Talk:Smokey Joe Williams

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Article title[edit]

It's curious that the article is under "Cyclone Joe" but most of the article mentions him being known as "Smokey Joe". The Hall of Fame link dos not even mention the "Cyclone" name. 68.206.109.234 (talk) 22:32, 5 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

The article was originally was at Smokey Joe Williams but was moved in 2006 with the reason being "Cyclone Joe" was his nickname during his heyday in the 1910s and early 1920s--he sometimes appeared in box scores simply as "Cyclone." "Smokey Joe" didn't appear until around 1925 or so.

While Joe was known as "Cyclone" for a much longer portion of his career than "Smokey" (about his first 20 years compared to about his last 7 years), it was his "Smokey" monicker that contemporaries referred to him as. Sort of I guess how people will refer to Bradley Manning as Chelsey even though they became famous while known as Bradley. Initially, I believed this article should be moved per WP:COMMONNAME, but Joe was know as "Cyclone" for a longer time and it was at a higher level of play that made him famous, so I am under the impression that "Cyclone", for historical purposes, is the better name. (Since Joe is long deceased, WP:BLP cannot be applied as in the Manning situation.) YMMV. Rgrds. --64.85.215.153 (talk) 11:03, 7 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 25 July 2019[edit]

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Moved – Pretty clear consensus, and no, User:Smokey Joe does not get a supervote, though he may have been canvassed. (non-admin closure) Dicklyon (talk) 01:38, 11 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Cyclone Joe Williams → Smokey Joe Williams – Per WP:COMMONNAME. He's more commonly known as Smokey and I think that's the name most people would search for him. It's name primarily used by the Negro Leagues Baseball Museum, Baseball Reference and the National Baseball Hall of Fame (plaque lists both, but otherwise they seem to use Smokey exclusively from what I can tell). I feel the fact the later nickname is the most enduring ought to take precedence over the fact Cyclone was the first and used for a greater portion of his career. Leesandeul (talk) 04:29, 25 July 2019 (UTC) --Relisting. — Amakuru (talk) 16:25, 2 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose. I am the 64.85 IP from the section above, and that reasoning still holds. However, I would not be opposed to moving the article to Joe Williams (baseball), which currently rdrs. to here. Both Cyclone and Smokey could rdr. to that title. Rgrds. --Bison X (talk) 17:58, 28 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Comment - @SmokeyJoe: it sounds like this would be your area of expertise?! — Amakuru (talk) 16:25, 2 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Support per nom. Later sources overwhelmingly prefer Smokey Joe Williams over Cyclone Joe Williams, and when both are mentioned, it’s Smokey before Cyclone. Oppose the parenthetical per WP:NATURAL. —SmokeyJoe (talk) 23:11, 2 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Support Smokey Joe per SmokeyJoe (and Baseball Hall of Fame). Randy Kryn (talk) 03:05, 3 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.