Talk:Tiger Stadium (Detroit)/Archive 1

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Archive 1

Upper deck bleachers ?

Someone just added "until the advent of multipurpose stadiums for baseball and football" to the comment "Had the only upper-deck bleachers in the major leagues". I question both comments. First, I think Ebbets Field had bleachers in its center field upper deck, though I'm not absolutely certain. Second, a large portion of Baltimore Memorial Stadium's upper deck was bleachers at one time... unless that's what the second writer is getting at. Third, I think both writers should cite some sources. Presumably the first writer means literally "bleachers", i.e. flat boards, as opposed to chair seats. The second writer should cite some examples of actual bleacher seating in the upper decks of the multi-purpose donuts of the 60s or whichever stadiums he's referring to. I think they were all or mostly chair seating. Finally, I could easily argue that Wrigley Field's upper center field bleacher area constitute an "upper deck". I'm thinking this entire sentence should be struck pending further research. In fact, I think I will do so. So there. :b Wahkeenah 06:50, 21 July 2005 (UTC)

The meaning of "bleachers" in this sense is meant to be the "benches" or "cheap seats" as opposed to a second deck with chair seats. Ebbetts Field did have a second deck in center field, but those were chairs, not benches. Flibirigit 05:09, 10 November 2006 (UTC)

Or does it mean uncovered, exposed. At Ebbets Field there were no uncovered seats, the roof extended over all seating areas. Shibe Park had a similiar design. In Baltimore, Memorial Stadium had single deck, uncovered "wings" in the outfield. They were the bleachers. The upper deck was part of the main grandstand. Since the entire facility was uncovered, there can be no structural distinction between "upper reserved seats" and "bleachers". Certainly, there is no "upper deck" in center field at Wrigley. Detroit's ballpark can claim the only upper deck bleachers ever in baseball AND the only "fully enclosed" multi-deck park from it's 1938 additions until the first donut (the Harris County Domed Stadium in Houston) was opened in 1964, followed by Atlanta, St. Louis and on and on. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 4.141.77.143 (talk) 07:36, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

The Ebbets Roof did not fully cover all seats (roofs seldom do), but the bleacher section did have a roof over part of it, as you say. So Tiger Stadium had the only uncovered upper deck bleachers. RFK Stadium's upper tier went all around the park, and it was opened for football in the fall of 1961, baseball in the spring of 1962. The Astrodome, which opened in 1965, not 1964, was originally a single deck in the outfield, but it was "enclosed" in a different way - by a dome, and hence no "bleaching" was possible unless they turned the lights up too high. The upper deck was extended later, as a concession for the Oilers, who eventually dumped Houston anyway and found another pigeon in Tennessee. Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? 12:07, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

New demolition

For those of you who don't know the tearing down of tiger stadium will occur in 2007.--Biggie 07:37, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

  • Yeh, sure. In 2006 they said it would be in 2006. Maybe they'll pass the hat during the World Series games, to take up a collection to pay the demolition guys, so they don't have to spend city money on it. Wahkeenah 10:04, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Disambiguation?

Hmmmm.... I'm struggling to determine if when someone types in "Tiger Stadium", do they mean the baseball stadium or LSU's stadium? I also wonder what the Wikipedia precendence is for moving an article to a disambiguation page? I'd say that a MLB baseball stadium has more importance than a college football stadium, regardless of capacity, but I'm not sure about a closed-down baseball stadium.

I guess I'm not sure that all the work that went into moving "Tiger Stadium" to "Tiger Stadium (Detroit)" was worth it, or even appropriate. X96lee15 22:46, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

Such a large reorganization should have been discussed first. Flibirigit 05:10, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
I am proposing one of the two options.
  1. That Tiger Stadium (Detroit) as it exists to be deleted for the reasons, it does NOT INCLUDE the edit history of the Tiger Stadium article. These edit histories are essential to Wikipedia.
  2. That a REQmove be done to merge and perserve edit histories. Flibirigit 05:24, 10 November 2006 (UTC)

Sorry for not discussing the "move" and sorry for not realizing how to properly move an article. I didn't think there would be anything controversial about the two major Tiger Stadiums agreeing not to hog the Tiger Stadium page. As for the edit history issue, I didn't think that would be a big deal. By moving Tiger Stadium to Tiger Stadium (Detroit), the old edit history would still always be at the original Tiger Stadium page for anyone who wanted to go back there looking for something. As you know, what I did was I cut-and-pasted the Tiger Stadium page over to Tiger Stadium Detroit. But I also did a google search to find all the instances of "Tiger Stadium" on wikipedia, and I went to a large number of those pages and changed the all links that pointed to Tiger Stadium and changed them so that they now point to Tiger Stadium (Detroit). Once again, sorry about that, but I didn't think it would be controversial. Anyway, the point is that this isn't something that is going to go away. In the years to come, more and more people will get frustrated by the fact that Detroit is hogging the Tiger Stadium page. Before the Tiger Stadium page was created on behalf of Detroit's Tiger Stadium, the creator should have searched the internet to make sure their wasn't any other major Tiger Stadium out there. Because of his or her negligence, that is why the situation is the way it is today. Wikiwopbop 06:27, 10 November 2006 (UTC)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the debate was move. -- tariqabjotu 04:41, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

Proposed Move

As per discussions above, I am inviting comments on whether the Tiger Stadium namespace should be the status quo, (reserved for the soon to be demolished baseball stadium in Detroit), or should it be switched to disambiguation page for all Tiger Stadiums. Please comment below. Thanks. Flibirigit 10:30, 10 November 2006 (UTC)

  • Switch Even though I am sentimentally attached to Tiger Stadium as a Detroit Tigers fan, I don't think a soon to be demolished stadium is prevalent enough to keep as a main namespace when there are other existing Tiger Stadiums. Flibirigit 10:38, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Switch I must admit that I am biased towards LSU and do a lot of work on LSU related pages, but the rational, unbiased side of me still believes that a switch to the disambiguation page is appropriate. Seancp 20:58, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Switch Granted that nobody outside the United States looking for "Tiger Stadium" is likely to know of the LSU stadium (or even of LSU or college sports in general), but if Tiger Stadium in Detroit is going to be demolished it shouldn't be the default. --Charlene 13:10, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
    • Based on Charlene's recent comments on her talk page, she lives in Calgary and used to live in Edmonton. So when she says "nobody outside the United States" she means "nobody in Canada." However, I don't think too many people outside the United States and Canada are going to be searching for an English-language page on a stadium for a team in a professional baseball league that only includes teams in the United States and one team in Toronto, Canada -- any more than they would be searching for an English-language page on LSU's stadium. Wikiwopbop 05:53, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Switch - maybe It has been 7 years since the Detroit Tigers played there, and LSU still plays at their own Tiger Stadium, presumably for the foreseeable future. But there is also an active Tiger Stadium for another school. The issue gets to be, which one of the three is the most recognizable "Tiger Stadium". Who, outside of Baton Rouge and the school's graduates, know about that stadium? But most of the millions of baseball fans older than mid-teen-age would have heard of the baseball stadium. However, having "Tiger Stadium (Detroit)" go to a disambiguation page seems reasonable on its face. Then the next step would be for someone to try to switch LSU's stadium to the "main" one. I suspect someone has that agenda in mind already. Wahkeenah 20:03, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
    • Comment per above -- I think it would better to leave Tiger Stadium (LSU) at that page. Flibirigit 20:12, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
    • As I should have made more clear above (in my post under the topic "Disambiguation?"), the purpose of this proposed move is to move the contents on the "Tiger Stadium" page to the "Tiger Stadium (Detroit)" page, and to make the "Tiger Stadium" page a disambiguation page with links to Tiger Stadium (Detroit), Tiger Stadium (LSU), and Tiger Stadium (West Alabama). This is precisely what I did on November 9th. Less than 8 hours later, Flibirigit reverted my changes and this discussion ensued. There is no support for LSU's stadium being moved to the main "Tiger Stadium" page. Wikiwopbop 05:53, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
    • Also, Wahkeenah severely underestimates the importance of LSU's Tiger Stadium. Wahkeenah's user page states that "I belong to the Church of Baseball." However, Wahkeenah is incorrect with his assumption that, outside of Baton Rouge and LSU's graduates, few people know about LSU's Tiger Stadium. LSU's Tiger Stadium is ranked the 2nd best college football stadium in the nation by Rivals.com [1], the 5th best college football stadium in the nation by CBS [2], the 6th best college football stadium in the nation by the Sportings News/MSNBC.com [3], and the 7th best college football stadium in the nation by the Football Digest [4]. To put that into perspective for you Detroit Tiger fans, LSU Tiger Stadium is ranked higher than the University of Michigan's football stadium in each of these rankings (Michigan's stadium was not ranked in the top 10 by Rivals.com, was ranked #11 by CBS, #7 by Sporting News/MSNBC, and #8 by the Football Digest). Granted, I'm not saying that LSU's Tiger Stadium is more known than Detroit's Tiger Stadium (after all, the Detroit Tigers are in a professional baseball league of only 30 teams, while LSU is only one of 119 teams in NCAA Division I-A football). Regardless, LSU's Tiger Stadium is widely know in college football. In fact, it is the 6th largest stadium in the United States (not including racetrack stadiums)[5]. Wikiwopbop 05:53, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Support. At this time there is probably no primary use. In fact this could probably been listed as uncontested. Vegaswikian 21:32, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
    • There was some objection earlier. See comments by User:X96lee15 in the section above. Flibirigit 22:05, 11 November 2006 (UTC)
    • Yes, but X96lee15 has kindly withdrawn his objection (see below). Wikiwopbop 05:53, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Switch Since there appears to be Wikipedia precedence for moving an article to a disambiguation page, then I think it's appropriate to move the baseball Tiger Stadium to Tiger Stadium (Detroit) and make Tiger Stadium a disambiguation page. X96lee15 00:03, 12 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Switch I want to thank all you Detroit Tiger fans for your vote to switch, especially Flibirigit and X96lee15 who were originally opposed to my attempt to move the contents on the "Tiger Stadium" page to the "Tiger Stadium (Detroit)" page, and to make the "Tiger Stadium" page a disambiguation page. I appreciate it very much, and I will remember that in the future whenever some LSU fan wants to try and put LSU's Tiger Stadium on the main Tiger Stadium page.
  • I am not convinced that football stadiums are as tightly woven with their teams' identities as the classic ballparks are/were (with the exception of a few, such as Lambeau Field); but since the old Detroit ballpark is no longer in use, the disambiguation page would seem to be appropriate. Wahkeenah 06:04, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
    • I think Wahkeenah seriously misunderstands college football. Whereas professional teams such as the Detroit Tigers (Tiger Stadium (Detroit)) and the Green Bay Packers (Lambeau Field) can be sold from city to city, college teams will always remain attached to their university. In addition, professional teams temporarily belong to a city, and as long as they still remain in that city, they can locate and re-locate their stadium wherever they want in or around that city (such as the case with the Detroit Tigers). With college football, on the other hand, the vast majority of college football stadiums are built on campus and will always remain on campus. There is no stadium as tightly woven with their teams' identity as a college football stadium.
      • And I think the school itself, the colors, the mascot, etc., other things having to do with "school spirit" outweigh the stadium. Anyway, I've already said go ahead and make it a disambiguation page, and there seems little or no opposition to it now. Wahkeenah 06:33, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Support move. LSU is a notable enough school, and like said above, Detroit hasn't played there in 7 years. -Patstuart(talk)(contribs) 21:27, 16 November 2006 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Flag pole?

"The same flag pole was brought to Comerica Park and remained in fair play also, until the fences were moved in closer after the 2003 season."

Can anyone cite a source for this? I was under the impression that the flag pole was not moved to Comerica. Looking at satellite images on google maps, it looks pretty clear that the flag pole still stands at Tiger stadium. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Dmacika (talk • contribs) 14:24, 30 March 2007 (UTC).

Additional photo

Here's a photo of a game at the stadium in 1980: [6]. It's free so we can use it here. Not sure if it really fits though, given the number of photos already, but it has some historical value as an older photo of the park. --W.marsh 13:41, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Demolition section

The beginning and the end of the article contradict one another as to when demolition of the stadium began. Will also try to post pics of demolition and work on *61. Not sure if there's a mention of the "Chicago Field" scenes from Hardball, which were also shot at the stadium in October 2000. MMetro (talk) 03:38, 27 July 2008 (UTC)

Demolition section

The beginning and the end of the article contradict one another as to when demolition of the stadium began. Will also try to post pics of demolition and work on *61. MMetro (talk) 03:39, 27 July 2008 (UTC)

  • Ending?! the fued!? NO! This is conjecture, original research, and NPOV. I'm removing it. --70.88.93.238 (talk) 20:08, 20 June 2009 (UTC)
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