Talk:Obesity/Archive 4

American hates obesity!?

I have pondered this for quite some time. Why is it that the media in the USA and doctors seem to blame obesity for etc etc problems. As if someone who is over weight is incapable of functioning, however these days it is difficult to say who is over weight when compared to a fashion model. One could say, how is an obese person more of a risk to hire than someone who participates in sexual perversions. The articles does not offer a subjective view of that.

--Margrave1206 23:32, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

Obese people are unhealthy, it's a scienfic fact, it has been proven that being obese make you much more likely to suffer from a whole range of ailments. It is not a question of apportioning blame, it is mearly using scientific method to acredit cause to effect. As a rule an overweight person is less capable in certain aspects of life than an physically fit person, and an obese person less capable than an overweight person. I lost 60lbs (and in counterance to that I actually lost an additional 30lbs more of fat and built more muscle instead so the net was only 60lbs) and I am now much more able physically, can do more for longer, life more heavier weights, run further, faster, as well as the fact that my resting heart rate is down in the low 50's to high 40's, perfect blood pressure and havent been ill for over a year now. People would be overweight compared to most fashion models but fashion models are by most definitions underweight. A fat person is much more likely to be ill than an fit person, and how do you define sexual perversion, and even in the broadest most judgemental definition only a fraction of a percent of sexual practise would be likely to make someone ill. This article is not about sexual practices, it is about obesity, that is why it does not comment on it. If someone who is overweight is X times more likely to be ill than a person of similiar age, height, ethnicity, with the only difference being obesity, or their eating habbits which form the obesity, then it is relavant to the article. Being fat is unhealthy, we all know that, why try to hide it. 86.131.16.140 11:54, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

Life Expectancy?

I an 28 and have been around 100lbs overweight for 14 years, what is my life expetency? Pear not Apple. How come they don't have more on the this issue? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 209.206.165.25 (talk) 07:35, 21 January 2007 (UTC).

I am not a doctor, but I know that your life expectancy in relation to your underlying obesity would be dependent on any health issues you have currently if any, as well as family history, your diet and exercise would have to be factored in as well. e.g Call my doctors incompetent but I am almost 160lb overweight (BMI of 46.5), and they have pretty much all given me a clean bill of health (with blood tests, blood pressure, etc done for all levels they requested to see) and between them, none of them have directly told me to lose weight. Guess it just depends on what country your in, and which doctor you talk to. - Boochan 16:18, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

BMI isnt really a good measure of health, it is much better to have a body fat measurement, I weigh around 185lbs, and am 6ft 1, it gives me a BMI of around 24, which is overweight, yet i have around 10% body fat (6% is a pro athelte in competition form) and I am far from overwight, BMI is accurate if you measure it accross a huge sample in measureing obesity, but for individuals it is largely useless, body fat % is much better, is its definatly worth asking for that test when you are at your Doc's. As for life expentacy it's much like Boochan said, weight is just one factor, underlying health is a massive thing, smoking, high blood pressure, cholesterol, and many other things can knock decades of your life expentacy, but as a rule, being toned and physically fit you stand a much better chance of living longer than someone who is overweight or obese. 86.131.16.140 12:01, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

BMI is good for many indicators. As a risk for osteoarthritis, for example, it doesn't really matter where the excess weight really is. For cardiovascular/diabetes risk, however, central obesity has a much stronger association (apple shape). And Boochan is right that obesity does not automatically make one hypertensive etc. His doctors should have a look at the evidence, or perhaps it was their view that no intervention was indicated at the present time. JFW | T@lk 20:06, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Circular definition

Cut from "causes" section:

• Eating disorders (e.g., binge eating disorder)

Eating too much does not cause "eating too much", any more than jogging causes you to run. --Uncle Ed 21:42, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

Good point, eating too much causes you to be fat, eating enough causes you to be the right shape, it's cause and effect. There is nothing in the world that can cause you to gain weight and build fat if you are eating equal to, or less calories than you burn, its scientifically impossible. 86.131.16.140 12:04, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

Conditions that make you eat too much cause obesity. What is the problem here, guys? Prader-Willi syndrome causes obesity due to hyperphagia. Why did you leave that in? JFW | T@lk 20:06, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Call for writers

I did my best to rearrange and tweak, but the article needs a good working over; maybe a a major rewrite. --Uncle Ed 21:56, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

It does not need a major rewrite. It needs the present content heavily sourced and optimised. All the viewpoints are already there, the theories about pathogenesis and medical impact. Major rewrites will end up being much more POV and unsourced than whatever we have at present. I've been chipping away at this, but we need someone from the social sciences department to look at the bits that are not really medical (e.g. social acceptance of heaviness). If you could recruit such a person... JFW | T@lk 20:06, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Add Fat acceptance movement

I think we need to have a different pov on obesity, mentioning the Fat acceptance movement, and possibly adding theNational Association to Advance Fat Acceptance (NAAFA Official Site) as a citation for it. The article barely glosses over obesity as either neutral or even positive in nature, and only in the pop culture, and history sub sections is this given any mention, seemingly against the NPOV policy. There is much more for the history and pop culture sections that the few sentences they have been given thus far, especially in terms of pop culture. The article is simply not ready to be a Featured Article or even a Good article until these sections recieve more attention, and better balance. Zidel333 07:13, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

The NAAFA is still a very small movement that should get no more exposure that it would deserve. Pop culture references are very fluid and do not really strengthen this article encyclopedically - unless these references have been studied, trends have been identified, and patterns have become apparent. JFW | T@lk 20:06, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Non-neutral POV and lack of clarity

"Another study finds women who married into higher status are predictably thinner than women who married into lower status."

This sentence makes one or more vague suppositions, for example that women's sexual attractiveness and eligability is "preditably" proportionate to their "thinness". How is this "predictable"? It's only predictable from Western cultural values and even so, ignores issues like anorexia and so on. Maybe it should be changed? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 81.179.83.86 (talk) 16:23, 26 February 2007 (UTC).

WP:BOLD, but as the article is presently protected again you'll need to make some good contributions first before you will be allowed to.

"Predictably" here is not a value judgement but a reflection of the study findings, i.e. that higher status predicted thinness. Most people use the word sarcastically, but it has a non-loaded meaning as well. JFW | T@lk 13:03, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

Regions of most prevalence?

I'm wondering if there's an article or section about which countries in the world have the most prevalent rates of obesity. In any case, it seem that it's most prevalent in the South Pacific; 94% of Nauru citizens are obese. [1] Esn 02:05, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Last year JAMA paper

I added information about last year CDC paper on protective effect of obesity. What is the consensus about including this in the article?

Perhaps you could give the reference again. A year is a long time. JFW | T@lk 23:21, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Keep this protected

I suggest this article remains sprotected indefinitely; it is too much of a sitting duck for mindless vandalism. JFW | T@lk 08:56, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

Legal issues

There should be a paragraph on fatness and law. In countries where conscription or draft exists, it may be a crime for a military age male to be obese, since he is sabotaging the defensive capabilitiy of his country. That is treason. 82.131.210.162 09:15, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Well, there is certainly a legal angle to obesity, but not in the way you are suggesting. PMID 16775242 deals with this. Have you got any source at all that supports your assertion? Or is this a novel hypothesis? JFW | T@lk 16:00, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

WikiProject:Sociology

Given that the social sciences angle in this article remains a cause for worry, I have asked the members of Wikipedia:WikiProject Sociology to have a look at the content.[2] JFW | T@lk 16:00, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

Help Me Please

I am a young man named Sue, and I am very fat. Why am I so fat? Fatsuebeefarris 01:23, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Well, the article is quite clear on this. There are biological causes (you may have Prader-Willi syndrome or a craniopharyngeoma) and there are societal causes. The combination makes people more prone to obesity. Johnny Cash was not overweight, incidentally. And trolls get overweight if they're overfed. JFW | 

T@lk 21:14, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Look on the bright side, at least you're tough.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.134.206.211 (talk • contribs) 11:38, 5 April 2007

Consider this: You're alive! That's what's important. --Jason Palpatine 14:17, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

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