Talk:Sonthi Boonyaratglin

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Laws Against Bigamy?[edit]

In fact, the Thai laws provide protection against bigamy (section 1495 of the Civil and Commercial Code), but there is an exception: there is an "Act on Enforcement of Islamic Law within the Areas of Changwat Pattani, Narathiwat, Yala and Satun, BE 2489 (1946)." The Act prescribes that the Islamic Law shall prevail the provisions of the Civil and Commercial Code in any civil cases in connection with family affairs and legacy of which the plaintiff, defendant or petitioner is a moslem, and the Dato justices, judicial officials empowered to rule out the Islamic Law, shall sit on benches together with general justices in the trials thereof (Section 3 and section 4 of the Act). In accordance with the Moslem Law, a moslem male is permitted to have more than one but not exceeding four wives. Whereas General Sonthi is a moslem, so he can have more than one wives in accordance with the Islamic Law permitting polygamy.

So, can anyone amend the Article?

---PORtrait | chit~chat, 13 February 2009. 15:10 hours (GMT+7).

Birthplace and Origin[edit]

There is no mention of Ret. Gen. Sonthi Boonyaratglin's birthplace and origin anywhere. Why hasn't it been mentioned? Frankly, his birthplace and origins should be a matter of public record.

He is a Muslim. A Thai Muslim. That can mean anything! He could even be a recent convert. A recent migrant.

Was he an orphan? Was he adopted?

Where was he born?

Where were his parents from?

Were his parents Chams? Were they recent migrants from Cambodia? Or were they the descendants of Cham mercenaries, prisoners of war and slaves brought to Siam from Cambodia between two and four hundred years ago? Were they inhabitants of Bangkok or Ayutthaya? Perhaps his ancestors have lived on the Chao Phraya for centuries.

Or was he the son of Sumatrans who migrated to the south of Thailand, mostly along the Andaman Sea coast, in the past 75 years?

Were his parents descended from the Chams who have inhabited the Andaman coast for thousands of years?

Or were they descended from the Makassars (from the Celebes [Sulawesi] in Indonesia) who settled around Ayutthaya hundreds of years ago? They are still there today, along with descendants of Chams and other Malays from Patani who have also lived there for a long time.

Or is he from Pattani? Were his parents from Malaya?

Is he from Hat Yai? Or Satun? Or Phuket?

If anyone knows the answer, please post it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by J'aime les crossiants (talk • contribs) 03:35, 4 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]


Correct way to refer to General Sonthi Boonyaratglin[edit]

In this article General Sonthi Boonyaratglin is referred to many times as:

  • General Sonthi Boonyaratglin
  • Gen. Sondhi Boonyaratkalin
  • General Sonthi, and also
  • Sonthi

Can someone who is familiar with the correct use of titles in Thai culture please choose one of these formats to be used whenever his name appears throughout the whole article? Consistency will improve readability.

In lieu of any suggestions, I suggest using "Sonthi" only, because:

  • Thaksin Shinawatra is often referred to as Thaksin (that is, his first name rather than family name by which most leaders in Western countries are referred), and
  • other political leaders who are generals are often referred to by a single name without their military rank, such as General Suharto of Indonesia and Brigadier General Lee of Singapore.

Comments and suggestions from people familiar with Thai culture?

Troy88 17:36, 20 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Sonthi is perfectly acceptable on second reference. No need to refer to his military rank or surname beyond their first mentions. Also Sonthi seems to be the preferred spelling. Most of the English-language press in Thailand are going with that spelling, mostly I think so he isn't easily confused with another major figure in Thai politics, Sondhi Limthongkul. I would recommend Wikipedia follow that. Also the "th" is closer to how it actually sounds when it's pronounced by a native Thai speaker. --Wisekwai 19:31, 20 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Commander-in-Chief?[edit]

The opening sentence of this article states, "Boonyaratkalin...is Commander-in-Chief of the Royal Thai Army". However, the article on Chaiyasit Shinawatra beings "Shinawatra is the Commander-in-Chief of the Royal Thai Army". Surely both cannot be correct?

Chaiyasit was replaced as CinC in 2004 and transferred to Supreme Command. His article has now been updated. Thanks for your kind attention to details. -Wisekwai 10:45, 20 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

PM succession box?[edit]

Since he's now the Thai head of government (prime minister in all but name) shouldn't the successon box be added? (Alphaboi867 00:32, 21 September 2006 (UTC))[reply]

I would hold off on doing that. Whether he is the new "prime minister" is very contentious and the article gives enough information for the reader to decide that himself. —Quarl (talk) 2006-09-21 05:45Z
If a new prime minister is selected/appointed/named in 2 weeks (which some media articles suggest is a possibility), then that person would be the logical direct successor to Thaksin as prime minister (even though there was technically a gap of a few weeks). If it takes longer than 2 weeks, we'll have to wait and see who actually holds day to day power and manages the country, and this will become obvious as various media agree on specific people and their titles at that time.
So I say don't update the succession box yet. We can be quick to record history - but we should not pre-empt it.
Troy88 17:02, 21 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Agree with Troy88 and Quarl. Patiwat 10:41, 23 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Blockage from vandalism[edit]

I just got done trying to reason the picture's fair use, I reload the page, and I see n*****s on there...

Anyone else think that the editing should be blocked from new or unregistered members?

It's not bad enough to need semiprotection yet. —Quarl (talk) 2006-09-22 06:07Z

Neutrality dispute[edit]

Is it relevant to state that he is a muslim? Since he's an unpopular man in his country - which may be related to his religion - we should follow the standardized format for other thai PM entries. Gozaru ne? 60.52.196.125 07:00, 22 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It is relevant, 1) due to the insurgency in the southern Muslim provinces. When he was appointed Army Commander, the media widely noted that appointing a Muslim to oversee the insurgency might help the situation (it didn't - partly because he's a Bangkokian, not a Southerner). Likewise, now that he's Prime Minister, it is still believed that that his religion might help the situation.
2) In addition, as the first non-Buddhist Premier, it is interesting to see how he will participate in official state functions. These state functions include religious ceremonies at Buddhist temples. It'll be interesting to see whether he will participate in these ceremonies, and if so, how faithful muslims will perceive their muslim leaders bowing before an image of the Buddha. Patiwat 00:26, 23 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

More importantly, he has yet to demonstrate any effectiveness in combating the Muslim Terrorism raging in the South, as mentioned by Patiwat. The recent wave of bombings and shooting of an aide to the Thai Queen is an indication of his effectiveness. One only wonders whether his loyalty lies to His Majesty and His Loyal Subjects, or to his Islamic Faith? (Babyrina2 13:12, 23 February 2007 (UTC))[reply]

The political situation[edit]

This article alone is still far from enough for the reader to judge Gen. Sonthi. The article should describes or references more political circumstances which "might be" the reason why he arranged the coup. The "Conflicts with Thaksin Shinawatra" section alone will lead the reader to the point that Gen. Sonthi has done that because of the "conflict", which might or might not be true. I would humbly suggest that the occuring event by Sondhi Limthongkul in 20Sep should be describe as the "fact" here, along with the other facts that possibly be relevant to the real cause of this coup.

You mean the allegation that Sonthi executed the coup to prevent the massacre of PAD protestors? That's still very speculative at the moment, isn't it? It certainly isn't the official explanation, and the accusations are still one sided; nobody in the deposed government has come out to admit it or deny it. If you're going to mention it in the article, then I think you should mention that this is still a disputed matter, and that the accusations are just that: uninvestigated and unverified accusations.
If that isn't enough for the reader to make a judgement, then that's because not enough information has been made public yet. We shouldn't rush the reader to a judgement when the issue is still very murky. Patiwat 10:39, 23 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Alright, I got the point. However, I think there would not be the point which the "official explanation" of this coup will be available, because it has been "officially" explained clearly at the first place already. What we need for now is not the official explanation, but we need more facts that will help analysing this matter. When it comes to politics, much more related fact must be taken into account because nobody tells the "whole" truth. I'll try to put together the politics circumstances that might run the event behind-the-scene, and I'm really looking forward for your correction because my English might not be good enough for this kind of article, but I'll try. --Biglobster 12:56, 23 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I don't think we should go overboard in the context here - that could easily get very long. Maybe a more prominent link to the Thailand political crisis 2005-2006 would be more appropriate. Patiwat 11:23, 26 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Biased Quotes?[edit]

Why is there a section of quotes from him claiming that he won't get involved in politics or a coup? Is the person who inserted those attempting to convey the message than Sonthi is a liar and will attempt to remain in power? It smacks of bias to me to include only those five cherry-picked quotes. --User:bbcrackmonkey

I agreed. The contradiction of his quotes and actions should be put along with the corresponding events instead. If somebody accused that you were planning the coup, you would deny it definitely whether you were actually planning it or not, especially if you are Command-in-chief. I'm not supporting him or the coup, but this lie is politically a part of this game. It's just like the country will deny the identity of their spies if captured by the enemy. Although those quotes are actually facts, the quotes just lead the reader to understand that Gen.Sonthi is a liar, rather than telling that it's just the common response when you are accused with such allegation -- no soldier tells the enemies he's going to attack. --Biglobster 10:32, 25 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I agree. Those lies should be placed in the Conflicts with Thaksin section with appropriate context. Patiwat 11:22, 26 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Much of the article seems very biased against Sonthi - perhaps written by pro-Thaksin supporters?

When was he made Army commander?[edit]

The article says

In August 2004, Sonthi was appointed Deputy Army Commander. Against public expectations, Sonthi was promoted to Army Commander in October 2005.[4]

Reference [4] was written in 2004 and therefore does not support the date of October 2005. I'm almost certain that it happened in June or July of 2005 but I can't find a reference. AxelBoldt 03:52, 26 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I had presumed that he was promoted in October, because that is the month traditionally reserved for major military appointments. But you're right, we should find a reference. Patiwat 11:20, 26 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Alt spellings of name[edit]

I don't think we should note all the alternative spellings of Sonthi's name in the intro. Alternative spellings should be handled with disambiguation pages. Otherwise, the introduction could get quite overburdened. Patiwat 19:05, 27 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, for sure. And there are virtually endless combinations for Sonthi's name. Web searches will find the page through the disambigs. Or, the various spellings of his given name and family name could be listed elsewhere on the page and keep the intro clean and concise. -Wisekwai 19:37, 27 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]


Is Sonthi Boonyaratglin a shia[edit]

In the Religion colum it is written he is Shia Muslim is there any source on that

Response:

He is a descendant of Shia Iranian immigrants to Thailand would be the most likely reason. I'm having trouble finding a sectarian affiliation for him and if the only way to find out would be to see a picture of him praying (arms folded like a Sunni) or (arms straight down like a Shi'a). —Preceding unsigned comment added by Phknrocket1k (talk • contribs) 04:19, 23 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Misc related articles[edit]

Fair use rationale for Image:Khom Chad Luek front page, 31 December 2006.jpg[edit]

Image:Khom Chad Luek front page, 31 December 2006.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 06:47, 7 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Fair use rationale for Image:Khom Chad Luek front page, 31 December 2006.jpg[edit]

Image:Khom Chad Luek front page, 31 December 2006.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 13:27, 19 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Fair use rationale for Image:Khom Chad Luek front page, 31 December 2006.jpg[edit]

Image:Khom Chad Luek front page, 31 December 2006.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 05:58, 29 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Fair use rationale for Image:Khom Chad Luek front page, 31 December 2006.jpg[edit]

Image:Khom Chad Luek front page, 31 December 2006.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 23:00, 22 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

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