.
I've therefore deleted the incorrect multi-disc claim. I've also deleted the unref'd Turkey data, although if you are able to source that, it could merit a return or even its own section. In deference to your desire to keep the New Jack Swing/remix material, I've retained it, but in a more contextual manner. I've also consolidated some of the non-disputed award counts and ticket sales. I hope this compromise will satisfy you.208.120.224.227 (talk) 06:04, 13 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

If you believe that most sources say HIstory has sold 10 million copies your are terribly wrong. Most sources have it at 15 to 20 million copies sold and 30 to 40 million disc. Jacksons History album by most counts is 20 million copies. Therefore I reinstated the History best selling multiple disc in another form. The turkish sales was not something I posted but I do find it suspicious that at of so many unreferenced statements on this page you choose that one to contest why not everything on the page? But the consolidation you did was satisfying even though I'am afraid your wrong about sells of History. A Star Is Here (talk) 09:55, 26 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

According to various references on the internet, Michael Jackson has sold as few as 100 million albums, or as many as 750 million. "Thriller" sales estimates range from 45-110 million. That's quite a margin of error. However, the RIAA currently lists the "HIStory" album at 7 million sales in the U.S. [1] (In other words, 3.5 million copies of the double album.) Even given Jackson's global popularity, and his July sales burst, going from 7 million confirmed U.S. sales of a given album to 40 million overall sales is an exponential process that wouldn't be reflected by any other top-selling album in history. "Saturday Night Fever" has double the RIAA certification and has had far more time to amass a sales total, and is generally listed at the 40 million level worldwide.
The worldwide sales chart on the Wikipedia page for "HIStory", which you yourself have edited, adds up to 10,346,000 sales, and that's accepting all the data at face value. Double that, and you don't get anywhere near 40 million. As I already mentioned, if and when "HIStory" hits 20/40 million sales, it will bump off the Eagles for the best-selling Greatest Hits album in all the annals of recorded music, and that's NOT going to go unnoticed by the media. For these reasons, I'm deleting the "multiple disc" edit.
For someone who is so accepting of uncertified sales totals, your suspicion regarding my secret motive in deleting the Turkish data is a bit of a surprise. As it happens, I do find some of the sections (e.g. "Jackson's Swiss achievements" as being part of the greater glorification of The King Of Pop. But even if the Norwegian or Irish charts are considered minor, at least those sections include actual information regarding verifiable chart history. The Turkish section did not.208.120.224.227 (talk) 14:14, 27 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I'll Just provide you with sources to back up my claim for History.

Yes, I understand that the 40 million claim is out there. But the accompanying, verifiable data is absent. The 20 million figure is supported with actual sales records. But the 40 million figure is double the country-by-country sales chart info that's on the Wikipedia page for "HIStory". And again, there simply aren't ANY other albums in history that are reliably considered to have sold SIX times their RIAA-calculated numbers. Go down the list, album by album, on the Wikipedia page of best-selling albums, and you won't find an example. No source claims "Thriller" sold 175 million. And "Thriller"s biggest period of sales predates the introduction of SoundScan recordkeeping, which gives it a much bigger gray area than "HIStory."
http://www.billboard.com/bbcom/news/michael-jackson-s-thriller-approaches-eagles-1003995326.story
The above is from Billboard, reporting on the industry expectation that the post-death surge in Jackson's album sales will push "Thriller" past the Eagles' "Greatest Hits" collection, to the #1 slot. News coverage this specific cannot be found for "HIStory."
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124760651612341407.html
The above is the Wall Street Journal from 3 months ago, reporting on the problem of inflated sales totals ("Off-the-Wall Tallies of Jackson's Sales"). Extravagant promotional claims and/or errors in methodology are often taken up by media sources, and often repeated verbatim.
I've offered an alternative wording on the page which I hope will satisfy you.208.120.224.227 (talk) 15:01, 29 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I like the structure but the amount know to be sold was wrong: -->

Charts[2] Peak
Position 		Certification Sales/Shipments
Argentina Platinum [3] 200,000[3]
Australia 1 8× Platinum[4] 560,000[5]
Austria 2 2× Platinum[6] 100,000[7]
Belgium 1
Brazil Top 10 CD ABPD 1[8] Gold [9] 250,000
Canada 5× Platinum[10] 500,000[11]
Europe 6× Platinum[12] 6,000,000[13]
Finland 3 Platinum[14] 61,352[14]
France 1 Diamond[15] 1,000,000[15]
Germany[16] 1 3× Platinum[17] 1,500,000[18]
Mexico 9[19] 2x platinum[20] 300,000[21]
Netherlands 1 3× Platinum[22] 240,000[7]
New Zealand 1[23] 9× Platinum[24] 135,000[25]
Norway 1 Platinum[26] 50,000[7]
Poland 1 Platinum[27] 100,000
Spain 4x Platinum[28] 400,000
Sweden 3 Platinum[29] 100,000[7]
Switzerland 1 3× Platinum[30] 150,000[30]
United Kingdom[31] 1 4× Platinum[32] 1,200,000
United States[33] 1 7× Platinum[34] 3,500,000

Add also the individual disc that was sold which is 3.9 million as well. A Star Is Here (talk) 21:19, 29 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

How can sales of the individual disc possibly count towards the "best selling multi-disc of all time"?
The above chart adds up to 10,945,000 copies, including some friendly estimates. (Remember not to double-count the European nations AND the listing for "Europe.") *Where* are the other 10,000,000 sales alleged to be coming from? All of the "40 million" sources I've seen are silent on this question.
Leaving aside Wikipedia's distaste for blogs as references for the moment, the MichaelJackson.com link is problematic. As the Wall Street Journal article details, Jackson's management has often inflated and/or packaged various numbers for publicity purposes. In any event, the total given on the blogpage is certainly not a "certified" number. It may be a valid ref for the highest claimed figure, but it can't be used for more than that. However, I've jacked the lower estimate up from 10 million to 11 million based on the above chart, as it would only require 55,000 unlisted sales to get there and I think that's a safe assumption.
To accept the 21 million (42 mil) figure at face value, some reliable source would need to demonstrate why-- alone among the top albums-- "HIStory" has broken free of the extrapolation range between non-RIAA sales and RIAA-certified sales.208.120.224.227 (talk) 22:18, 29 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Okay if we are going to accept each other edits you must be fair. You cant say 11 million copies and 22 million disc for your statements and just say 21 million copies and leave the disc out for mine. I'll restore the disc part. Other then that I think that wording you presented is the only way to satisfy both of us. A Star Is Here (talk) 03:06, 30 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I'll do even better than that-- I'll cut the lower number out and leave yours in. I was only trying to avoid excess repetition, as Wikipedia guidelines advise.
For clarity and context, I've also expanded the explanation of how multi-disc albums are officially counted and certified. I had to take out the "solo artist" statement, though, since the more definite 22 million figure would not surpass certain albums such as Elton John's "Goodbye Yellow Brick Road." Exact album sales are always speculative, and a pain in the rump to source, but I don't think "one of the top-selling of all time" is going anyplace, nor does it look bad for Jackson's standing.208.120.224.227 (talk) 16:27, 30 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]





HIYA MICHAEL JACKSON WAS A LIVING LEGEND AND JUST BECAUSE HE HAS GONE DOESNT MEAN HE IS FORGOTTEN HE STILL LIVES ON!!!!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.47.183.220 (talk) 19:47, 9 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The Triller video is the first music video to be preserved by the library of congress to the national recording registry as it was deemed "culturally significant".

References

  1. ^ http://www.riaa.org/goldandplatinumdata.php?resultpage=2&table=tblTop100&action=
  2. ^ Hit Parade (1995). "European charts". Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  3. ^ a b Cámara Argentina de Productores de Fonogramas y Videogramas (1995). "Argentinian certification". capif.org.ar. Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  4. ^ Australian Recording Industry Association (2004). "ARIA Charts — Accreditations". aria.com.au. Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  5. ^ Australian Recording Industry Association. "Criteria". aria.com.au. Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  6. ^ International Federation of the Phonographic Industry — Austria (December 19, 1996). "Austrian certification (search)". ifpi.at. Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  7. ^ a b c d Recording Industry Association of Japan (2005). "Standard for Certifying Awards of Countries" (PDF). riaj.or.jp. Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  8. ^ July 6 - July 12, 2009
  9. ^ http://www.abpd.org.br/certificados_interna.asp?sArtista=Jackson
  10. ^ Canadian Recording Industry Association (November 30, 1995). "Canadian certification". cria.ca. Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  11. ^ Canadian Recording Industry Association. "Criteria". cria.ca. Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  12. ^ International Federation of the Phonographic Industry (1996). "IFPI Platinum Europe Awards". ifpi.org. Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  13. ^ International Federation of the Phonographic Industry. "Criteria". ifpi.org. Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  14. ^ a b International Federation of the Phonographic Industry — Finland (1997). "Finnish certification". ifpi.fi. Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  15. ^ a b Syndicat national de l'édition phonographique (1995). "French certification". chartsinfrance.net. Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  16. ^ "German Albums Chart (Search)". charts-surfer.de. 1995. Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  17. ^ International Federation of the Phonographic Industry — Germany (1997). "German certification". musikindustrie.de. Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  18. ^ International Federation of the Phonographic Industry (1995). "Criteria" (PDF). musikindustrie.de. Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  19. ^ [1]
  20. ^ AMPROFON 14st September 2009
  21. ^ Mexican Certification 2009
  22. ^ Nederlandse Vereniging van Producenten en Importeurs van beeld-en geluidsdragers (1996). "Dutch certification (search)". nvpi.nl. Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  23. ^ New Zealand Peak Position
  24. ^ New Zealand Certification
  25. ^ New Zealand Chart Facts
  26. ^ International Federation of the Phonographic Industry — Norway (1995). "Norwegian certification (search)". ifpi.no. Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  27. ^ [2]
  28. ^ Promusicae
  29. ^ International Federation of the Phonographic Industry — Sweden (1995). "Swedish certification" (PDF). ifpi.se. Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  30. ^ a b HitParade (1996). "Swiss certification". Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  31. ^ Every Hit (1995). "UK Albums Chart". Retrieved 2008-11-25. {{cite web}}: Unknown parameter |month= ignored (help)
  32. ^ British Phonographic Industry (February 1, 1996). "U.K. certification". bpi.co.uk. Retrieved 2008-11-25.
  33. ^ Allmusic (1995). "Billboard charts". Retrieved 2008-11-25. {{cite web}}: |author= has generic name (help)
  34. ^ Recording Industry Association of America (October 12, 1999). "U.S. certification". riaa.com. Retrieved 2008-11-25.

Misinformation.... Where's the source?[edit]

A few things to note/correct for the US achievements:

Thriller wasn't the first album to spend an entire year in the top 10, nor is it one of 4.

Why is it important to note that he had 5 albums debut at #1? Eminem had 7.

He was the first solo artist to notch four top 10 hits from an album.

Hollywood Tonight never spent 11 weeks on top of the Hot Dance/Club Songs chart. The Thriller LP did that...

The number of top 10 hits credited to the Beatles and Madonna are both slightly off. — Preceding unsigned comment added by WolfSpear (talk • contribs)

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Human Nature[edit]

On the Wikipedia page for Number Ones, Human Nature is listed as Track #6 on the European/Australian/Canadian/Japanese version of the album. Where it shows which countries the song reached #1, Canada is the only country listed. However, Human Nature is not listed under the Canada section of this article. 2600:1700:9060:2BD0:8131:66E0:48C:825 (talk) 21:31, 18 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Never mind it was a different Canadian chart 2600:1700:9060:2BD0:8131:66E0:48C:825 (talk) 21:51, 18 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]
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