Talk:Sundering of the Elves/GA1

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Reviewer: Mike Christie (talk · contribs) 23:44, 8 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]


I'll review this. Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 23:44, 8 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Sources are reliable.

  • Noted.
  • I think we need a citation for the caption to File:Elvish Migrations and Kindreds.svg; I know it recaps the text in the body but that's not all adjacent to the image and citing it is safer. For the image itself, I see the creator didn't cite his sources -- presumably there's something in the canon that covers the geography. Can you add that to the image file?
  • Added.

Similarly the other in-universe maps and diagrams should have the relevant canon texts cited as sources on the image file.

  • Added.
  • Added.
  • The diagram (which is easily the best presentation of these groups I've seen) names the Vanyar and the Noldor with the translations you give in the text, "Fair Elves" (should that be lower case "elves"?) and "Deep Elves". The first paragraph of "Sundering of the Eldar" seems out of sync with the diagram: the text says the Teleri come from the Nelyar, but the diagram says the Teleri are "Deep Elves", i.e. Noldor, who according to the text are Tatyar.
  • Well spotted! Fixed the diagram, the Teleri are not Deep Elves/Noldor.
  • Assuming that the text doesn't change based on my comment above, I think that paragraph is confusing things by saying the Eldar divided into three groups. The divisions were already present, weren't they? That is, the three groups are the Vanyar which is all of the Minyar; the Noldor which is all the Tatyar who went west; and the Teleri which is all the Nelyar who went west. The divisions did not form on the journey.
  • Very helpful comment. Removed "divided", and edited accordingly.

Pausing there to let you respond; this is confusing material and I may have it wrong so I'd like a sanity check. Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 00:17, 9 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

  • Yes, it's real wet-towel-wrapped-around-head-to-understand stuff, which is the reason for the maps and diagrams.

Continuing:

  • The link to Falmari should be removed; it just returns to this article.
  • Gone.
  • What do you think of dividing the Sindar box as you've divided the Nandor, to show the separation between the Falathrim and the Mithrim? I see you currently have the boxes map one-to-one with the names on the map, but I think it would be OK to give the extra information, since the text covers it.
  • "Hearing of the peaceful territories of King Thingol, Denethor, son of Lenwë, collected as many of his scattered people as he could and finally ventured westward over the Ered Luin, where he was accepted by the King as ancient kindred (King Elu Thingol being in fact Elwë, brother of Olwë) and were given Ossiriand to reside in.": Without links to Lenwë, Elwë, or Olwë, and no explanation of these figures in the text, I think the kinship comment is a bit opaque.
  • Removed.
  • Perhaps bold "Silvan" in the Nandor paragraph, since that's the term used in the map and diagram?
  • Done.
  • "Fingolfin was forced to make the perilous journey on foot via the Helcaraxe, the Grinding Ice of the far north, creating further hostility": if I remember the details rightly, the hostility prior to this was with the Falmari, because of the kinslaying, even though Fingolfin's elves were not part of that as I recall, and the hostility the journey via the Helcaraxe creates is between Fingolfin and Fëanor. If that's right, "creating further hostility" is a bit compressed. I wonder if it might be best to just cut it, to avoid having to explain those events.
  • Removed.
  • "became divided by the place of dwelling": suggest "by their place of dwelling".
  • Done.

Earwig shows a paragraph matching a couple of other websites but they seem to have copied from Wikipedia. I don't have access to any of the sources so I am going to AGF for the spotchecks. Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 13:12, 9 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

  • Yes, it seems so; thanks.

Last fix made; passing. Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 15:17, 9 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

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