Talk:Munroe Bergdorf

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Wrong date of birth[edit]

The article states that her date of birth is 11 September 1987, but in this article, which is dated to 5 June 2014, her age is 27. So she must have been born on 5 June 1987 or earlier. Jon1901 (talk) 22:52, 6 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Notability and autobiography tags[edit]

I see there's been some back-and-forth (in which I have not been involved) over whether to tag the article with {{autobiography}} and {{notability}}. The subject's notability seems moderately well established by the dozen or so sources about the subject which are cited. (It's worth remembering that WP:GNG, once met, cannot be "un-met" just because someone stops being in [new] news.) And neither the text of the article nor the page's edit history seems autobiographical, unless someone would like to claim one particular editor or IP or another is Bergdorf. -sche (talk) 10:04, 23 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Not "upper middle class".[edit]

According to the reference given,

"“My family are quite traditional — my mum’s from a really humble background in Birmingham and has done really well for herself in marketing in the financial services; my dad’s a carpenter from rural Jamaica. "

Not upper middle class. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.132.218.206 (talk) 13:48, 10 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Stansted Mountfitchet is a nice, high-priced, upper-middle-class village and has been for a long time. I grew up near there in the 1970s and had friends who lived there, and their parents were directors of large companies, because it took that kind of income to live there. It's a tiny place and it really does not have a proletariat.

It is probably worth mentioning that Bergdorf (despite a history of inviting distressed children to engage in private e-mail correspondence) was announced as an 'ambassador' for the NSPCC in June 2019, and then abruptly disowned a couple of days later when the obvious problems -- which due diligence should have discovered anyway -- were pointed out by numerous people. Bergdorf predictably claimed that objections to the appointment were 'transphobic', but this obviously wasn't the case. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48572955 Khamba Tendal (talk) 18:51, 9 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]

NSPCC[edit]

Why is the NSPCC not covered, it seems very noteworthy? Is anyone able to add it within Wikipedia rules and guidelines?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48572955

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/munroe-bergdorf-childline-trans-lgbt-campaign-charity-nspcc-controversy-a8950186.html

https://www.instagram.com/p/Byc-q_VgddO/

131.111.184.102 (talk) 14:41, 10 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I agree that it is noteworthy so I added some coverage. AJ2265 (talk) 17:02, 10 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The bigger issue is that the text makes it sound like they objected to her being in Playboy, but actually the tweet that kicked it off described her as a "porn star". The text seems to be interpreting that. --84.19.140.150 (talk) 07:41, 11 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The Wanless NSPCC press release says that Bergdorf was dropped because her public statements were inconsistent with safeguarding rules. This could refer to her racist comments, her rather startling homophobic remarks against lesbians or more likely her repeated invitations to children to engage in private dialogue with her online, which, as she appears not to know, is a thing you must never do. Some people were unhappy with the highly sexualised public image she cultivates, but Wanless didn't mention that. Bergdorf has given a Guardian interview claiming she's a victim of transphobia, but this is clearly not relevant and she should never have been hired in the first place because she's unsuitable.

The NSPCC Celebrity and Talent Officer who hired her meanwhile has his own problems due to an extremely unwise social media post: a self-made fetish porn video which he stated was filmed in the staff toilets at the NSPCC. He also stated that he had worn his rubber fetish gear to work under his day clothes specifically to make this video. Until he hastily deleted the video yesterday (along with a YouTube interview in which he talked about 'double-fisting... I want to get both arms up inside a boy'), he provided a link to it on his professional LinkedIn page, which of course headlines his career role at the NSPCC. Clearly a person who publicly fetishises that kind of boundary-transgression is problematic in the field of child protection.

A barrister specialised in child protection has requested a formal response from the NSPCC about this, and the NSPCC are just grumpily tweeting that their priorities are (a) their own staff and (b) 'the LGBTQ+ community'. You'd have thought their sole priority would be child welfare, but of course child welfare is of no interest to the 'woke'. The barrister says that if she doesn't get a satisfactory answer she'll take it to the Charity Commission and, if the Charity Commission are also too busy being 'woke', as is quite likely, she'll take it to the courts. Considering the NSPCC's previous friendly relations with Jimmy Saville, Rolf Harris and Stuart Hall, and its legal powers, the fallout from the Bergdorf faux-pas could have the makings of a considerable scandal. Most of it might be beyond the bounds of this particular article; but probably not all of it. Khamba Tendal (talk) 17:56, 13 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Date of birth[edit]

Summary of sources
Publication date	Age	Source
2014-06-05	27	https://www.standard.co.uk/lifestyle/london-life/munroe-bergdorf-people-wouldn-t-go-over-to-someone-s-mother-and-ask-about-their-labia-but-they-re-9491573.html
2017-09-01	29	http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/article/41127404/loreal-sacks-first-transgender-model-munroe-bergdorf
2017-09-01	29	https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/loreal-sacks-first-transgender-model-munroe-bergdorf-after-all-white-people-are-racist-facebook-rant-a3624911.html
2017-09-04	30	https://www.theguardian.com/global/2017/sep/04/munroe-bergdorf-on-the-loreal-racism-row-it-puzzles-me-that-my-views-are-considered-extreme
2017-09-08	30	https://www.ibtimes.co.uk/munroe-bergdorf-abused-while-jacob-rees-mogg-lauded-only-straight-white-men-have-free-speech-1638537
2020-06-11	32	https://edition.cnn.com/2020/06/11/uk/munroe-bergdorf-abuse-loreal-intl-scli-gbr/index.html

All but the very first are consistent with a date of birth between 1987-09-02 and 1987-09-04. The first source also contradicts the later source from the same publication (the Evening Standard). I have therefore edited the article to state that she was born in September 1987.

GreenComputer (talk) 21:23, 9 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

On that matter, I reverted this edit not just because of the above table, but also because this source gives her age as 34. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 13:01, 15 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Citations needed[edit]

Why are there no citations in the opening? Shouldn't this be corrected? Mujerhermosa-85 (talk) 21:11, 28 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Not normally. The introduction is only meant to contain a summary of material already in the body of the article and it should be referenced in the body. Citations in the introduction are not forbidden but they are rarely needed. --DanielRigal (talk) 21:17, 28 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

<ec>The lead paragraph of every Wikipedia article is a summary of the sourced content in the article body, and is therefore normally uncited. See WP:LEDE. Acroterion (talk) 21:17, 28 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

thank you so much for telling me! Mujerhermosa-85 (talk) 03:21, 29 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Starring in "It Must Change" music video[edit]

Bergdorf stars in the music video for the song "It Must Change", recently released by Anohni and the Johnsons. The wiki page for Anohni and the Johnsons already makes mention of this, so those more versed in the ways of Wiki can determine if that is worth also recording on this page. 73.96.35.146 (talk) 05:50, 11 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

UN 'UK champion for women's rights[edit]

I can’t make head nor tail of this: [[1]] … but there’s something notable here… or is there? Can any editor find some encyclopeaedic nuggets? I’m not clear who made the appointment and whether it is notable (though it sounds notable). Springnuts (talk) 18:37, 3 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

After sleeping on this for almost two months (because they don't actually care) all the usual suspects are now kicking off, pretending to be outraged by this fairly minor appointment and, of course, the UK gutter press is lapping it up as a culture war story because of course they are. The trouble is that the kvetching is completely drowning out the actual news to the point where it is hard to Google for it and get meaningful results. There is even a backlash to the backlash getting started (which is fair enough, but it just adds to the noise and confusion from our perspective).

I had a quick look and the best I could find was this from Attitude (magazine). This seems fairly good. At least it tells us what the role is, who bestowed it and that she is the first person to hold this position but this is not as simple as it seems. UN Women UK is a UK charity. It does not have an article. UN Women does. I assume they are connected as they have the same logo. Bergdorf is not mentioned on UN Women's website as far as I can see and neither is UN Women UK so... That's weird. Anyway, I think we have two options here.

Add one sentence supported by the Attitude link above and maybe one sentence about the kvetching supported by Pink News, here
Just leave it for now and see if anything more substantial than a bunch of anti-"woke" culture warrior blowhards performatively soiling themselves comes out of it.

I favour the second option. Unless anybody can find better sources than I did, we have far more heat than light at the moment.

In the meantime, let's just keep a close eye out for axe grinders trying to mess up the article with POV and/or defamatory nonsense. (In particular, look out for anybody trying to resurrect the spurious allegations of "anti-white racism". That's not even a real thing!) We should be ready to request page protection if it becomes necessary. Unfortunately, I understand that we are not allowed to request page protection preemptively, which is a pity as I think it might have saved us some trouble here. --DanielRigal (talk) 22:22, 3 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Oh, and I recommend putting Munroe Bergdorf race row incident on our watchlists too. It seems somewhat overblown to have a separate article about that minor incident but, seeing as we do, let's make sure that nobody messes it up. --DanielRigal (talk) 22:34, 3 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]