Talk:Number form

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Personal experience[edit]

I just thought I'd point out a couple of things about this topic from personal experience. Firstly, different "types" of numbers each have a different form, for example prices do not form the same shape as years. Also, the phenomenon is not restricted to numbers, as I am also able to imagine a form for the alphabet.

I agree. Not that I have the same feeling about Alphabet or prices, but in my case - for example - I always see the months of the year in a circle (counterclock-wise, Feb top). It surprised me for such a thing to have a name. Or was to be a common phenomenon even. How many people would imagine numbers in such a way? Galton, F. (1881a) mentions 5% on the first page of the link.
- SuperMidget 17:19, 30 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Lets not leave out the scale -- or at least the parts of the scale you commonly play :). And songs -- they can produce "forms" I guess you'd call it. You end up latter following the song as you listen to it again. 1veedo 22:20, 9 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

For most of my life, I automatically see numbers 1-10 as dots in domino arrangement. I got this from watching Sesame Street as a kid, and never outgrew it. It really slows me down, especially back in college, because even doing simple addition/subtraction in calculus required mentally counting dots in a stack of dominoes. I really wish I could learn a less exhausting way - I might actually enjoy math. JeramieHicks (talk) 21:36, 1 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Rairity[edit]

I don't remember where it was, I think it was the BBC, where it said that only 1-2% of synaesthetes(sp?)have this particular type, so it is presumably extremely rare. Cellogirl42 14:43, 26 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

In fact, as the scientific community studies the various manifestations of synesthesia, we keep discovering that the prevelance rates we thought were true (1 in 2000, for example) were off by two orders of magnitude (the most recent estimates is more like in 20; Simner et al., in press see the main synesthesia article). Noam Sagiv and colleagues showed that something like 60% of grapheme-color synesthetes have number forms, while perhaps only 10% of lexical-gustatory synesthetes have number forms. My own (in progress, original) research suggestst that there are many synesthetes with number forms that do not experience other forms of synesthesia, so the estimate cited by the BBC is likely to change with more research. Edhubbard 14:51, 26 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Confusion[edit]

I'm confused... nowhere in the article does it say what data or procedure is employed to create a number form. Antialias

Hi Antialias, I'm not sure where the confusion lies, so let me try to answer your question, and then I'll go and add something to the entry to try and make it clearer for other readers. These are forms that people report experiencing, consciously, automatically, when they think of numbers (and as noted above, other ordered sequences). They are not "created", but rather experienced, or reported. The simplest way for someone else to get an impression of what it's like is just to have someone draw their forms. However, many number form synesthetes complain that their forms are three-dimensional, and that a 2-D sheet of paper is inadequate. David Eagleman has developed some VR software that allows number-form synesthetes to place their forms in three dimensions, including distance, size, etc, etc. One way that we can verify these forms is using a test-retest procedure, like that used for other forms of synesthesia. People who report number forms are much more consistent than non-synesthetes in placing their numbers at specific spatial locations. Subsequently, we can design experiments such as those mentioned on the page currently, to show that, for example, when numbers are presented consistently with the orientation reported by a number form synesthete, reaction times are faster than when they are presented inconsistently with the reported forms. Additionally, it should be noted that number-form synesthesia co-occurs with other forms of synesthesia (especially grapheme-color synesthesia), further suggesting that it should be treated as a form of synesthesia, even if it not strictly between sensory modalities. Let me know if somethings still unclear, and I'll try to edit the main page to clarify this. Edhubbard 10:00, 19 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It's nothing spectacular Antialias. Just try counting in your head, like you probably used to do ~7. Or try doing it in a language that you dont know very well -- learn the numbers from 1 to 30 and count them, eyes closed. If not, like I said, it's nothing that spectacular. 1veedo 22:20, 9 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Distinguish[edit]

be distinguished from the non-conscious mental number line that we all have by the
can some1 elaborate? if you go to number line, it talks about the math device, but what of a non-conscious number line that all have? :/ Skullers 04:55, 24 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I agree, Skullers. The final paragraph talking about the non-conscious mental number line we all have is far from clear. There needs to be a better description of this phenomenon "we all have" and how it is distinguished from number form synesthesia. I suspect I have number form synesthesia (the positions of my numbers are rather complex and have never changed throughout my life), but then I read that "everyone" has a mental number line, so perhaps not. The description in this article is not helpful for distinguishing the two. I am also completely incapable of thinking about a day of the week without picturing a counter-clockwise oval of days. Months and years have yet another fixed, complex pattern. Number forms? Or just the mental images everyone has?--seberle (talk) 02:22, 16 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Please update[edit]

Wow, this article is seriously out of date! Even the title of this article is out of date. I believe the idea of number form syesthesia has been broadened to include spatial forms for time-related sequences. There is a lot of research published this year (2009) that appears not to have been integrated iinto this article. If I had a go at updating this article, I'm sure MY edits would be wiped and I'd have wasted a great amount of my precious time, so could one of the Chosen Few please bring this article up to date for the year 2009 at least. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.206.53.238 (talk) 08:17, 30 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Why do you think your edits would be wiped? I am only an occasional contributor, and my edits are rarely deleted, even when I have done them anonymously. Please help update this article! --seberle (talk) 22:59, 30 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]