Talk:Raymond Hamilton

Raymond Hamilton, very interesting character

His purpose and career were quite different from Clyde Barrow's with whom he's most associated nowdays, and a piece on him would give light to other angles of the world of small-time US criminals of the 30s. I think his story should be developed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by LaNaranja (talk • contribs) 11:52, 14 December 2009 (UTC)

Books that cover Ray's career

Depression Desperado (1995) by Sid Underwood. This is the only bio of Ray I believe.

Running with Bonnie and Clyde by JN Phillips -- preview at Google Books Ray and Ralph Fults got into -- or more important, out of -- some incredible scrapes together. The couple of Ray stories and where he fits in Ralph Fults's story are valuable, though of course he's fill-in color for the lead story, about the same as he figures in Go Down Together.

Public Enemy No. 1 (1938) by Ray's big brother Floyd, who deserves a paragraph or two here himself. Neither this book nor its 1978 paperback edition is listed at WorldCat so I dont have access to a copy, but if anyone does please post! In a footnote in Blanche's book Phillips gives a fairly thorough, footnote-size summary about Floyd -- I'd post the page but Blanche is back at the library.

Assignment:Huntsville (1957) has information from Lee Simmons's point of view about the January 16 escape engineered by Clyde and Floyd and the death house escape of 1934. -- LaNaranja (talk) 21:54, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

I think the note you're referring to in Blanche is the one on page 295. It says that Floyd was honest and upright and clean till young Ray came along and pooed in everyone's pudding. JNP says he helped plant the guns for the Eastham raid, which charge was dropped for lack of evidence. (JNP makes it sound like he did it, though.) He was then "implicated" (JNP's word) in Grapevine, but "that charge was quickly proven to be a frame-up and dropped." Floyd got two years — the max — in the harboring trial, and by 1938, was being picked up "on suspicion" by Dallas city and county PD every time someone littered in town. Floyd couldn't keep a job because of the frequent visits by the fuzz, like LC years before, and eventually went on a spree with one Ted Walters, was caught, convicted and did "a long stretch" at Alcatraz!

Now there's a cautionary tale for you. — HarringtonSmith (talk) 22:39, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

Poor Floyd. But he found Jesus later, and escaped from Alcatraz. And what did he have to lose? -- LaNaranja (talk) 23:01, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

LaNaranja, have you read the 21st Century Update book yet? I've ordered it but haven't gotten it yet. — HarringtonSmith (talk) 23:48, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

I have it here on interlib loan but still have to settle down and really read it. It's funny when you (think you) know enough about a subject that when a book arrives you give the text a quick inspection and then rush to the footnotes.

His are good... well detailed, like Phillips's.

If you can think of a better way to say "Bonnie and Clyde's sudden end" at the main B&C article, I would not track you down in the sewers and shoot you. -- LaNaranja (talk) 00:21, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

I guess "their rendezvous with the Remingtons," or "blasted off to meet their maker" would be unencyclopedic, wouldn't it. Know what I read recently? That the Brit equivalent of the Hays Office was concerned about HL's death on the steps looking "like a mercy killing." So they wouldn't allow a shot of Holly pointing the pistol at him! (I think — it was some bizarro thing they wouldn't allow.) And here I always thought it was art when he cuts to Callahan and leaves the gunshot only on the audio. Shit. — HarringtonSmith (talk) 01:34, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

Howzabout: "They had a date with a Remington 8?" — HarringtonSmith (talk) 01:35, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

"Roll down your window, Bonnie, we need some ventilation."

Found the thing about TTM: CAROL REED: That was my hand [up through the grate]; I did it on location before he arrived because I knew that Harry must try to escape the sewers. The shot immediately preceding that was done with Orson in the studio, because in Vienna there isn’t any staircase leading directly up to a drain. …and the censors objected to Cotten shooting Harry Lime (since it was a mercy killing). That’s why Trevor Howard now shouts from off-camera, “If you see him, shoot.” Cotten isn’t killing a friend, you see, he’s only following orders...

Reed does, however, cut away to Callahan for the pistol shot as I said. — HarringtonSmith (talk) 05:12, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

"No worries, Carol, Mr. Fitzhugh-Hays says we got a lotta leeway with the artsy crowd, they'll just read into it. They'd rather read into it. It's that Selznick ending I'm worried about." -- LaNaranja (talk)

Floyd Hamilton

Why doesn't Floyd Hamilton have a separate page? If you enter his name, you get redirected to Raymond Hamilton's page. Not only was he involved with his brother, but tried escaping from Alcatraz in 1943. Floyd's only mention on Raymond Hamilton's page is that they talked to each other about the possible killing of Undersheriff Eugene Moore (August 5, 1932) Jtyroler (talk) 09:55, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

Hi, Jtyroler. I redirected Floyd here. He used to redirect to a list of Alcatraz escapees, and I thought it made sense to have him here with his better known brother so that his story could be developed more conveniently. Neither brother has gotten any attention lately, though, and they both need it. If you'd like to create a separate page for Floyd, by all means please do. -- LaNaranja (talk) 10:49, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

Escape from Huntsville Death House

I recently listened to an episode of "Gangbusters" about Irvin "Blackie" Thompson (air date was 12/8/1945). In trying to find out a little more about Thompson, I learned that his escape from the Huntsville, TX prison death house was done with Raymond Hamilton and Joe Palmer sometime in 1934. I did find incomplete minutes of the Texas Prison Board of 7/24/1934, which didn't include the date of the escape. Does anyone know more about this event? Supposedly (according to the Gangbusters episode) this was the 1st successful escape from Huntsville's Death House.Jtyroler (talk) 14:36, 14 June 2011 (UTC)

Hello, Jtyroler. Hamilton's and Palmer's escape was on July 22, 1934. The best account of it is in John Neal Phillips's book about Ralph Fults, Running with Bonnie and Clyde. — HarringtonSmith (talk) 15:15, 14 June 2011 (UTC)

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