Template talk:Jct/Archive/2010

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South Carolina state banners

Resolved
 – Fixed by TMF. --Fredddie™ 17:02, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

First, they are not utilizing the South Carolina banners, such as File:Business plate South Carolina.svg. Second, they are left-aligned to the shield and not centered. --Fredddie™ 03:20, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

Fixed for SC-Alt; SC-Bus already works. I don't know if we need any other types for SC; let me know if we do. – TMF 03:39, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

Puerto Rico highways

This template apparently only seems to show shields for the Primary highways in Puerto Rico (a.k.a. the blue and white shields). Is there any way this template can be modified to allow the Urban Primary (black and white shields), Secondary (blue and gold County-style shields), and Tertiary (black and white circle signs)? ANDROS1337 19:42, 14 May 2010 (UTC)

{{Jct|state=PR|PR|1|Urban|1|Sec|1|Ter|1}} will produce PR-1 / PR-1 / PR-1 / PR-1
All the links will point to Puerto Rico Highway X, but the shields will be different. —Fredddie™ 21:31, 14 May 2010 (UTC)
I have also set up the templates for using 'urban', 'sec', and 'ter' with {{Infobox road small}} if so desired. —Fredddie™ 21:50, 14 May 2010 (UTC)

Making aware of editprotected on subpage

See Template talk:Jct/shield#Edit request: Red linked images. --Izno (talk) 03:28, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

Adding country param

I had a brief read through the Globalization section in the archive talk and thought that since {{Infobox road}} now supports a |country= parameter, it would be good if Jct could also support a |country= parameter so that pages such as Japan National Route 20 don't use things such as |state=Japan.

In {{Jct/sandbox}}, {{Jct/1/sandbox}} and {{Jct/2/sandbox}}, I've setup a version which supports country by using the shield, abbrev & link templates from Template:Infobox road/doc/country for the country specified.

Here's a few examples for Japan:

Template Result 
{{Jct|state=Japan|Route|1}}
 
{{Jct/sandbox|country=JPN|National|1}}
 
{{Jct|state=Japan|Route|1|Route|2}}
 
{{Jct/sandbox|country=JPN|National|1|National|2}}

I haven't added any support for the dir, to, name, road or city set of parameters but I don't see that they are needed that much. Also, I've currently only done support for 2 junctions but can easily do support for 3 & 4 if this is implemented.

Comments welcome. -- WOSlinker (talk) 18:46, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

Well, I think after the IR overhaul, the next project was to do some work to harmonize {{infobox road small}} (IRS) to match, using the back end of IR. We've tossed around updating jct, but thought that that might be a 2011 project, since jct uses the old IR backend templates in places. I think some of us are a bit ready for a break on the template coding, but your idea sounds great. Imzadi 1979 → 18:55, 25 June 2010 (UTC)
I've written the changes so that it uses the new coding if country is set and the current coding if country is not set. So it's more of a minor change at the moment rather than a full re-write. That can be done later on. -- WOSlinker (talk) 19:12, 25 June 2010 (UTC)
I agree with the idea of making jct use the new IBR templates, but this is going to be a huge undertaking that may best be postponed to a later date. --Rschen7754 19:37, 25 June 2010 (UTC)
As an aside, would it be possible to turn on the redlinks for missing shields in the sandbox only? If we're going to tackle this behemoth, we're going to need to see what the shield subtemplate is outputting. —Fredddie™ 21:10, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

State Business routes

Good morning, how much of a hassle would it be to add State business routes to the jct coding? I have a highway that ends at a state business route, and would like to add the TX-Bus coding if possible. 25or6to4 (talk) 16:08, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

 Done The template already supports TX business routes; I just needed to set up a couple of redirects to make TX-Bus work. – TMF 16:16, 7 July 2010 (UTC)
Thanks. Was there different coding i was supposed to use? 25or6to4 (talk) 16:22, 7 July 2010 (UTC)
No, ideally, <state>-Bus, SH-Bus, and SR-Bus should all work, but whoever set up TX only set up SH-Bus. – TMF 16:33, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

Updating Jct

I've now taken this all a little further and produced a sandbox version that just uses the new Infobox road subtemplates. I've done some test cases so that we can see how it's all going. There are a few isuses still with some road types which I think is mainly due to them not being in the link and abbrev templates.

Any thoughts? -- WOSlinker (talk) 19:07, 5 July 2010 (UTC)

Many of the "missing" types (like "State", "ILL" or "Illinois Route") are missing because they're extraneous or redundant to the types already available. Additionally, in most cases, they're not used. Judging by the testcases, most if not all of the essential "meta" types are there; we just need to add in some of the more esoteric ones like "GRR" (for the Great River Road). As an aside, I had planned on giving Jct its own data subtemplates if and when I revamped it; however, this option could work too if the link/abbrev templates don't get overloaded with the one-off types. – TMF 19:52, 5 July 2010 (UTC)
Yes, WOSlinker, one simple thought first. Can we complete the tasks with the infobox updates first before moving on to the next template updates? {{Infobox road small}} has now been updated to use the new backend from {{infobox road}}. The benefit is that IRS now works for any country that IR supports. There are still potential consolidations to make with IR/IRS.
Currently, jct is using the old IR subtemplates, which aren't in use by IR or IRS now. I know that I would like to see jct having its own subtemplates. As more countries are added to IR/IRS and the complete sets of subtemplates are created, I see that it would be tempting to use those subtemplates for jct, but I think it would be better to keep the two templates separate. The test cases above are appearing in Category:Infobox road transclusion errors. Any further linkage between jct and the new IR would do the same with the live template. Jct should use its own tracking categories for errors, and it's easy to copy the content of an IR subtemplate into the corresponding jct subtemplate. I don't know if the changes for IR/IRS concerning banner plates would break that functionality in jct or now, but it appears so. Additionally, there are types of roads set up for jct that aren't set up for IR/IRS, and may never be needed for infoboxes. Things like Forest Routes, Indian Routes probably don't need infoboxes at any point, but are supported by jct now. Imzadi 1979 → 19:54, 5 July 2010 (UTC)
Agreed. We're having difficulties convincing Ontario (Canada), the UK, and New Zealand to consolidate their infoboxes into IBR, and we could use some help there. --Rschen7754 20:04, 5 July 2010 (UTC)
I've thought about the situation a bit more, and I firmly believe now that making separate subtemplates for Jct is the best way to go. There's the issue of the one-off types like "GRR" which are used only by Jct, and adding them to the new IBR subtemplates would just add unneeded noise to them. The issue that almost ensures that separate subtemplates have to be made, though, are the special routes. How the "new" IBR handles them and how Jct handles them are totally different. In IBR, they're split up into type and subtype, which has the benefit of making the banner and name coding much, much easier than it was before. In Jct, they're passed in together as a single type, and there's no way to split them up to use the IBR subtemplates without massively complicating the code of the IBR subtemplates in the form of adding line upon line of extraneous code to them. The types could be split up in the Jct input, but I don't believe there's a benefit to doing so.
Instead, I think the best way to go is to set up subtemplates in the form of "Template:Jct/shield/<country>/<type>" or even just "Template:Jct/shield/<country>", and so on with the rest of the types. I'm willing to begin looking into how these proposed subtemplates would work; however, I don't have the time IRL to do so for another week. – TMF 06:18, 6 July 2010 (UTC)
The reason I used the new templates from Infobox road is that is looked as though the browse functionality was very similar to the jct functionality. Perhaps as some time in the future once jct has been redeveloped, the IBR browse could call jct instead of doing all the work itself. -- WOSlinker (talk) 06:42, 6 July 2010 (UTC)

Yes, there's still quite a bit of work to do on converting articles to use the IBR template, but I though I'd start to collect together various shield templates into one location. There are currently all at Category:Road marker templates for work on in the future. -- WOSlinker (talk) 21:16, 15 July 2010 (UTC)

Nonbreaking spaces and en dashes

Just a quick query to those in the know, but when the template is used to list control cities, there should be a non-breaking space before the en dash that separates the highway and road names from the city names. Those spaces have been inserted enough times manually at FACs for "<street> – <city>" combos coded by hand. Imzadi 1979 → 10:01, 26 September 2010 (UTC)

Spur plate

I noticed most of the other plates and shields are no longer linked, but the Spur plate is, for example:


SR 903 Spur

I don't recall if they are supposed to be or not, but can someone enlighten me / correct the issue? --Admrboltz (talk) 19:17, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

 Done I've removed the link and also from a couple of other Spur templates as well. -- WOSlinker (talk) 19:59, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

Virginia Secondary shields

I just noticed that, lately, the jct template is using "Circle sign 613.svg" instead of "Iowa 613.svg". The former is an oval shield with 613 in it, which is wrong for Virginia Secondary shields. It should be circular, as in "Iowa 613.svg". This is the only one I've noticed so far; there may be others. Please change this back. --Tim Sabin (talk) 22:06, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

Actually, they shouldn't be using Iowa X.svg shields. Plans have been set in motion to get the circle sign shields changed to actual circles. –Fredddie™ 22:22, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

Initial support for different countries

Last time I looked at doing this, I was a bit too ambitious. This time, its going to be a bit simpler and more gradual. It will still work the same as it currently does when just passing over the state value but will also allow expansion by using a countty param.

Changes will be as follows:

After all those changes are done, I will then look at the What links here for Template:Jct/shield/TEMP and update those transclusions to use a country param and create a suitable Jct/shield/*country* & Jct/link/*country* for them.

An thoughts before I go ahead? -- WOSlinker (talk) 10:07, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

The changes have been done & I've updated all the non- USA & CAN transclusions to use the country param. -- WOSlinker (talk) 22:56, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

Revamp of aux plate handling/storage

I'm about to replace the current contents of Template:Jct/banner with a new system that's a bit more streamlined and organized. Banners may (and likely will) be broken for the next few minutes; however, they'll be back once the rest of the new system set up. – TMF 07:06, 10 November 2010 (UTC)

Should be good to go. If you see any articles with broken banners, feel free to post them here. – TMF 07:33, 10 November 2010 (UTC)

dab in abbrev_X

Texas distinguishes their business routes with a letter, so one specific business route would be Bus. 19-F. In {{Jct}}, we can distinguish with a dab:

{{Jct|state=TX|TX-Bus|19|dab1=F}}
Bus. SH 19

The problem is that Template:Infobox road/TX/abbrev TX-Bus is coded to show the dab when it's used; the above should say Bus. 19-F. Can anyone take a look at this? Thanks. –Fredddie™ 03:50, 10 November 2010 (UTC)

 Done – TMF 02:19, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

Broken: OR-Bus

Resolved
 – Fixed Interstate 5 in Oregon, thanks! Admrboltz (talk) 18:04, 13 November 2010 (UTC)



 OR 22 / OR 99E Bus. north – Stayton, Detroit Lake, Bend

Thoughts? --Admrboltz (talk) 16:58, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

Got it. It was tricky and I may have broken some other things, but this works. –Fredddie™ 17:52, 13 November 2010 (UTC)
Yeap, that bug's on me. In a nutshell, when I converted the old Jct/US-Bus template into the Jct/banner/US template, I changed a couple of ifeqs to switches without updating the syntax, resulting in the spacing error. The implemented fix was OK; however, I removed the pipe templates and replaced them with pipes since they're not needed in this case (the parser's able to tell the difference between pipes that lie inside of file markup and those that lie outside it) and I added a couple of iferror calls to fix a bug where the template would break if the route number had a letter in it. – TMF 09:17, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

Jct/plate broken on Washington State Route 22

Resolved
 – Thanks! Admrboltz (talk) 16:18, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

{{Jct|state=WA|I|82|US|12}} {{Jct|state=WA|I|82|US|12|city1=Yakima}}

I-82 / US 12 I-82 / US 12 – Yakima

Not quite sure why the bottom one works but the top one freaks out... --Admrboltz (talk) 15:44, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

There was a double redirect on Template:Jct/plate/WA/2, which I've fixed. -- WOSlinker (talk) 16:15, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

This template would be well served if it had more examples

There are not enough examples given, such that would cover all of the parameters of the template -- to1=, road=, county1-4=.

Examples (including the ones already used) would serve the reader better if they were chosen (in the case of US roads) from among roads that most people have heard about or are already familiar with: Interstate 5, Interstate 95, Route 128 (Boston), Interstate 610 (Texas), Beltway 8 (Houston), Penn Turnpike, NJ Parkway, US Route 66, NY State Thruway, etc. These are all roads that could be used in the examples; instead, more obscure roads were used. Mercy11 (talk) 15:54, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

There is a plan to rewrite the documentation page for this template along the lines of {{infobox road}}, especially since this template has been internationalized for other countries to some degree. (I wouldn't call A1A in Florida "obscure" though.) Imzadi 1979 → 19:10, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

There are the test cases that WOSlinker (talk · contribs) set up... –Fredddie™ 22:40, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

There are some slightly better examples on the main testcase page (Template:Jct/testcases) though. While using the numbered params is very well covered by those testcases, the other named params: county1, dab1, denom1, dir1, to1, name1, road, city1, areadab1, countydab1 & location1 (all with 1-4 numbers) are not covered as well in the docs and also in could be made more clear that the (county1, dab1, denom1, dir1, to1, name1) params are not related in any way to the (city1, areadab1, countydab1 & location1) params. There has been work on internationalising the template, but there are still some of those parameters; above; that are for USA & CAN only. I could help with updating the docs but my experience on USA & CAN roads is a little limited. -- WOSlinker (talk) 22:57, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

using the road parameter

I've noticed that when {{{road}}} is used, you can't use {{{to#}}} with it. Here's how I'd like to use it:

{{Jct|state=IA|US|63|dir1=South|to2=y|road|[[Iowa Highway 934|University Avenue]]}}

 US 63 south to University Avenue

Here's my current workaround:

{{Jct|state=IA|US|63|dir1=South|to2=y|IA|934|name2=University Avenue|noshield2=934}}

 US 63 south to Iowa 934 (University Avenue)

Is there some obscure alternative I don't know about? –Fredddie™ 17:02, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

I've added a toroad param to do what you want. -- WOSlinker (talk) 18:51, 26 November 2010 (UTC)
{{Jct|state=IA|US|63|dir1=South|toroad=y|road|[[Iowa Highway 934|University Avenue]]}}

 US 63 south / University Avenue
Perfect. Thanks. –Fredddie™ 19:11, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

Prince Edward Island route links

Currently |state=PE links articles to Route xx (Prince Edward Island). This should be changed to Prince Edward Island Route XX to avoid pointless redirects. --Admrboltz (talk) 02:24, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

 Done – TMF 02:29, 19 December 2010 (UTC)
Thanks! --Admrboltz (talk) 02:49, 19 December 2010 (UTC)
Shouldn't those articles be using |province=PE anyway? Imzadi 1979 → 03:22, 19 December 2010 (UTC)
"If the route is located in the United States or Canada and the route is located within one state or province the in is possible to use state without setting the country. Accepted values for state are as follows: U.S. state: the two-letter postal abbreviation of the state; Canadian province: the two-letter postal abbreviation of the province." Anyways using province alone, or country=CAN and the province breaks the template. --Admrboltz (talk) 03:27, 19 December 2010 (UTC)
Hmm... WOS's globalization didn't take fully then. Sorry. It's supposed to work though. Imzadi 1979 → 03:32, 19 December 2010 (UTC)
Yeah... All the Canada articles that use {{Jct}} use |state=XX from what I can tell. If / when this is changed, it will be a pretty big AWB job... --Admrboltz (talk) 03:42, 19 December 2010 (UTC)
I've added province as an alternative to state. state still works though. -- WOSlinker (talk) 10:33, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

E-470 Toll Plate


 E-470 to I-70 – Colorado Springs, Fort Collins

I would like File:Toll plate yellow.svg to appear over the E-470 shield when it is called, but am not sure how to make this happen. I think it should be signed like this as all BGS and Jct signs for the road mark the highway as a tollway (I'm ok with toll to make it legible). --Admrboltz (talk) 18:13, 29 December 2010 (UTC)

I'm not aware of the jct template using the "toll" banner in any other implementations, whether the banner plate is actually used on signs in the field or not. Since it's not actually part of the road's name, I don't think it's necessary to include the "toll" banner. -- LJ ↗ 09:32, 31 December 2010 (UTC)
Yellow toll plates are a new requirement from the 2009 MUTCD. We haven't gotten around to rolling it out yet in the template partially because the states haven't rolled it out much yet. The new I-376 extension in PA though has it, so jct entries for that section of the freeway would be appropriate candidates to add the toll plate. Personally, I'm in favor of using it, if we can. Imzadi 1979 → 16:04, 31 December 2010 (UTC)
Ping? --Admrboltz (talk) 01:41, 5 January 2011 (UTC)
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