Talk:William Roberts & Co of Nelson

A fact from William Roberts & Co of Nelson appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 12 May 2013 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that engines made by William Roberts & Co of Nelson are still steamed regularly?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2013/May. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/William Roberts & Co of Burnley.

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Name[edit]

Why is this article called "William Roberts & Co of Burnley" and not "William Roberts & Co of Nelson"? --Trappedinburnley (talk) 12:17, 5 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Now moved. -- Daemonic Kangaroo (talk) 13:02, 5 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Earlesheaton[edit]

I'm sure this is a typo but I can't quite decide where it should be. There is a suberb of Newton-le-willows called Earlestown? --Trappedinburnley (talk) 12:17, 5 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I found a area in Dewsbury called Earlesheaton, but seems to be too distant, so I'm going to assume that it is a typo in the source and change it.--Trappedinburnley (talk) 16:33, 10 May 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Burnley Ironworks[edit]

As it reads at the moment this article seems to imply that Burnley Ironworks shut in 1861. This is definitely not the case, there is a Corliss engine that they built in 1903 sitting in the Science Museum. I can't quite remember the exact details (or find the book I have), but I believe that was just when the Marsland's involvement with the company ended. --Trappedinburnley (talk) 13:39, 5 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Chronology[edit]

We seem to have:

August 1862 - Marsland, Roberts and Company founded
1866 - William Marsland died
July 1867 - Company bought by John Brennand
March 1870 - "William Roberts & Co" - London Gazette link
- 1894 - Trading as "William Roberts & Sons Ltd" (see below)
- 1895 - Eastablished as "William Roberts & Co Ltd"
1959 - foundry closed

But no mention of the change of name to "William Roberts & Co" or "William Roberts & Sons"! Nor of Roberts' involvement ceasing.

Even more confusingly, Grace has "1871 William Roberts bought the company".

Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 19:21, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Yes we could definitely do with more sources. I'd like to get eyes on a copy of "Stationary steam engine makers, Volume 2" (2006), hopefully someone can save me from having to drag myself to the library! --Trappedinburnley (talk) 23:21, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe User:ClemRutter has a copy? --Trappedinburnley (talk) 19:11, 9 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Todays addition (which I have no reason to think is incorrect) only deepens the confusion. I'm wondering if the nameplate is the original installed in with the engine in 1894? The only other option that I can see is that separate but related companies where operating from the foundry simultaneously? --Trappedinburnley (talk) 18:17, 9 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Stanley Graham shows an identical plate in Bancroft *Graham, Stanley (2008). Bancroft:The story of a Pennine weaving shed. lulu.com. ISBN 9 781409-255789. {{cite book}}: Invalid |ref=harv (help) page 155., this was attached to a 1920 600hp cross- compound. I am reading it now for new article on User:ClemRutter/sandbox3. If you read the QSM article it explains there was a rebuild c1918 when they moved from slide valves to Corliss, which could explain why the plates are identical. Good luck. No, I don't have that book. -- Clem Rutter (talk) 19:50, 9 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Railway[edit]

The coordinates we have show the site of the foundry as being alongside a main railway line. It may be worth checking local railway histories for pictures or maps or other details of any sidings, etc. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 19:32, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I'm assuming you wish to verify the coords I've used? I'm 100% sure that I've found the correct site as I checked the 1890s OS map of the area on LCC's MARIO site. While I can explain where to find it yourself I've never been able to figure out how to link directly to relevant map layer (OS First Edition 1:2,500 in this case). For what it's worth, the railway is elevated several metres at this point and the site is very close to the station. --Trappedinburnley (talk) 22:55, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

No, I was just thinking that we might be able to add a line or two about their use of railway freight services, if any. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 22:58, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Map shows a goods yard a couple of hundred metres WSW of the site, next to the passenger station. --Trappedinburnley (talk) 23:25, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Coordinates[edit]

The coordinates of this company's HQ should be in the infobox. Phoenix Foundry, Nelson, was unequivocally located at 53.8358 N 2.2126 W, which coordinates are still being used for the article as a whole. I reverted their removal, and have been reverted again. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 19:48, 1 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]