Talk:Day of the Dead/Archive 2

Archive 1

Archive 2

Archive 3

This is All Souls' Day

It seems ood that this article is not related to the All Souls' Day article in the Category bar below. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.52.117.89 (talk) 10:54, 2 November 2009 (UTC)

blah —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.10.80.162 (talk) 20:54, 31 October 2010 (UTC)

Neopagan Samhain

Would it be possible to add a section about the Neopagan festival of Samhain?

Its should be stated that there is no hard evidence for a pre-christian Celtic equivalent of the day of the dead, although some speculate that it may be the case. Another scenario is possible, which is the introduction of aspects of the Day of the Dead into modern halloween and that the practices have been gradually imported from America to the UK. The Irish name for November is Samhain and the customs associated with the Neopagan festival cannot be traced back to pre-christian times. The Day of the Dead is most likely to be the influence, for the contemporary Neopagan festival. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.92.40.49 (talk) 08:34, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

As a neo-pagan, Wiccan it all depends on who you ask. Shamain we believe, the veil between the spirit world and this world is at it's thinnest. Candles are placed in windows to guide those gone back, and we do this for ALL of our ancestors, thus it is also refered toas Rememberence Day, all Souls day, Ancestors Night ... It is also the Wiccan, Neo-Pagan End or Begining of the new year. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.173.122.251 (talk) 03:20, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

This article states that, "The festival that became the modern Day of the Dead fell in the ninth month of the Aztec calendar, about the beginning of August, and was celebrated for an entire month." So originally the Central American festival of the dead occurred in the month of August, not on November 1st and 2nd. Why the change? November 1st is the Christian holiday of All Saints Day, which was brought to the Americas with the rest of Catholicism. Where did the festival of All Saints Day originate? According the the Wikipedia article, it originally occurred on May 13, the historical date of the Roman festival of Lemuria (also a festival of the dead), but was moved to November 1st by Pope Gregory III in the 730s. This new date corresponded to the Gaelic harvest festival of Samhain (October 31- Nov 1st). Samhain coincided with the Feile na Marbh, or "Festival of the Dead". The ancient Gaelic festival of Samhain was the inspiration for the Neo-Pagan Festival of the same name, which occurs on the same date.Lily20 (talk) 06:07, 27 September 2009 (UTC)

There is actually no historical evidence that November 1st was ever a Celtic or Gaelic religious festival. The only sources for any sort of festival on November 1st are the writings of 11th and 12th century Christian monks in Ireland retelling (or inventing) Irish legends. These legends include kings having warrior feasts at "Samhain Eve" (Samhain means November in Irish Gaelic so Samhain Eve was Oct 31st) they make no mention of any religious significance, nor of a harvest festival nor any celebration of the dead. The monks probably settled on Samhain Eve because, by the 11th century, it, All Saints Eve, had become a popular festival. By the time the Pope instituted this NEW festival of All Saints around 750AD (May 13th was and still is the celebration of the consecration of the Church of Mary and the Martyrs in Rome, it was never "All Saints Day"), Ireland (the supposed home of Samhain) had been Christian for 200 years or more. Columba set off from Ireland to convert the Scots in 563 AD. Dmottram (talk) 22:39, 13 May 2010 (UTC)

I'm not sure how to use this yet, but there is clear evidence suggesting Samhain is close to the festival. both are regarding ancestral veneration. I thought this site was more non bias than others. — Preceding unsigned comment added by LadyGuidance (talk • contribs) 01:36, 17 September 2012 (UTC)

Move to Día de los Muertos?

Shouldn't this page be at "Día de los Muertos" with "Day of the Dead" redirecting there? I think most English speakers who know of the event understand the Spanish name. Marnanel 14:55, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

Why? This is the English side of Wikipedia. Latin America calls New York "Nuevo York" and that is not the name of the city/state (and there are countless other examples). Are speakers of English to be expected to take on a greater burden of political correctness than any other language? Mensch 07:19, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

I don't see what political correctness had to do with it. New York has a sizeable English-speaking population, so it's reasonable to call it "New York" in English; Día de los Muertos is primarily a Spanish-speaking event. Marnanel 15:20, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

Personally I would agree with a move -- even I know it primarily as Dia de los Muertos and I'm a gringo. But, we should probably wait to hear from a few more people. — e. ripley\^talk 16:20, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

7

I like "Day of the ." It's not difficult to understand, and a simple translation.翔太 ^{「Shouta:talk」} 17:22, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

I'm not strongly opposed to the move, but I don't see any particularly compelling reasons for it, either. This is the English Wikipedia, so we should probably stick to translated names when they are commonly used. It also strikes me that, while those who refer to it as "Día de los Muertos" will almost certainly also know it as "Day of the....."there are those who know it as "Day of the Dead" but are unfamiliar with "Día de los Muertos" (I was talking to one yesterday). Sxeptomaniac 21:02, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

The question, though, is is the English translation of Dia de los Muertos more commonly used? A case could certainly be made for, say, Oktoberfest. I doubt anyone would argue that we should house the article at Octoberfest because it's the English Wikipedia and that's the Anglicianized spelling, because there's no doubt that Oktoberfest more commonly used. But can the same strong case be made for Day of the Dead versus Dia de los Muertos? This may ultimately be an unanswerable question, because most newspaper articles mention both the Mexican and English version, by way of explanation.

Hmm. Well, a cursory Googling blah shows 3.9 million hits for "Day of the Dead" [1] versus 1.9 million for "Dia de los Muertos" [2]. Given this, probably, absent more compelling evidence, it should be left as it is. — e. ripley\^talk 21:15, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

How many of those hits were for Day of the Dead (film) or its upcoming remake, though? —Angr 08:02, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

I was thinking about that, too, so I tried adding "holiday Mexico" and got 291 thousand for "Day of the Dead"[3] and 151 thousand for "Dia de los Muertos"[4]. Sxeptomaniac 20:22, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

I am all for using the local term instead of the translation... when it makes sense to do so. In this case, I lean towards keeping it under "Day of the Dead." There is, for example, the fact that in Mexico itself "Día de los Muertos" is not the only or even the most common term among people who actually celebrate the holiday (as opposed to schoolkids who learn about it in class, given that for many years the holiday was celebrated more in the countryside than in the cities).

First off, we are talking about two days, not one (All Saints/Todos Santos plus All Souls/Fieles Difuntos), so one often hears "Días de los Muertos" (in the plural). Second, "Muertos" sounds a little brusque, so many people use the name of the second day, "Fieles Difuntos" or "Dia de los Difuntos," instead. (This is popular speech, not the stuff that children are taught in schools nowadays, so of course these terms barely register on Google searches.) The most common term is simply "el 2 de noviembre." Given all this, I don't see a problem with using the English term. -Potosino 01:46, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

Growing up in Texas, I always heard día de los muertos. To me, Day of the Dead is a zombie movie only. But if Google can be trusted, Day of the Dead is in fact used in English. —Angr 06:02, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

Does not originate only from Mexico

The article states that the holiday originates from Mexico, but this holiday has been celebrated by indigenous cultures throughout mesoamerica and south america: the Quichua in Ecuador, the Mayans in both modern Mexico and central america, as well as the aztecs in central mexico, with of course different variations in each place. [User:66.108.225.149|66.108.225.149]] 03:15, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

If you have information (with references/sources) that would be an interesting addition to this article.LAVisitor1 00:44, 8 July 2007 (UTC)

The connections to the Aztecs and other Indian groups are tenuous at best. It was celebrated in Spain at the time of the Spanish colonization of Mexico in almost exactly the same form it is celebrated today. Its popularity as a cultural marvel arose due to the influence of the German Jewish art critic Paul Westheim, who had an enormous influence over people like Octavio Paz and Diego Rivera, and who brought the importance of this holiday to their attention. In his book "La Calavera", he traces the roots of the holiday to both their Indian and their European antecedants. In terms of the fascination with skulls and skeletons, there is plenty of material from Prehispanic Mexico that might be examined, but it did not have much to do with the Day of the Dead itself. Most of the attempts to force this paradigm are based on wishful thinking.

It is interesting that this paradigm (that this is an Indian tradition), although it is widely accepted as fact in the US (thanks to the proliferation of US-based dilettante writers) is not at all accepted in Mexico. Most Mexicans see it as a Catholic Holiday, because that is what it is, and that is what it always has been. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.65.156.86 (talk) 05:30, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

This article as written today is seriously misleading All Saints Day and All Souls Days are major festivities of the Catholic Church. The Latin name is "Commemoratio omnium Fidelium Defunctorum" (Day of the Dead, in Latin)--- this is conmemorated worldwide everywhere there are Catholics. The fact that Catholic Mexicans happen to call it in Spanish "dia de los muertos" does not make it any more "Mexican" than "French", who call it... you guessed... "day of the dead" in French. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.13.6.71 (talk) 05:43, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

This article got it all wrong. November 2 is the day of the dead in every Catholic country (in France as well in Italy and Spain!). It's evidently something that the Mexican derived from the Spanish colonizers. The text should be absolutely changed. It was probably written by someone who doesn't know much about Catholicism. Btw All Saints Day is November 1, NOT November 2!--93.40.92.189 (talk) 19:56, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

You're all aware that Day of the Dead is a autumn equinox celebration, right? Every culture has them, not just Catholic European nations. Many of the Mexican customs are derived from the indigenous form of the holiday, as are Ecuadorian traditions. No doubt they overlap the Spanish form, just as solstice and equinox festivals in the Western World like Christmas, Easter, Halloween, and Midsummer overlap ancient, pagan, European festivals. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.98.148.217 (talk) 02:59, 11 September 2009 (UTC)

• I would like to note that the article is not, on its merits, wrong. What it seeks to create is a distinction (and an appropriate one) between celebrations on 1/2 Nov. in Mexico/the rest of North America and those elsewhere. The "Day of the Dead" should be distinguished between el dia de los santos and el dia de los fieles difuntos / dia de los difuntos. This distinction rests on the syncretism between ancient Native American religions of the area and the Roman Catholicism of the early Spanish missions. News casts in Mexico itself make this quite clear with the references to Mictlan and so on. This is not the traditional celebration of the departed in other Roman Catholic influenced countries--eleuthero (talk) 14:32, 2 November 2009 (UTC)

Puzzling Text

I am a bit confused about some text:

Some Mexicans feel that death is a special occasion, but with elements like water, earth, fire and air of celebration because the soul is passing into another life.

I know that water, earth, fire and air are the traditional elements, but I think the word "elements" in the first part of this sentence is used in a different sense. So, I am removing the whole confused mid-section, to restore some coherence. If I am missing something here, please feel free to correct me, but it appears the sentence was mangled by someone who didn't comprehend the original intent of the sentence. 76.100.205.82 20:52, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

I agree. That sentence looks like a case of "too many cooks ruin the broth." I can't parse it either. --Jaysweet 20:57, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

Good catch.I suspect it was a subtle vandalism insertion that everyone just missed at first. This page does seem to be one of those targeted by vandals, especially with the holiday approaching. Sχeptomaniac^{χαιρετε} 21:28, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

Wtf

Why in god's name is this page protected? I wanted to add a reference to the Venture Bros episode Dia de Los Dangerous! and Rusty's hilariously culturally ignorant line about "that crazy dead-people Christmas you people celebrate" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.72.21.221 (talk) 20:25, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

Too much vandalism. If you don't feel like registering, I think the article will survive without that pop culture reference for a couple of weeks. Sχeptomaniac^{χαιρετε} 15:47, 22 October 2007 (UTC)

I think someone should have tried taking the vandalism off the page before they decided to protect it. Luosiji 16:38, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

If you look at the article history, that's exactly what I did. The most recent piece of vandalism was by a logged-in user, which semi-protection doesn't stop. Sχeptomaniac^{χαιρετε} 17:02, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

There's good reason to control this page. Here's an example of text that needs to be removed from the site ASAP under Mexico - (Copy of text of vandalism removed, as includes what is probably a real person's name) so vandalism seems a problem. This is the first time I have come across it. Since the page is protected, can a moderator help? Then remove my message which by keeping it on the internet only continues the vandal's goal. Thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.164.171.159 (talk) 16:39, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

That particular piece of vandalism was only up for literally one minute. Since it's already taken care of, I'm removing the copy of the vandalism from the comment here, since it includes what I assume is a real person's name. Sχeptomaniac^{χαιρετε} 17:02, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

As far as the semi-protection, there is an unusually large amount vandalism on this page for some reason. I haven't quite figured out why, but it is one of the more vandalized pages on my watchlist. Go figure. --Jaysweet 17:12, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Organization

I'm curious to wonder whether the part 1.2 Beliefs should be a separate heading like 1 Beliefs, 2 Observation in Mexico etc. because it doesn't completlly fall under the Observation in Mexico category.Janus8463 04:54, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

IP request to remove vandalism

Could someone remove the vandalism in the second section? Thank you. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.188.255.26 (talk) 17:38, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Could you please be more specific? I don't see any vandalism at the moment, but I haven't gone over the article with a fine-toothed comb either... --Jaysweet 17:48, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

categories

Am I the only one who finds it odd that this is under both religious and secular holidays? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 165.138.5.199 (talk) 16:07, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Questionable paragraph from opening.

I cut the following paragraph from the introduction, and bring it here for discussion:

The traditional mood for this holiday is bright with emphasis on celebrating and honouring the lives of the dead. This is because they think of The Day of the Dead as the continuation of life. They believe that death is not the end, but the beginning of a new stage in life. These people are usually Christians of Native American descent whose ancestors introduced indigenous ideas of life after death.

First and foremost, there are no references for the assertions made in this paragraph. Secondly, the tone is not encyclopaedic, with statements like "they think" and "they believe" this or that, without specifying who "they" are. Overall, the tone is simplistic, turning a complex mythology into the equivalent of a junior high essay. I do not believe the article is any the worse without it. ---RepublicanJacobite_{The'FortyFive'} 18:54, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

"Similar celebrations"

I think that the discussions of "similar" festivals of the dead, such as those in Japan and China, should be split off into a separate article. The current article should discuss only the "Day of the Dead" with origins in Christianity, specifically Catholicism. Short paragraphs on supposedly similar celebrations, the origins of which are in completely different belief systems, and which are celebrated at other times of the year, is a disservice. There are as many differences as there are similarities. Any thoughts? ---RepublicanJacobite_{The'FortyFive'} 16:14, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

Actually, they already are the subject of separate articles ... I think that it's appropriate and interesting to have a one or two sentence description of similar celebrations here, with links to the main articles (as now). IMHO, a brief "compare and contrast" section here helps put the Mexican observances in perspective. EspanaViva 19:14, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

Well then, some sort of brief explanatory paragraph is needed at the head of the "similar celebrations" subsection. As it is now, we have only a list of countries and no explanatory text. ---RepublicanJacobite_{The'FortyFive'} 19:19, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

Sure - no problem! EspanaViva 18:48, 8 January 2008 (UTC)

Thank you! ---RepublicanJacobite_{The'FortyFive'} 05:12, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Incorrect statement

"Scholars trace the origins of the modern holiday to indigenous observances dating back thousands of years, and to an Aztec festival dedicated to a goddess called Mictecacihuatl (known in English as Catrina and also known as "The Lady of the Dead")."

The goddess Mictecacihuat, described below, is not known in English as Catrina, who is also described below. "La Catrina" of the Day of the Dead is the female dandy skeleton. The goddess is the goddess. They are both female but one is not the other. Mictecacihuatl is definitely not known in English as Catrina. "Catrin" means a dressed-up rich person who wears overly dressed-up attire, and the middle and lower classes of Mexico of long ago would refer to such a person as "Un Catrin." "La Catrina" is the female version of such a person. Not a name in English like "Catrina." If you see a female skeleton who is not dressed up in "fancy" clothing, she is definitely not a "Catrina." If you saw one dressed in a huipil and rebozo, that is not a Catrina in the slightest. A female dressed in modest traditional dress also would not represent the ancient goddess, but a deceased person from humble origins. Any skeleton you see in Day of the Dead celebrations is a person who has died. "Death" itself, "La Muerte," "La Huesuda," "La Flaca," "La Calaca," can be depicted as a skeleton, but she would never be dressed in fancy clothing.

If anything in modern times would have taken the "place" of the goddess, it would be the image of the Virgin Mary, who replaced the female goddesses in most o the prehispanic religions during the colonial period. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jluntz (talk • contribs) 23:11, 18 October 2009 (UTC)

Catrina is a female skeleton created by Jose Guadalupe Posada, it is a satirical image poking fun at the elite of the era. It has also been reproduced in one of Diego Rivera's murals.

Mictecacihuatl is mistress to Mictlantecuhtli Aztec God of the dead. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.160.171.253 (talk • contribs) (05:03, 17 January 2008)

Please place your comments at the bottom the page where they belong, and use proper talk page formatting in future. Thank you.

If there is information in the article that is incorrect, and you have references that indicate this, please change the article. ---RepublicanJacobite_{The'FortyFive'} 17:07, 17 January 2008 (UTC)

Well, according to the article Catrina, José Guadalupe Posada's creation, the calavera de la catrina (the "calavera of the female dandy") has come to be associated with the Day of the Dead and Mictecacihuatl, in popular Mexican culture. They both are female figures with skeleton faces, and while they do come from very different sources, I can see how the modern name could become associated with the ancient (roughly similar) figure. If you have any sources indicating that these Day of the Dead figures are not sometimes referred to as "Catrina," that would be helpful to know.

I will adjust the text slightly to better reflect the history of Mictecacihuatl and Catrina. EspanaViva 21:16, 17 January 2008 (UTC)

I do not see any fact in this article or the cited sources that specifically connects the holiday itself, El Dia De Los Muertos, to any ancient "indigenous observances." Rather, the connection seems to be, through All Saints' Day, to the Samhain. The offered explanation jumps ahead thousands of years from a supposed Aztec festival in August (attested only by that terrible website) to a festival that just happens to be on the same day as All Saints' Day, which bears a striking resemblance to same, but to which, we are to believe, it bears no historical connection. This is absurd. What is needed is an explanation of when the festival originated and how it got to its present form. Certainly customs related to Dia De Los Muertos celebration seem Mexican in origin. But we need to explain the process of how these were incorporated into the Catholic All Saints' Day. The whole process of absorption is not explained at all. Are we supposed to believe that the Aztecs at some point just switched the festival from August to November, which happened to coincide with All Saints' Day? There must be somebody here who knows something about this. Ocanter (talk) 01:22, 3 November 2008 (UTC)

Lebanese celebration

I am moving this statement here because it is unsourced, and entering the name given in search engines does not provide any sources. If you have any sources for this information, please re-post with the source citation.

"In Lebanon, people visit cemeteries where they pray for their dead relatives. The holiday in Lebanon also occurs on November 2 and is known as Yom el Maouta. The holiday is celebrated by Catholics as well as Greek and Armenian Orthodox." EspanaViva 08:12, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

Use of image from Disneyland

This image (Image:1664289779 83b06140e3.jpg) appears to be a Disneyland display about this holiday. I'm not sure that it really should appear in this article about a folk holiday. Comments? EspanaViva 13:57, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

I'm neutral regarding using the image. If it's made clear that it's a commercial representation of the holiday, rather than a traditional one, I think it's acceptable to use it. Still, the image itself is rather dark, so it's not really that useful, anyway. Sχeptomaniac^{χαιρετε} 16:37, 8 May 2008 (UTC)

Image copyright problem with Image:Grim-fandango-cast.jpg

The image Image:Grim-fandango-cast.jpg is used in this article under a claim of fair use, but it does not have an adequate explanation for why it meets the requirements for such images when used here. In particular, for each page the image is used on, it must have an explanation linking to that page which explains why it needs to be used on that page. Please check

• That there is a non-free use rationale on the image's description page for the use in this article.
• That this article is linked to from the image description page.

This is an automated notice by FairuseBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. --07:11, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

Including an Extra External Link Resource

Could someone add this link, http://www.bit dick.com/huge/, to the "External links" section for this page? It has some relevant information regarding the Day of the Dead. {{editsemiprotected}}

Not done: This is only relevant to San Antonio. If you could find something more globally relevant, that would be great.--Aervanath lives in the Orphanage 03:59, 30 October 2008 (UTC)

Jennifer Ann Crecente altar image

I am moving these comments from my talk page here so that other editors can be involved in this discussion. I feel that the image in question is, as I said in a recent edit summary, "while relevant to her article, here it does not elucidate the topic, which is the point." I would like other editors to weigh in on this issue. ---RepublicanJacobite_{The'FortyFive'} 23:11, 9 November 2008 (UTC)

• You state: "The image is not appropriate, as I made clear in my edit summary."

Your edit summary does not appear to speak to appropriateness but rather that you don't believe that it provides clarification. ("Removed Jennifer Ann Crecente altar; while relevant to her article, here it does not elucidate the topic, which is the point.") If you do feel the image is not appropriate, please explain why, I feel that I can show otherwise and that this may be a misunderstanding.

• "It is for you to prove that it is appropriate, since you insist on adding it."

As mentioned here and in the edit summary, the image in question is a genuine altar for "The Day of the Dead" whereas the other image is not a genuine altar but rather a satirical piece that, while humorous, is not illustrative of the topic at hand. I feel that a genuine altar more appropriately illustrates this article.

• "It seems to me that the purpose of the image is to serve as a memorial for a murdered teen, and not to illustrate the topic of the article, which is already well-illustrated."

By its definition, a "Day of the Dead" altar would be a memorial to somebody that is dead. While the image is of a memorial for a murdered teen, that is subordinate to its purpose in the article which is to illustrate a genuine altar.

Additionally, I'd like to know your thoughts on the following (asked above):

• Is there an established standard regarding how many images are appropriate per article / topic / sub-topic?
• If so, how does one determine which images are more appropriate?
• Please leave a message after the beep, and if you don't i'll poop in ya mouth. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.115.76.183 (talk) 20:39, 25 October 2009 (UTC)

Thanks again, Drew30319 (talk) 17:50, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

New mention for Pop-Culture

{{editsemiprotected}} In the Game, World of Warcraft, there is a holiday celebrated in game for two days. November 1st and 2nd.

Reference: http://www.wowwiki.com/Day_of_the_Dead

Firstly, a Wiki is not a reliable source. Secondly, once you have a reliable source, you must tell where you would like this added. Also consider whether or not is it appropriate to add this; random useless tidbits of information which would only be of interest to a small, devoted group of people should not be included in Wikipedia. Intelligentsium 22:53, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

Day of the dead is very special to almost all Mexicans. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.196.49.4 (talk) 14:23, 31 October 2009 (UTC)
World of Warcraft is a piece of popular culture, and a reliable source of information regarding the Day of the Dead ingame event can be found on the official World of Warcraft website, at www.worldofwarcraft.com Neoinr (talk) 15:13, 2 November 2009 (UTC)

It's debatable as to whether a game website, regardless of how many people play it, constitutes a RS in accordance with wiki policy. Additionally, I'd argue that, given the length of the article, and the tenuous connection to the game event, that this is not Notable. There are countless references to the holiday in countless pop culture venues. That's why we often shy away from bloated "in popular culture" sections, which end up just being an IMDB-esque filmography/etc. That's not the intent. This is not encyclopedic content. If there was some notable reason/connectiuon between the game and the event (i.e. it was reported on in secondary RS's, not the game's site itself) then it would certainly warrant inclusion. I don't think it does without that notability.We're not saying WOW isn't notable...we're saying the connection between the two, i.e. that WOW has a Day of the Dead themed event, isn't especially notable to this article.204.65.34.134 (talk) 22:37, 29 October 2012 (UTC)

Mentos?

The page says offerings to the dead include "mementos, mentos". I think "mentos" is a mistake and should be deleted. 403forbidden (talk) 16:24, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Vandalism from 2007 that we somehow continued to miss. Not sure how it managed to slip by for so long. Thanks for the tip. Sχeptomaniac^{χαιρετε} 20:02, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Day of the Dead also known as Cinco de Mayo??

In the first sentence it says also known as Cinco de Mayo. I don't think that is correct, is it? That's 5th May and is a historical celebration. Andrew Riddles (talk) 18:42, 5 May 2010 (UTC)

You are right. Cinco de Mayo is a completely different celebration. You just happened to view a short-lived vandalized version of the page. Thanks for mentioning it, though. Sometimes these kinds of things slip by for longer than they should. Sχeptomaniac^{χαιρετε} 15:41, 7 May 2010 (UTC)

Stress the fact that "Dia de los Muertos" is primarily a Mexican festivity. A separate article is needed.

By reading the article I feel the editors strongly imply that Dia de los Muertos is a pan-Latin American, pan-Hispanic, pan-Catholic festivity, and that it is followed with equal intensity everywhere. I do not agree with this vision. I think that it needs to be stressed that Dia de los Muertos, and its most noticeable elements, such as the flowers, the food offers, the skull-shaped candies, the image of the skeletons, the poems dedicated to the deceased, are mostly Mexican traditions.

I don't doubt that similar traditions exist in Ecuador or Brazil, even in the same days, or even in Asian countries, but these don't exactly correspond to what is considered the traditional Mexican Dia de los Muertos festivity. In other words, when you ask a British, a German, a French, a Russian, etc. what country celebrates Dia de los Muertos, they mostly without hesitation will tell you, Mexico. Also, how many of these countries that celebrate a "Day of the Dead" set up altars in their embassies around the world when the day comes?

I think that perhaps it would be a good idea to focus the article on the traditional Mexican celebration, and then provide a separate article like Other Day of the Death Celebrations, which describes customs in other parts of Latin America and the world. The bottom line is the Dia de los Muertos in Mexico is a tradition of the indigenous peoples of central Mexico that was suitably adapted by the Catholic church. Other traditions in the world that lack these two elements

1. indigenous peoples of central Mexico, and
2. the Catholic church

cannot be considered the traditional Mexican Dia de los Muertos.

Even if there are also similar indigenous traditions in other parts of Latin America, these cannot be considered the same festivity, as the indigenous people are not the same (the background is different). This is not like Halloween, which for the most part has no background anymore, which can be "exported" to any country with ease: just dress up like a ghoul and ask for candy. The Dia de los Muertos festivity has its roots in indigenous traditions that cannot be replicated in other places, thus it cannot be homologated easily. In particular, this article should not mention any of the traditions in Asia, because they have a completely different background (no relation to Mesoamerican peoples and the church).

This also implies that perhaps the title of the article (or a separate article) should be in the Spanish language Dia de los Muertos, to distinguish it from a more generic Day of the Dead festivity.---189.250.222.74 (talk) 15:13, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

yes ...just 2 thank u all —Preceding unsigned comment added by 151.203.77.26 (talk) 21:43, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

"There is a movie called Day of the Dead (1985 film)"

{{Edit semi-protected}} Listed under "Film" in the "In popular culture" section. Has no relation to the holiday and is already listed on the disambiguation page. As it's irrelevant it should be removed. 128.114.59.217 (talk) 23:24, 31 October 2010 (UTC)

Done Stickee (talk) 22:14, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from 70.142.1.149, 1 November 2010

{{edit semi-protected}} as written: "Day of the Dead is also evolving at a cemetery near Hollywood.[7]" The name of the cemetery is Hollywood Forever Cemetery rewrite to say......evolving at Hollywood Forever Cemetery. go to: ladayofthedead.com or hollywoodforever.com 70.142.1.149 (talk) 02:48, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

Done Stickee (talk) 02:01, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

Regarding mention of Halloween in the lede

The current sentence "Due to occurring shortly after Halloween, the Day of the Dead is sometimes thought to be a similar holiday, although the two actually have little in common" is too arguable and should probably just be removed. A prior line "The celebration occurs on November 2 in connection with the Catholic holidays of All Saints' Day (November 1) and All Souls' Day (November 2)." exemplifies what the days have in common. Halloween is the ween (evening) before the Hallowed day (All Saints day). That is a pretty major thing to have in common. Again, easiest fix is removing the sentence. - Steve3849^talk 10:40, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

I have taken a much smaller measure, not as a complete remedy but as a (hopefully uncontroversial) step in the right direction.

The article wants something to explain clearly that the Day of the Dead is observed with a qualitatively different attitude than Halloween. This sentence and the one after it, as a single complete thought, were apparently intended to explain that (judging by page history). The whole passage isn't clear, and IMHO needs a complete overhaul —which isn't easy to do well— but meanwhile I have reverted this. "Eating" is strongly associated with Halloween in the United States, and removing it leaves the words "celebration" and "partying" free to be interpreted differently. --Pi zero (talk) 16:50, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

I didn't think removing the word "eating" resolved anything when if that sentence is a qualifying example for the previous sentence then it became less true because Halloween is a day when there is much "partying". So I changed the the text from having "little in common" (which is untrue because of their relation to All Saints Day and also in parts of Europe - Ireland for example - Halloween has been a day to recognize deceased loved ones) to "celebrated differently" which is more obvious and less arguable. - Steve3849^talk 15:51, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

Asunto de traducción.

Si bien es cierto que incluso en el norte de México se dice "Día de los muertos" es cierto que incurren en varios barbarismos tales como: bill para referirse a recibo, llama pa'atrás para decir devuélveme la llamada o vuelve a llamar, lo bajaron para decir que lo mataron y un largo etc.

Sin embargo la traducción de Day of the dead no es Día de los muertos es Día de muertos lo mismo ocurre con la frase Yes we can, si la traducimos palabra a palabra no se parece en nada al ¡sí se puede! Si en inglés es poco entendible o no existe una traducción aceptable de una frase o palabra del español mejor dejarla así de lo contrario se suscitan estas discusiones por pronombre en donde no debería de ir.

Xipe Ayotl (talk) 09:10, 15 July 2011 (UTC)

Novenario

In Los Angeles California (USA) the "celebration" (and we would be better served calling it a Wake or Memorial for the dead) lasts NINE days. Thus the "Day of the Dead" or "Dia de Los Muertos" starts nine (9) full days before November 2nd). I attended the service on October 25 (opening ceremony), 2011 at Olvera Plaza (or maybe Placita). The memorial and procession is sponsored individually by one of the Olvera Street merchants for each of the 9 nights. This Mexican custom is not limited to only November 2nd -although it is obviously the popular date. As for the deceased, the Mexican would "open their doors" and allow those who wished to pay their condolences, year round.69.108.119.251 (talk) 21:20, 26 October 2011 (UTC)

How could those pics help

i find most of the side pics extremely offensive and innacurate. Now im from a latin bloodline and celebrate the holiday myself. I find the stereotypeing my beliefs and demand these pictures be removed imediatly! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nopeengineeravi. (talk • contribs) 15:49, 27 October 2011 (UTC)

Mexican and other cultures

The first sentence says Mexican holiday celebrated ... in many cultures. I find this contradictory. My best interpretation of Mexican people is not genetic but cultural, in this context. It just cannot be that this cultural phenomenon is bound to a genetic race. So this sentence says that Day of the Dead is a holiday that belongs in the Mexican culture and many other cultures. --Ettrig (talk) 10:32, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 1 November 2012

In the first paragraph please change

"The celebration takes place on November 1, in connection with the Catholic holidays of All Saints' Day and All Souls' Day (November 2)."

to read

"The celebration takes place on November 1 and November 2, in connection with the Catholic holidays of All Saints' Day and All Souls' Day respectively. November 1 is generally referred to as Día de los Inocentes ("Day of the Innocents") but also as Día de los Angelitos ("Day of the Little Angels") and November 2 as Día de los Muertos or Día de los Difuntos ("Day of the Dead")"

because the current punctuation implies that the celebration takes place only on November 1 in relation to the two holidays, when in fact it takes place on both days for both Holidays, with midnight on November 2 typically beginning the honoring and celebration of the lives of the dead.

Thank You Mephisto1001 (talk) 15:08, 1 November 2012 (UTC)

Mephisto1001 (talk) 15:08, 1 November 2012 (UTC)

Partly done: I agree with the first part of your request and have changed it to maintain consistency with the rest of the article. I did not add your second requested sentence as it is already mentioned in a lower paragraph and would clutter the lead. —KuyaBriBri^Talk 14:33, 2 November 2012 (UTC)

Celebrating in Perú

Hello Wikipedia world! I found this page full of interesting facts, although some may seem incomplete or non-inclusive of all the factual information, it was still helpful for my learning purposes. In the spirit of collaborating, I wanted to take my first opportunity of posting to the talk page to describe some of the customs celebrated in Perú with respect to el Dia de los Muertos.

This holiday is celebrated on the 1st and 2nd of November every year. The custom is to create an altar with some of the deceased favorite foods and items of interest, candles, and flowers. In different parts of the country this is either done at the deceased house where it is then taken to the cemetery the next day or it is done at the cemetery the first day. Also, it is believed that the spirit of the dead will come back that night to enjoy the altars created; so some will stay up all night celebrating.

Reverence links: http://www.viajeros.com/articulos/dia-de-los-muertos-como-se-celebra-en-america-latina http://enperublog.com/2011/11/29/day-of-the-dead-in-peru/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Hoosiercard (talk • contribs) 01:46, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Omitted popular culture references

Hello, I am new to Wikipedia. I believe this article and its disambiguation links neglect two specific popular culture references to this holiday – Diego Rivera’s mural and the upcoming Disney film. These references signify the sustained relevance of this holiday during the past 89 years.

Day of the Dead is the title and subject of a mural painted by Mexican artist Diego Rivera in 1924. This mural is located at the Ministry of Education in Mexico City, Mexico.

In 2012, Disney–Pixar announced it would be creating a film based on the Day of the Dead holiday. Disney–Pixar sparked controversy in May 2013 when it attempted to trademark the holiday’s Spanish name – Día de Los Muertos – for film marketing purposes. Disney – Pixar later withdrew the trademark application stating the name of the film had been changed, although many speculated it was due to a social networking petition.

Reference links: http://www.xtimeline.com/evt/view.aspx?id=471317 http://www.wikipaintings.org/en/diego-rivera#supersized-muralism-213204 http://www.cnn.com/2013/05/10/us/disney-trademark-day-dead MeisaMae (talk) 23:55, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Often "in popular culture" additions aren't a good thing. See WP:POPCULTURE. I think the right way to see these is; does the fact that there is a mural by Rivera add to the knowledge about Day of the Dead? Possibly. Does Disney's overreach in trying to trademark the name? Probably not - that's an item about Disney, not about the holiday. When considering such additions, please be careful to avoid WP:CRUFT - the fact that a tie-in can be made does not necessarily increase the knowledge of the base subject. Regards, Tarl.Neustaedter (talk) 03:13, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Only some

Instead of "is a holiday celebrated in Mexico and by Latin Americans living in the United States and Canada", it should be "is a holiday celebrated in Mexico and by some Latin Americans living in the United States and Canada" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.150.163.164 (talk) 17:11, 3 October 2009 (UTC)

I agree.85.181.157.61 (talk) 19:25, 19 October 2013 (UTC)

Celebrations is a poor choice

Currently "The celebration occurs on November 2 in connection"

Shouldn't it be "The memorial parade occurs on November 2 in connection"

More so? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 144.132.1.124 (talk) 12:51, 18 April 2011 (UTC)

its actually right. but ehy is it salebrates in novembre?و — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.72.202.133 (talk) 21:26, 2 November 2013 (UTC)

No sources on this

"Scholars trace the origins of the modern Mexican holiday to indigenous observances dating back hundreds of years and to an Aztec festival dedicated to the goddess Mictecacihuatl. The holiday has spread throughout the world: In Brazil Dia de Finados is a public holiday that many Brazilians celebrate by visiting cemeteries and churches."

Christians have they own day of the dead, and there is no proof that the Brazilian dia of the dead is influenced in any form by the mexican one. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 151.42.25.44 (talk) 23:46, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

Is it 1, 2, or 3 days long?

While reading this article, I first got the impression that Day of the Dead was 1 day long: "... the day is a bank holiday", "Date: October 31". Reading further, I learn it is actually 3 days long: "The celebration takes place on October 31, November 1 and November 2", "Begins: October 31; Ends: November 2". Reading even further, however, I discover both of those are wrong and the holiday is actually 2 days long: "Duration: 2 days". So I give up. How long is Day of the Dead?? Kaldari (talk) 05:09, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

Duration varies by local tradition. In my experience (10 years) here, Ive seen anywhere from 1 to three days. Its it is one day, it is November 2, with November 1 and sometimes 31 October.Thelmadatter (talk) 03:09, 5 December 2013 (UTC)

Pixar project

Pixar is going to make a film about Dia de Los Muertos in 2016. 68.4.46.214 (talk) 14:47, 20 December 2013 (UTC)

 Not done The Pixar project is a movie tentatively titled Dia de los Muertos, not about day of the dead. It seems to be a zombie film of some sort, not relevant for this article about the holiday. Tarl.Neustaedter (talk) 16:01, 20 December 2013 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 5 February 2014

Pixar is going to make a film about Dia de los Muertos in TBA. 68.99.188.247 (talk) 00:14, 5 February 2014 (UTC)

Do you have a reliable source for this information? -- Fyrael (talk) 04:53, 5 February 2014 (UTC)

Try Pixar. I'd suggest it's too early. Once the movie has actually been made and a release date exists, it might be worth adding a disambiguation link to the movie page which will undoubtedly be created. Tarl.Neustaedter (talk) 05:05, 5 February 2014 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Also, you may want to see WP:CRYSTALBALL. — {{U|Technical 13}} ^{(t • e • c)} 19:20, 15 February 2014 (UTC)

Actual dates the children and adult spirits return for Dia de los Muertos

On a recent vacation trip to Oaxaca city for a tour of the area and Day of the Dead festivities, our tour guide said the children return on the night of November 1st and the adults return the night of November 2nd. Here are some links that state that these are the correct dates -

http://www.unm.edu/~htafoya/dayofthedead.html http://www.inside-mexico.com/featuredead.htm http://www.celebrate-day-of-the-dead.com/day-of-the-dead-facts.html http://banderasnews.com/0610/vl-dialosmuertos.htm

I also read one link that states what is mentioned in this article. Who would be the ultimate authority?

GlobalCitizenX (talk) 18:47, 24 September 2014 (UTC)

Possible error

In the side box the celebration are described as 'Synthetic Christian' - I think it more likely the author intended 'Syncretic Christian'. Auto-correct strikes again?

2601:9:680:7ED:9C2A:113C:EE6E:DC62 (talk) 13:26, 5 October 2014 (UTC)Tricia Rose rosamutabilis@gmail.com

Wrong dates for Day of the Dead

The following sentence: "The celebration takes place on October 31, November 1 and November 2, in connection with the triduum of Allhallowtide: All Hallows' Eve, Hallowmas, and All Souls' Day.[1][2] " Is incorrect Day of the Dead takes place on November 1st and 2nd and has zero connections to All Hallows' Eve, Hallowmas, and anything else to do with Halloween . The second source provided ("The Bread Basket") is very questionable, and I'm assuming this is the one used for the October 31st date.

Chilaquilx (talk) 20:55, 31 October 2014 (UTC) Mel (chilaquilx)

References

Semi-protected edit request on 1 November 2014

There is a typo in the fourth paragraph of the Intro to this article (beginning "Originally, the Day of the Dead as such ..."). The typo is in the second sentence, which begins, "However, in presence day Maxico,...". This should read "However, in present day Mexico..." Dmcesq (talk) 12:13, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

Done Cannolis (talk) 12:40, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

All Saints' Day in New Orleans

In some ways the New Orleans tradition of going to the cemeteries on All Saints Day is similar, yet different, from the Day of the Dead. In New Orleans on the day after Halloween, many take fresh flowers to the graves of their loved ones. They clean the graves and leave new flowers. Of course, most of the graves are above ground, because the city is generally below sea level. There is no iconography of skulls and skeletons, for that is over with Halloween. Still, the emphasis on the graves and thinking of lost relatives is similar to the Day of the Dead and occurs at the same time. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.62.80.50 (talk) 04:23, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

New Orleans reflects its European Catholic culture in the timing of this visiting cemeteries, and every culture has had some traditions of recognizing the dead. The Mexican Day of the Dead is one particular manifestation.Parkwells (talk) 15:05, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 2 November 2014

In one of the first few paragraphs of the article, triduum (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triduum) is incorrectly spelled tridium. 128.220.64.139 (talk) 15:23, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

 Done Thanks for pointing that out - Arjayay (talk) 16:43, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 2 November 2014

The SPANISH for Day of the Dead is : "Dia de LOS Muertos" Not "Dia de Muertos."

Thank you.

107.142.184.151 (talk) 19:22, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

 Not done As a literal translation, yes. But the name of the Mexican festividad (the subject of this article) is El Día de Muertos. Bagunceiro (talk) 20:38, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

Dia de Muertos is different from All Saints Day but it is hard to explain

I would like to stress that the article should refer only to the Mexican Dia de Muertos. By this I mean, this celebration is not the same as All Saints Day, rather it is a mix between the original traditions of the Aztecs and the Catholic festivity. This is something that most people in this Talk section fail to understand. This article is not about "how Mexicans celebrate the All Saints Day", Dia de Muertos has evolved in a festivity of its own which blends and overlaps with the All Saints Day. This is why it's so difficult to explain to a broader audience. Originally, it was a collection of pre-Columbian rites honouring the deceased; as the Spanish colonizers arrived, they took the rites and made them to coincide with the All Saints Day. This was the brilliance of their doing: instead of just banning and eradicating a pagan celebration, they shaped it, and brought it closer to Catholic traditions. This is how eventually the conquerors managed to gain the trust of the natives and convert them to the Christian faith, not by way of extermination, but by shaping their beliefs. I am not an expert, but I believe this contrasts with the way colonization happened in the modern United States and Canada.

To me, Dia de Muertos is an interesting phenomenon in that it basically consists of customs that are strictly pagan (not-Christian), but which nevertheless are observed by Mexican Catholics, but also by the general population, adherent to an organised religion or not. Why would the Catholic church tolerate a pagan rite then? My explanation is that Dia de Muertos is a harmless celebration that, in general, aligns with the principles of the church to promote good will (to remember the deceased, to be good and be aware of one's own mortality). So, even if some paganism is involved, as long as it keeps the people engaged in the church, everything is fine. Trying to set up a parallel example here, I feel it would be like a faithful Chinese Catholic setting an altar for Budda or similar. Strictly speaking, Budda is a pagan character, but as long as it does not go in confrontation with the Catholic belief system, everything is fine. 92.231.43.202 (talk) 20:18, 19 October 2013 (UTC)

"This is how eventually the conquerors managed to gain the trust of the natives and convert them to the Christian faith, not by way of extermination, but by shaping their beliefs."

Burning disbelievers at the stake also helped. Kaldari (talk) 01:11, 5 December 2013 (UTC)

Also, by discussing other cultures, their own traditions of honoring the dead get trivialized by a brief gloss in comparison to the Mexican Day of the Dead. Every culture has honored the dead. A non-Hispanic culture picking up elements of Day of the Dead is like the popular spread of Mardi Gras, increasingly removed from its origins.Parkwells (talk) 15:01, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

"Day of the Dead (Spanish: Día de Muertos) is a Mexican holiday observed throughout Mexico and around the world in other cultures." This should be edited so as not to read as if other countries around the world got their idea of this holiday directly from Mexican culture, unless they particularly did. If nothing else, the sentence tries to be too broad and ends up seeming to contradict itself.

I agree that ″the article should refer only to the Mexican Dia de Muertos″ and also (as Parkwells said) that ″by discussing other cultures, their own traditions of honoring the dead get trivialized by a brief gloss in comparison to the Mexican Day of the Dead. Every culture has honored the dead. A non-Hispanic culture picking up elements of Day of the Dead is like the popular spread of Mardi Gras, increasingly removed from its origins.″ Nlaylah (talk) 22:52, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 3 November 2014

Day of the Dead 24.165.80.219 (talk) 19:41, 3 November 2014 (UTC)

Not done: as you have not requested a change.
If you want to suggest a change, please request this in the form "Please replace XXX with YYY" or "Please add ZZZ between PPP and QQQ".
Please also cite reliable sources to back up your request, without which no information should be added to, or changed in, any article. - Arjayay (talk) 19:49, 3 November 2014 (UTC)

In Popular Culture?

Similar to other articles, I'd like to see a list of Day of the Dead in popular culture. Some possible inclusions: The Book of Life (2014 CG film) The Book of Life (2014) - While this involves the land of the dead, I'm can't recall if the actual holiday is involved. An upcoming untitled Pixar film about Día de los Muertos. Obviously, it shouldn't be added until there was more information about the film, or until it had been released. Grim Fandango (PC game) - I'm not sure if this is really related, or not (see the note for The Book of Life.) Day of the Dead: Día de los Muertos (2005 horror film) All Souls Day: Dia de los Muertos (2005) I'm sure there are many other films that touch on this, or feature a Day of the Dead celebration as an important part of the film. Literature is another area where there have probably been many titles devoted to this holiday.98.162.209.39 (talk) 22:07, 13 April 2015 (UTC)

31 October or 1 November

So when is it? I know from a long time that the day begins on November 1, but for some reason now the day begins on October 31. Which one is the correct one?--Rochelimit (talk) 13:14, 9 October 2015 (UTC)

It's spread across two days. Tarl.Neustaedter (talk) 15:57, 9 October 2015 (UTC)

No, it's not. Halloween is (barely) celebrated on October 31st, "Dia de todos los Santos" is celebrated on November 1st and "Dia de Muertos" is celebrated on November 2nd. Please add sources when writing down facts. Fladei (talk) 23:59, 26 October 2015 (UTC)

References

It begins at sundown the day before (Nov 1st). The next day is the _day_ of the celebration. In practice it runs two days (celebrations start early, before sundown, and run late after the next sundown), even though in theory it runs sundown Nov 1st to sundown Nov 2nd. Somehow the Spanish Wikipedia seems to have no trouble keeping this straight, but the English wikipedia continually argues the point. Tarl.Neustaedter (talk) 00:29, 27 October 2015 (UTC)

By the way, the 2nd reference offered above explains that in Michoacán, "Ofrendas" start on October 31st, dead children are celebrated on the 1st, while older people are celebrated on the 2nd. I don't recall that distinction in Mexico City when I lived there, but it doesn't surprise me. The "official" range of the holiday is far more theoretical than real. Tarl.Neustaedter (talk) 02:24, 28 October 2015 (UTC)

Why is "Día de los Muertos" called out as incorrect?

The wording "Día de los Muertos" occurs five times in the es.wikipedia.org article. If that formation is incorrect, it seems to be news to whomever wrote the Spanish article. 174.21.178.224 (talk) 22:26, 28 October 2015 (UTC)

Three of those are about a movie by that title (and the movie, named by anglos, is indeed named that). The other two are mistakes. Tarl.Neustaedter (talk) 22:31, 28 October 2015 (UTC)

Y'all may have already hashed this out, but I'm not quite sure where this idea that "Dia de los muertos" is incorrect comes from. I am not a native Spanish speaker, but many sites on the internet have "Dia de los muertos" first. These are things like the National Geographic Education site (http://education.nationalgeographic.com/media/dia-de-los-muertos/), Encyclopedia Britannica (http://www.britannica.com/topic/Day-of-the-Dead), and UNESCO (http://www.unesco.org/culture/ich/RL/00054). So are these well-respected organizations just wrong, or is it possible that either usage is correct? Applejuicefool (talk) 11:21, 29 October 2015 (UTC)

Check out the Spanish wikipedia. Many of the cases of adding "los" come from incorrect back-translation from English. The original name means something more like "day of dead bodies" or "day of corpses", but has been translated into english as "day of the dead". Translating that back into Spanish adds the "los". That said, in Mexico, people aren't particularly uptight about the name. Tarl.Neustaedter (talk) 18:24, 29 October 2015 (UTC)

I've just removed "incorrectly". It's an unnecessary judgement about who's what does it means to be this fuckin holiday right and who's wrong; let's take a descriptive approach instead. Maybe we could find and cite a reference about which regions prefer "Día de Muertos" and which prefer "Día de los Muertos". NathanWalther (talk) 23:55, 29 October 2015 (UTC)

Citation needed

"Scholars trace the origins of the modern Mexican holiday to indigenous observances dating back hundreds of years and to an Aztec festival dedicated to the goddess Mictecacihuatl."

Scholars are cited in the Lead but no citation is given. Reading the corresponding links does not point to any immediate citation either. Since the page is Semi-protected I resorted to discussion here. --Xavier (talk) 11:25, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 2 November 2015

Day of the Dead translates to Día de los Muertos; doesn't have "los" in first line Please change Día de Muertos to Día de los Muertos 65.51.210.178 (talk) 14:32, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

Not done: See the explanation in the second paragraph of the lede. Cannolis (talk) 15:10, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

The original translation is "Dia De Muertos", as the second paragraph of the Lead states. It later became known to become the version you requested.

--Xavier (talk) 16:17, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 11 April 2016

Category:Latin American Canadian culture 76.88.107.122 (talk) 05:52, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Not done. It's a Mexican holiday, not a Canadian one. Unless you have some specific reference in mind, it simply makes no sense. Tarl.Neustaedter (talk) 12:19, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

La Catrina

The Lady of the Dead that is described in this article is not La Catrina. That is incorrect. The Aztec Lady of the Dead, if you use that expression to refer to her, is called Mictecacihuatl,the Aztec goddess of death or "Lady of Death" and her consort, the god of death was Mictlantecuhtli. The confusion in this phrase confuses La Catrina, which translates to "the fancy lady", the male version being, "el catrin" or the dandy. This is a character that was invented by the artist, Jose Guadalupe Posada, who created a character in his wood block prints more famous than any skeleton image in all of Mexican art and she is a skeleton dressed in Victorian Era dress. She was used as a character to poke fun at the wealthy women of Mexico.

There are so many incorrect statements in this page that I need a week to correct all of them. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2602:306:C5DB:1FF0:ED8E:F0BD:5CAC:B043 (talk) 01:42, 19 September 2016 (UTC)

I would suggest you discuss your changes here before making any massive changes. Any change you make is required to be backed up by a citation from a reliable source (see WP:RS for more specific definition). We can help you sort out what makes sense before you invest a lot of effort in changes which could get lost. Regards, Tarl N. (discuss) 02:44, 19 September 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 5 October 2016

sugar skulls are candy and a decorative item for the mexican holiday called day of the dead

66.76.112.130 (talk) 19:19, 5 October 2016 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. — Andy W. (talk · ctb) 20:23, 5 October 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 7 October 2016

I would like a source for high casualty rate for Latinos as some sources claim that Caucasians represent disproportionate number of casualties.

192.89.97.1 (talk) 09:58, 7 October 2016 (UTC)

 Not done You will need to provide that source. —MRD2014 (talk • contribs) 14:05, 7 October 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 11 October 2016

Featured in a scene in the 2015 movie "spectre"

Flyboy112286 (talk) 22:44, 11 October 2016 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. — Andy W. (talk · ctb) 05:34, 12 October 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 19 October 2016

2607:FCC8:8BC9:2F00:7D3D:417D:287F:B085 (talk) 21:19, 19 October 2016 (UTC)

The average amount of people that come and celebrate this day is about 2,500,000 people.

Not done: as you have not cited reliable sources to back up your request, without which no information should be added to, or changed in, any article. - Arjayay (talk) 09:00, 20 October 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protection edit request on 25 October

Under the Latin America subsection of the Observances outside Mexico section, the last paragraph is on the subject of a holiday in Belize similar to Día de los Muertos. The problem is, the grammar is atrocious. If anyone can fix that, please do. Schnozzberry64 (talk) 00:56, 26 October 2016 (UTC)

Public holiday?

Our article claims

It is particularly celebrated in Mexico where the day is a public holiday.

yet Public holidays in Mexico lists it under "Festivities" and claims

It is not a state holiday.

Maybe this could be clarified. Are schools and government offices open on Nov 1/Nov 2; do people have to go to work? AxelBoldt (talk) 15:02, 30 October 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 2 November 2016

In the last paragraph, please change the word PERSONS to PEOPLE

"...which was attended by 250,000 persons."

This was probably a back-translation.

Thank you.

189.211.225.68 (talk) 08:17, 2 November 2016 (UTC)

 Done - and another use further up the page - Arjayay (talk) 10:15, 2 November 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 2 November 2016

Please change Día de muertos to Día de los Muertos

12.187.245.5 (talk) 12:42, 2 November 2016 (UTC)

 Not done As can be seen from the Spanish article here Día de Muertos is correct; but as the English article states "The holiday is sometimes called Día de los Muertos in Anglophone countries" - Arjayay (talk) 13:09, 2 November 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 2 November 2016

The Spanish translation of "Day of the Dead" should be "Día de los muertos," not "Día de Muertos." Per Spanish grammar rules, muertos should not be capitalized and a los should be included between de and muertos.161.28.142.20 (talk) 15:18, 2 November 2016 (UTC)

161.28.142.20 (talk) 15:18, 2 November 2016 (UTC)

 Not done - as explained above - Arjayay (talk) 15:26, 2 November 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 2 November 2016

Hello All, I was wondering if I could add information to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Day_of_the_Dead See, there is more information that would be beneficial to add, the explanation of the use of altars, what altars should look like, the symbolism behind the altars, what items are in the altars and the symbolism of the items placed on the altars. Please allow me to add that information. Thank you, Denise Flotte

Deniseflotte (talk) 18:11, 2 November 2016 (UTC)

 Not done This is not the right page to request additional user rights.
If you want to suggest a change, please request this in the form "Please replace XXX with YYY" or "Please add ZZZ between PPP and QQQ".
Please also cite reliable sources to back up your request, without which no information should be added to, or changed in, any article. - Arjayay (talk) 18:16, 2 November 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 2 November 2016

Mexican's aren't Spanish and our language isn't Spanish either. It's Mexican Chicano / Chicana. Thanks

47.44.0.98 (talk) 21:30, 2 November 2016 (UTC)

Dia de los Muertos

Day of the Dead is not Dia de Muertos in Spanish, it is Dia de los Muertos.24.44.85.61 (talk) 23:10, 2 November 2016 (UTC)

This question has already been answered twice. Please see the above posts. Thanks, SilverplateDelta (talk) 14:34, 3 November 2016 (UTC)

External links modified

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External links modified

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Create a section titled The Altar and the Ofrendas

I propose to add a secperate section dedicated to the altar and the ofrendas. This is dispersed throughout the article and it would be more cohesive to have it in one location and to include more of the traditional offendas and their meaning. I propose to include the following: Ofrendas include symbols that represent the four elements, earth, wind, water, and fire, are placed on the altar. Earth is represented by clay bowls filled with seasonal fruits,[picado]represents the wind (it also symbolizes the festive spirit of the celebration), water is offered in a clear glass so that the returning soul can quench their thirst, and candles are are used to guide the way back to this earth. Additionaly, salt is necessary to purtify the spirits, copal [[5]]or other incense is used to clear the space of negative energy. The fragrant smell of the Cempazuchil (marigolds)is used to lure the sprits back. 68.99.205.238 (talk) 04:36, 4 October 2017 (UTC)

References

Semi-protected edit request on 18 October 2017

Please change the title of the Article and all other references to 'day of the dead' change it to "dia de los Muertos", it is called "Dia de los Muertos" not the colonized English version "day of the dead". Please be mindful of the work that is happening to decolonize elements of culture that are NOT english, and help keep them in their cultural language, this event is one such celebration that must retain it's Spanish title simply because too many westerners are putting it together with halloween, and "Dia de los Muertos" IS NOT halloween. Please change this. I run a non-profit in Canada and as we are working here in this country to undo colonization, we are working really hard to take back what belongs to us and not to the English language. As we had to learn english when we arrived, so too people must start to learn Spanish especially for these very important events in our culture, that is respect. Limechip (talk) 20:47, 18 October 2017 (UTC)

Not done: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit semi-protected}} template. Sakura Cartelet ^Talk 21:15, 18 October 2017 (UTC)

The proper forum for this request is WP:RM. —KuyaBriBri^Talk 21:17, 18 October 2017 (UTC)

Macario film

In the "popular culture" section, the mexican film Macario should be added to the list. Since the film was the first mexican film to be nominated to an academy award and the film takes place in the Dia de Muertos. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 189.175.109.145 (talk) 04:30, 30 October 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 27 October 2017

I hope to relace the existing section titled "Food" with the following:

During Day of the Dead festivities, food is both eaten by living people and offered to the spirits of their departed ancestors. Tamales, “packages of masa, or dough made from corn flour, wrapped in aromatic leaves, usually corn husks or banana leaves, and steam cooked,” are one of the most common dishes prepared for this day. They can also be used as ofrendas for Day of the Dead. Tamales contain a large variety of fillings and are commonly served during Mexican celebrations.

One the other hand, pan de muerto and sugar skulls are associated specifically with Day of the Dead. Pan de muerto is a type of sweet role. The specific recipes vary by region, but it is often baked with anise seeds or orange flavor. This bread is composed of a round base with patterns on top. Often, these patterns represent either teardrops or the bones found within a human hand (Wikpedia – Pan de Muerto). Calaveras, or sugar skulls, also tend to display decoration. “The colorful designs [found on the calaveras] represent the vitality of life and individual personality”. Pan de muerto and calaveras are both used as ofrenas.

In addition to food, drink is also important to the tradition of Day of the Dead. Historically, pulque was the main alcoholic drink people consumed while celebrating this holiday. However, a variety of other drinks are common today. Families will often drink the favorite beverage of their deceased ancestors. S.violetgrass (talk) 03:41, 27 October 2017 (UTC)

Partly done: Some of this material was integrated into the current Food section instead of replacing it. This is for two reasons: 1, some of the existing material was better-sourced and 2, there were multiple refereencing issues in the proposed text. @S.violetgrass:, we don't use other Wikipedia articles as sources, we just link to them so the reader can follow themselves. Also, when we use a reference multiple times, The first time we use <ref name="some identifying name"></ref> the first time and <ref name="previous identifying name" /> each succeeding time. You can read Help:Referencing for beginners for more information.Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 22:04, 27 October 2017 (UTC)

Nice additions and good information using an encyclopedic tone. Perhaps you could add any of your unused references to a "Further readings" section or create an "External links" section to share your articles with others.Emilyelizabeth20 (talk) 00:26, 28 October 2017 (UTC)

Thank you, @Emilyelizabeth20: for the kind words. I think I used all of the external sources proposed by S.violetgrass so I don't think there' much left for the EL section. I could obviously be wrong. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 04:41, 30 October 2017 (UTC)

References

Dates of the day of the dead

The Day of the Dead or so called 'dia de muertos' is celebrated on November 2nd. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:2C1:8800:12CD:8109:9D9F:484C:452F (talk) 22:32, 31 October 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 2 November 2017

Fiestas mexicanas celebradas en todo México, en particular las regiones Central y Sur, y por personas de ascendencia mexicana que viven en otros lugares, especialmente en los Estados Unidos. Es reconocido internacionalmente en muchas otras culturas. Las vacaciones de varios días se centran en las reuniones de familiares y amigos para orar y recordar a los amigos y familiares que han muerto, y ayudar a apoyar su viaje espiritual. En 2008, la tradición fue inscrita en la Lista Representativa del Patrimonio Cultural Inmaterial de la Humanidad por la UNESCO 71.169.165.176 (talk) 10:03, 2 November 2017 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. DRAGON BOOSTER ★ 10:53, 2 November 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 2 November 2017

I am Mexican with PhD degree, and I completely disagree that the description pointed out an association between "October 31" and "November 1-2". November 1 and 2 belong to the traditional DIA DE LOS MUERTOS and it is a completely independent from Halloween. Both traditions should be keep separately, both have importance, both have different perspectives and history. 198.202.68.151 (talk) 16:33, 2 November 2017 (UTC)

Not done for now: Hello and welcome and thank you for this information. Unfortunately, we cannot make changes based on it yet. While we welcome and encourage input from everyone, we don't generally make edits based on claims of personal knowledge. Anyone can make such a claim, after all. I can just as easily claim that I am the Assistant Director of FONCA and dispute your statement. This is why we rely on outside documented sources to verify statements made in Wikipedia. I would encourage you to find some such source that we can use to cite for the separation between Oct 31 and Nov 1-2. Thank you. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 16:58, 2 November 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 8 November 2017

92.207.179.162 (talk) 09:49, 8 November 2017 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format.  — Ammarpad (talk) 10:43, 8 November 2017 (UTC )

Semi-protected edit request on 4 March 2018

Ruben bardales85 (talk) 03:13, 4 March 2018 (UTC)

Day of the Dead is not a Mexican celebration fgggggggggggggggor definition, because Mexico doesn't exist 3000 years ago. "Rituals celebrating the deaths of ancestors had been observed by these civilizations perhaps for as long as 2,500–3,000 years."

Day of the Dead is also celebrated in Central America, Guatemala, Honduras, El Salvador...ect. The Hole region is called "New Spain".

The origin of Day of the Dead is Mayan, Olmeca, Tolteca, Aztecs...

Mexico born in 1821 like a nation.

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. JTP ^{(talk • contribs)} 03:14, 5 March 2018 (UTC)