Talk:Malta/Archive 1

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Initial text

What!? No image of a Maltese Falcon? — Preceding unsigned comment added by DennisDaniels (talk • contribs) 02:27, 3 September 2004 (UTC)

Infobox edits

What's with the weird info box edits? They look the same to me, unless I'm missing something. I don't get it. -- thickslab 18:23, Jan 7, 2005 (UTC)

Sicilians are italians

like texans are americans, like londoners are english and so on...

always the usual speech. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 62.101.126.218 (talk) 05:00, November 2, 2006 (UTC)

New Malta?

Does anyone have any information regarding this party/movement, and perhaps a few links? I heard nothing about it.

I haven't and neither does Maltesedog from what he told me yesterday. └ VodkaJazz/talk┐ 13:53, 1 April 2006 (UTC)

How are we to proceed regarding the sentence on in politics section? Maltesedog 19:40, 2 April 2006 (UTC)

Neutral standpoint by a foreigner, as requested

After reviewing the write-ups of several other nations akin to the Maltese Islands, I have decided to amend the article to concord to a neutral standpoint. Kindly keep in mind that wikiwars or editwars are not mediated on Wikipedia, meaning they go on and on for ages with no resolve as all wikipedians forego coming to an amenable agreement in order to maintain their own standpoint. This only begets frustration, and provides an inconsistent point of inquiry, as the information communicated depends on who last visited the page. Needless to say this is not why Wikipedia was created. On to the page... As the page is edited now, you may list the geopolitical/continental plates ballyhoo in the relevant section, that is, geography/politics of the Maltese islands. Readers need not come face to face with geophysical data as soon as they start reading the article, arbitrary or not. In fact, you may consider obliterating the data relating to defining Malta's geographical coordinates by using other nations as standpoints - the map does that adequately and there are other ways such information may be communicated. The only reason I have not done this myself is because I pledged to leave the article in the fashion of other articles about similar countries. The introduction, as it stands, gives some basic netural information about the Islands, which may be expanded to include some modern developments, and I suggest the intricate details are left to their relevant sections, where, because they are subjects of much contention, they are less conspicuous - as is the trend with other articles. Kindly remember to be objective as well as reasonably critical when editing the relevant sections, as, I must hand it to you, some editors seem to hold personal reasons to senselessly liken the populace and customs of this nation to those of African nations. From my, albeit limited, experience of Malta and the Maltese, my personal opinion is that this would consistute misrepresentation for a number of notable reasons.

Message board

Huh?

The islands later came under the control first of Carthage (400 BC) and then of Rome, before being conquered by Arabs in 1180 AD.

Just AD? That's over two millennia of history there. Surely the timespan could be more specific than that. — Ливай | ☺ 06:13, 31 Jan 2005 (UTC)

I am not aware that there is any convincing evidence of Greeks colonising Malta in ancient times. Where does the date 736 BC come from? I understand that Malta was colonised from Phoenicia about that time and subsequently became part of the Carthaginian 'empire'. Roger Vella Bonavita (bonavita@iinet.net.au)

Hi roger,

I agree with you. I enclose herewith a link to a timeline of Maltese history, which is reliable, it does not show this. [[1]], unless solid proof regarding the fact of the Greek Conquerers is provided i would remove this. Maltesedog 16:36, 9 May 2006 (UTC)

Hi, here's another timeline outlining Malta's history throughout the ages. I don't know whether this is a reliable timeline or not, but note that it says 'Greek Influence' and not 'Colonised by the Greek'. The dates it gives are 700-600BC.Keith Azzopardi 22:12, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Contribution by the Church

Can someone explain why the 02:19, 22 Jun 2005 81.178.95.250 edit removed my work.

Answer:

Because (1) it is cliche which is (2) groundless and (3) irrelevant.

Further question On what basis is it groundless?

Further answer The onus of proof is upon you.

Proof

The contribution of the Church is seen in our daily life.


Another fatuous claim. "The contribution of the Church is seen in our daily life" -- even my having bacon and eggs for breakfast tomorrow? Is this an encyclopedia or Emmy Bezzina's latest rant?

User:Demdem

Proof [[2]] Maltesedog 08:15, 18 September 2005 (UTC)

Economic History

Cleaned up this section for grammatical errors. --Sir Edgar 09:00, 25 July 2005 (UTC)

External links

The external links section in this article is too long. Can someone who knows the subject check and trim the list? See Wikipedia:External links for criteria. Rl 10:18, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

I propose to add a link to the dynamic map found at http://www.bestof-malta.com/country.php?lg=GB. It contains video of different place of Malta

Demography

A recent addition to demography on number of births in the past and at present, as influenced by the insularity of the island and the powerful influence of the church in the past was removed. Why was this done?

Maltesedog 08:55, 04 September 2005 (UTC)

There's no proof that Maltese birthrates (which are not very different from other European countries') were influenced by the insularity of the island or the pwerful influence of the Church. Again, this is cliche. Can you ignore more important (economic) factors like the greater expense to raise a child to mention but one?

217.15.96.18 16:21, 8 September 2005 (UTC)Demdem

Demdem regarding the influence of the church this influence can be viewed in the book entitled Malta - Background for Development. by H.Bowen-Jones, J.C. Dewdney, W.B. Fisher. I hope you have a copy or if not try and obtain it.. its an old book but its quite good.

In view of the above if the rest agree, I shall remake the comment asbout the church. 08:12, 18 September 2005 (UTC)

Southernmost point in Europe?

Gibraltar is not even the most southerly point on the Iberian Peninsula — Punta de Tarifa in Spain is further south — let alone in Europe.

-->> I do not know which is geographically the southernmost, but there are also the Spanish enclaves in North Africa to consider...Ceuta and Melilla if I'm not mistaken...

  • We're talking geographically not politically here. Even though politically, the spanish enclaves in North Africa are further south, they geographically do not form part of Europe Maltesedog 16:36, 25 October 2005 (UTC)
  • Gavdos, just south of Krete is the southern most point of Europe/

Norum 27.07.2006

Rabat or Victoria?

I know it is a CIA map, but isn't it out of date? The main town on Gozo is called Victoria, Rabat is an older name not now used much.

No, Rabat is a Maltese version of the English name 'Victoria' which is still in use. Maltese people refer to Victoria as Rabat. Maltesedog 15:47, 13 October 2005 (UTC)

Isn't Victoria in Rabat (Gozo), same as Mdina being in Rabat (Malta)? Keith Azzopardi 22:16, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Both Mdina & Victoria are citadels (fortified cities), which are situated in the middle of an even larger town (Cittadella in maltese). Keith Azzopardi 22:18, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Removal of History from site

Can someone explain the reason for the removal of the history of Malta from the article Maltesedog 13:26, 21 October 2005 (UTC)

I didn't do it nor can I explain it. However, I wonder if it is due to the duplication with the 'history of malta' article, which duplication I have wondered about for a while. hth. Srl 04:57, 16 November 2005 (UTC)

The Malta Page should have a summary of the history obviously. Fortunately the mistake was reverted. Maltesedog 15:03, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

Revolutionary changes in the article

As you note, the article is being peer reviewed and therefore certain changes had to be made. If you can help, kindly view the peer review of this article and amend the information as requested.

Language or Dialect?

Malta says dialect, Maltese language says language. See discussion here: Talk:Maltese_language#language_or_dialect? Srl 11:01, 25 November 2005 (UTC)

Obviously its a language. Check out the Talk page now. Maltese language is definitely not an arab dialect. its structure is derived from Arabic, yet changes were done from European languages and new words introduced as time went by. Maltesedog 19:12, 1 December 2005 (UTC)

Mattered questioned to offical body Maltesedog 15:02, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

The Maltese language has several different dialects itself. Also, Maltese is greatly influenced from English and italian, and is not spoken as fast as other arabic languages. However, the Maltese language IS primary composed of words derived from other arabic languages. Keith Azzopardi 22:21, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

English in Malta

I understand English is the secondary language in Malta, but does anyone speak it natively or does it have a similar status to English as an official language in India. And, if so, why wasn't it done away with as an official language when Italian was? Just a general wondering.

One must have a background of both the history and politics of Malta to understand why Italian was done away with. The British made Maltese the official language so as to stop any italian influence during World War II. I'd suggest you'll also see Minglish. Keith Azzopardi 22:24, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

colony or occupation?

Someone changed Malta#Demographics to:

Education in Malta is based on the British Model owing its origins in Malta's previous occupation.

I reverted it back to colonial past, otherwise it seems like POV implying a hostile takeover or at least a more contentious situation than my understanding of the history would lend itself to. Any comments? Srl 18:35, 1 December 2005 (UTC)

Agree.. Maltesedog 19:17, 1 December 2005 (UTC)

The British came to Malta to defend us from the French (1802). Such an agreement is called a Protettorat in Maltese. However, after some time the British colonised Malta (in 1813), even though the Maltese citezens wanted to remain an independent country. Keith Azzopardi 22:27, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

History

Spain did not even exist in the year 1530. The islands were given by the Ancient Reign of Aragon--Paco ✉ 07:57, 4 December 2005 (UTC)

Correct were is the mistake. Kindly take the intiative to amend anything you think which is best. Maltesedog

Perhaps someone could indicate which side the British were supporting with their aid. It's not entirely clear from the history. 15:02, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

Repositioning of Image

Is the repositioning of the temples image correct? I think it was better before. Maltesedog 15:02, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

Moved from article

Moved from article. El_C 11:44, 17 December 2005 (UTC) Hi, I don't have the knowledge to do this, but please add the immigration problem discussion from http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20051215/lf_nm/malta_immigration_dc to this article. Right now the net flow of 1,000 makes it seem like Malta's all nice and happy. 128.36.68.50

Flag

Why is someone always changing the flag. The actual flag is the one shown before.

The matter has been resolved, and the flag in SVG format has been updated. Special thanks to User:Zscout370, for his help. More details about the flag, can be view both on my talk page, and on the talk page of User:Zscout370. Maltesedog 22:50, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

Controversy

Geophyisical controversy.. please cite your source from where you are getting the knowledge that geophysically Malta forms parts of the African Plate. Hopefully this would solve the Vandalism Maltesedog 22:45, 4 January 2006 (UTC)

It has always been a controversy and my last remembrance from school is that we were on the Eurasian, but from the research I did it seems the plate boundary cut sicily horizontally, so we would be on the African. I'll ask Prof. Lanfranco at UM and update as necessary. VodkaJazz 02:58, 14 January 2006 (UTC)

Any updates? Maltesedog 17:53, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

Not yet, sorry. He (and me) are busy with exams at the moment. Will take another two weeks from my part. VodkaJazz 19:25, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

- - - -

The issue of the continental plates is, I believe, irrelevant here.

Nations aren't grouped in specific continents based on which continental plate they are on, but rather which peice of land they are located on or near.

MYLO 03:31, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

An "is irrelevant" is not the answer we are seeking VodkaJazz 12:57, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

On what basis are you considering relevance. Relevance is subjective. Retain. Maltesedog 15:38, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

- - - -

It is irrelevant to the issue on which continent Malta lies.

Like I said, for good or bad, the continents of the world aren't defined by continental plates. If so, there would be a continent of India, a Continent of Arabia, and a continent of Eurasia.

Since Malta lies closest to italy (Sicily), then is shoult be considered part of Europe.

Show me another country that is defined by which tectonic plate it lies on?


Also, this part about "older the Pyramids of Egypt" is not needed. Was it put in just for a boast? So what? These structures are older than the Parthenon as well, why not mention that as well?

The Maltese structures are part of what is known as the Neolithic Megaliths. If you want to boast about "older" than this or that, do it at some Maltese nationalist website. The way I phrased it avoids meaningless comparisons with other lands. It also gives any reader the link to read about the Megaliths, not about the Pyramids of Egypt.

Aslot he use of the word "civilization" is misleading, implying a state of developement comparable to, say ancient Egypt or Mesopotamia. "Culture" is a better term. We are talking here about neolithic stone age cultures.

The purpose of Wikipedia, and I may be wrong here, is to provide information. Talk about tectonic plates, and comparisons with the Pyramids of Egypt, don't do any such thing. MYLO 18:23, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

---

  • In no way does the introduction try to say on which continent Malta lies. This was purposely done to avoid any disputes of this nature! You may want to check the rudimentary article Continent, where you can see that in general there is no defined way of setting the continents. The use of geopolitical and geophysical aspects give crude facts - Malta is politically European and physically on the African plate - that cannot be argued. The EU itself does not try and venture in giving a definite answer to whether a country is European or note, see Copenhagen criteria#Geographic criteria. Since Malta (like Cyprus in the article) was accepted into the EU, it means that there are enough arguments for it to be politically European. But if it is physically on the African plate, there's nothing anyone can do. Indeed, half of Sicily is on the African plate aswell.
  • The "older than the pyramids" part was used to help the reader get a perspective of how old this civilization is. Boasting, as you put it, is a very difficult thing to define. Comparing the Maltese temples to the pyramids is not necessarily boasting. While I understand your point, by the guidelines of Wikipedia I suggest adding to rather than changing this part. If the temples are older than the pyramids I see no reason whatsoever not to write it!
  • The culture vs civilization proposal seems justified, from my preliminary reads of Civilization and Neolithic.

Since you have been around for so little time I suggest you provide more experienced editors some more respect. The right way to have your opinion given importance is to listen and discuss. Dogmatic behaviour does not help in the creation of articles. In addition, relevance is a subjective matter. What may be irrelevant for what you are seeking may be relevant to someone else (ex. a geography student). For an encyclopedia of such a generalized target readership as wikipedia, it is probably best to give all information and leave the intelligent reader to decide what is and is not relevant for his/her cause.

Please refrain from editing the disputed part of the article before a consensus is reached. Till then, the original paragraph prevails. VodkaJazz 20:21, 26 February 2006 (UTC)


Here is my view:

  • I agree with the edit from the link to Phoenicia to the link to Phoenicians. I believe this should be done.
  • I see no point in removing information regarding contintal plates. However, VodkaJazz had to check with Profs Lanfranco, the accuracy of this statement, which I tend to dispute.
  • I tend to agree with the term culture instead of civilization
  • We should always be polite and keep calm when dealing with new users and avoid unneccessary controversies. Remember, that you were a new user yourself. Having stated this regarding the comment on the Pyramids, its disputable. I agree it should be kept, but we need a third opinion, maybe from a foreigner.
  • Lastly, Guid, you reverted edits and I think you removed unintentially robot assisted languages.
    • I checked. All the languages added by the robot were already or are now present. VodkaJazz 16:38, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

Maltesedog 22:42, 26 February 2006 (UTC)


- - - -


You are right, I only joined Wikipedia recently, but that doesn't mean I only began reading history recently.


First about "Afro-Asiatic", this doesn't bother me much, other than that it is needlessly redundant. You already wrote "Semitic", which means any interested reader can then link from there to find out more about the Semitic languages. If I were to mention "Kurdish" in any articlel, do I then have to mention that it belongs to the Iranian langauges of the Indo-Iranian branch of the Indo-European family? This is fine in the article on the Kurdish langauge (as it indeed does), but is more than what is needed when Kurdish is mentioned in another article.

Either "The Maltese language is the only Semitic language...", or "The Maltese language is the only Afro-Asiatic language...", would be just fine.


Now, about the plate, if your point was not the address the issue on which continent Malta is considered a part of, why then include this part on the tectonic plate? If you believe that the issue on which continent Malta is a part of is unresolved, then why not include both this piece of information, and the distances between Malta and its neighbors?

But fine, it is not worth arguing over.


About the "Pyramids" part, you claim it is not boasting but added to give an idea of the Maltese structure's age, then why not just state that they may have been built between so-and-so? How many people even know the age of the Pyramids? By the way you put it, for someone to find out the age of the Maltese structures, they'd have to click on the link to the Pyramids, find out how old they are, the subtract by a thousand!

Further, your version makes no mention of the Neolithic peoples, not of Megaliths. That's like writing abot the the gladiators without mentioning colosseums nor Rome!

You can't admit to yourself that my version is better, both because it avoids meaningless comparisons (there is nothing at all in common between the Maltese structures and the Pyramids of Egypt that would warrant their being mentioned together), as well as mentions important related topics namely Megaliths and Neolithic.


Having agreed that these structures were built by Neolithic setllers, it then makes sense that the term "culture" is used, not civilization. I am aware that already too many people mis-use the word "civilization" as a synonym for "culture", but when possible, that should be corrected.


"Since you have been around for so little time I suggest you provide more experienced editors some more respect."

Aaahh yes, the old "newbie" line. And I thought such things were only found among teen web Forums.

Tell me then, just how long will I have to wait before daring to correct and improve an article? Having joined Wikipedia, should I sit on my hands for another year or two before editing my first article?

As for your threat, is this how things go in Wikipedia? having just joined, you can't edit an article until you get permission from those who've been around longer, regardless of how wrong they are?

Or am I to take it to the discussion page first, no matter how minor the edit, wait for your approval and permission before editing anything?

Or are such rules only limited to the Malta page?

MYLO 01:22, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

---

My answer is simple: The day you learn the rules. VodkaJazz 14:13, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

Wikification

I have added the page was removed from wikification.

Some heavy labour work is needed for the information table, which has to be converted from Wiki table format into the Infobox_Country format. See it used effectively in the UK page.

The article in general has a somewhat old base, and therefore there are many "old styles" which need to be updated. In particular is the issue of characters (like the em-dash) which need not be written with the HTML ampersand style anymore since unicode is now supported, and the use of HTML in some parts of the text. VodkaJazz 03:59, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

Are you sure HTML ampersands for emdash and en dash should not be used? Wikipedia:Manual of Style (dashes) doesn't seem to agree. -- Mikeblas 21:48, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

Copyvio

The recent additions on food etc. appear to be a copyvio. please advise. Maltesedog

All of Axismbb's edits were copyvios or similar trash - the guy thinks wiki is some sort of scrapbook :/
  • Economy -- "It is currently ranked in 58th place in our top 80 markets." our = who? our = Bizezia = copyright owner [3] p.3 onwards
  • Food & Cuisine -- © World Infozone Limited 2006 [4]
  • Arts -- © World Infozone Limited 2006 [5]
  • Holidays -- Carnaval [6]
  • Jessicart is a commercial link (famous? LOL)
  • In addition, BOTH these YourMalta and ChooseMalta are commercial.

I'll do the mass revert, hoping no edit wars will arise :/

VodkaJazz 02:12, 11 February 2006 (UTC)

As usual vodka, many thanks for your kind and professional help. Maltesedog 14:31, 11 February 2006 (UTC)

Links

Hi I would like to propose the addition of the link to the video Map about Malta and Gozo

http://www.bestof-malta.com/country.php?lg=GB

First and unique map of this kind

Fabrice H 13:30, 16 January 2007 (UTC)Fabrice H

The map is cool, good job, but there's no place for it on wikipedia unforunately. Marcus1234 16:40, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

Hi, I would like to add the following link to the links :

it's

http://malta.atspace.com

If you check the link it's the first english to maltese dictionary, the first and unique one of it's kind!

thank you

I understand that since the article is in peer review, it can attract a good number of vandalizers, but this is becoming a tedious and useless task. Each time I go round the recent edits, I barely find 1 on 10 constructive additions, the rest being vandalism, commercial links or reverts.

Extreme measures need extreme ways, and therefore I have a suggestion. Any new links have to be entered in the Talk page before being added to the article. All other new links would be, by policy, mercilessly removed -- at least for the moment. It is not much of a gratifying task to police featured articles of my country, nor is it for the rest of my conpatriots on wiki. This way we do not need to verify the links each time.

P.S. I agree that the article is not in grave need of wikification, though the label was there for a specific reason - the table, as also explained above. Understanding all good intentions, and possibly frustration for not finding anything to wikify, having a glance at the Talk page would have helped us all!

May I also ask for sources to be cited (in the edit description or talk page) for such elements as dates, be it a textbook or a site. It removes a lot of the burden of verifying the information.

VodkaJazz 21:42, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

Whilst I agree with your move towards an infobox rather than a template, please ensure that information such as Patron Saints, Largest Cities, National Bird, Tree, Poet, Plant are included in the content of the article. Maltesedog 14:17, 25 February 2006 (UTC)

All that stuff is still present (commented). The problem is that either the fields do not exist or I do not know them. I'm not that experienced with them so I don't know if one can add to the template. Anyone who manages to find a way will find all the missing info towards the end of the infobox source. VodkaJazz 12:48, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

Up to my knowledge they can't be included. They have to be included into the main text. I worked a few times with templates, see University of Malta and Widnet il-Bahar. Maltesedog 15:36, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

What measures can be taken?? I have just removed vandalism and new links. I will make a comment on the main page and ask for approval in the talk page by us or other people who take care of including useful and relevant non-commercial stuff on the page Maltesedog 21:20, 27 February 2006 (UTC)

With time it will stop. It's the tough game they want, and that's what they're getting. I'm reporting to admin all relapsers to have them blocked. No mercy. The species has to die out some day or another! VodkaJazz 01:00, 2 March 2006 (UTC)

Regarding the last two links: It seems nobody knows how to read :/ Anyway, I'm tired of all this. My votes are for accepting the laws summaries & rejecting the guinea pigs thing which is a personal site of the poster himself + irrelevant. I'm too busy being sick and enjoying the reads on my talk page. VodkaJazz 07:25, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

Agree. The law summary was given adequate explanation for its inclusion in the edit summary Maltesedog 10:21, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

Yet other unscreened links. That three-line warning in all caps seems to be useless. VR Malta looks a good media site. The non-commercial stuff YourMalta offers is nothing special and not worth linking to IMO. └ VodkaJazz/talk┐ 17:05, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

Please make sure any links you suggest conform to Wikipedia:External links. └ VodkaJazz / talk ┐ 20:11, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

Reverts of 5 March, 19:00 (wiki-time)

I have reverted the changes of 3 users. Here is an explanation:

18:46, 4 March 2006

DeAceShooter (→See also - Removed link to Pan Am Flight 103 (irrelevant).)

The Pan Am case put Malta on the map and is still sometimes in the news to this very day. It's a tragic day in history to which Malta is directly connected to. It is not mentioned in the article itself but in an appropriate section.

Vodkajazz, I cannot agree with you on this. There are hundreds of articles in which Malta is mentioned. Should we list them all on the basis of the above argument? Maltesedog 19:38, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

On second thought you're right. VodkaJazz 14:23, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

00:02, 5 March 2006 MYLO

MYLO (Once again IMPROVED artciel.)

  • You did not improve the article.
  • You went against these Wikipedia guidelines: Wikiquette, Unilateral action, Resolving disputes, Flaming.
  • You went against article guidelines set up to prevent an edit war. In particular the guideline not to change the first section of the article before a consensus is reached in the Talk page.

I have reported the dispute, given you a vandalism warning, and decided that it will soon be time to get myself a meta:Wikistressmeter (please note the irony).

Now I cannot talk for everyone here, but you improvements, at least by me, are not welcome anymore. (Vodkajazz).

Mylo, please refer to the above comments by Vodkajazz. In this instance, I can do nothing but agree with him on this point. If there is disagreement on something, you cannot simply take the initiative and commence edit wars.

Maltesedog 19:40, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

16:29, 5 March 2006 194.204.104.203

194.204.104.203 (→External links)

Change to external links without posting on the Talk page was deemed as vandalism, see above. User reported.

VodkaJazz 19:10, 5 March 2006 (UTC)


New External Links

I would like to suggest the following external links:

MaltaFan 14:20, 17 March 2006 (UTC))

  • I am neutral to SearchMalta, Di-ve, and Buettni -- more feedback needed.
    • First of all SearchMalta is a directory not a search engine. While the links there are usually quite good, I'm doubtful on (1) whether the information is correct; (2) the site is actually up-to-date (horrible design btw); and (3) if the site could possibly be considered commercial.
    • Di-ve is a great resource. Especially the live TV and radio streams, and special minisites for events (ex. CHOGM, elections). On the other hand, it could be considered mainly a news site, in which case the argument below for The Times could be brought up.
    • Beuttni is a German site which has been coming and going for quite some time. I'm not sure if it was previously considered commercial. It's a good site though.
  • Personally I always thought The Times would be a good link, but objectively, if one links to The Times, then all the other newspapers would need to be linked to. Maybe an article such as "Newspapers of Malta" could be created with all the links... and after that maybe a section in the Malta article. Again, no external links here though.
  • Ira's site does not fit in. She's linked to in the Music of Malta article, and her article has the external link. Same goes for other artists. Same as for the Times, it's either all or nothing. On the other hand, as has been suggested when the article was up for peer review, we need a section on Maltese music in the Malta article itself, where a direct link Ira Losco's article would be acceptable (but not the external link).

└ VodkaJazz/talk┐ 14:59, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

My views:

  • I was involved in SearchMalta in the past. Had made friends with original owner, who used to hold the site hosting in the former headquarters of IBM and subsequently it was taken over by Terranet Ltd. It is indeed meant to be a Maltese searchengine, though it has estabilished itself more as a directory I believe. I believe, that it should be included. Of particlar interest is the Malta Surname Connection.
  • Definitely DI-VE.com is a good resource though my personal rating towards the site due to a number of broken links/functions which do not function are on the increase. Would include.
  • Agree with vodka regarding the times website. If we include the times, we should include www.maltastar.com, www.maltarightnow.com, in-nazzjon website, l-orizzont website, the malta independent, and so on.
  • Ira Losco is already shown in her article.

So Maltafan, if you want to include these 3 sites, provided no one objects, you can do so. Maltesedog 15:54, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

I agree with Maltafan on Search Malta not being a search engine at all, technically speaking it is not. It is a searchable Directory (no crawler for instance). May I suggest adding Malta Network Resources www.maltanetworkresources.com, which is a search engine and Web Directory.

Politics

I am a bit concerned about the latest additions to the Politics section. While I do not know whether the content is true, the layout and language is rather out of stylistic context compared to the rest of the article. A list (sort of!) is simply not opportune. There is a whole article about politics and I do not see why the new parties should be given more than simple mention here. At the moment they occupy more space than the two main parties together! The additions were also made by an IP with a known vandalism history.

I think the article Politics of Malta should be expanded. Particularly missing are detailed historical accounts of the process for independence, accession into the EU, local election results, and current happenings, which IMO possibly represent a rich source of news, daily. List of political parties in Malta needs a lot of work. In the present state, there is no use in having a seperate article.

└ VodkaJazz/talk┐ 01:12, 23 March 2006 (UTC)

Indeed it really does not make sense. I am unable to expand further in the matter of politics, since I am affliated to a particular political party and hence my view will not be neutral. We need an independent view Maltesedog 17:45, 23 March 2006 (UTC)


ETHNICITY

Maltese have got a Semitic African heritage. They are only classed as European because they are Christian and adopt western culture. They are mixed race and many do not look white in appearance. Geoff Fenech the Austalian Maltese Boxer is a good example. (Unsigned)

Disagree.. Malta being located between Africa and Italy has a mixture of cultures Maltesedog 07:22, 23 April 2006 (UTC)

Disagree also. The first Maltese came from Sicily, not from Africa.

Correct - the first Maltese came from Sicily Maltesedog 21:05, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

Apart from the fact that the first Maltese came from Sicily, Malta was often mostly influenced from European Empires, such as Aragona, France, the British, the knights of St.John and probably a few more that I'm forgetting. But one thing is sure, European poeple have spent more time in Malta then African/ Semetic ones. Keith Azzopardi 22:35, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Language - common use of English

Is English widely used on Malta? That is, it is stated as one of the two official languages - but is it in common use among the people on Malta? 83.20.173.234 11:21, 30 April 2006 (UTC) Winston

It is commonly used by the press, it is widely spoken, officially one of the languages as specified in the Constitution. The everday spoken language remains Maltese. Textbooks in schools are mostly in English, Laws are drafted both in English & Maltese, the Government Gazette is published both in English & Maltese. Maltesedog 20:56, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

Thanks. Can people randomly met on the street speak English? Or is it true only of a part (if so, how large?) of the community? 83.20.253.4 21:24, 30 April 2006 (UTC) Winston

Most Maltese people can speak Maltese, English and Italian. Some actually used English (and a minority Italian) in everyday life (like when talking to family). └ VodkaJazz / talk ┐ 07:54, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

The minority which speaks Italian in everyday life are actually Italians which live in Malta. In certain villages like Sliema, the use of English is predominant. Of course, if you meet people in the street and you talk to them in English, most of them are able to reply in engilish. Maltesedog 10:41, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

This is dicussed further up in the page, so why did you create another section dicussing the language? Keith Azzopardi 22:37, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Prime Minister of Malta

With reference to the edit by Kennethfar, I hereby quote the constitution of Malta. What may be the norm, is not the rule.

Section 80 Constitution of Malta

Wherever there shall be occasion for the appointment of a Prime Minister, the President shall appoint as Prime Minister the member of the House of Representatives who, in his judgment, is best able to command the support of a majority of the members of that House and shall, acting in accordance with the advice of the Prime Minister, appoint the other Ministers from among the members of the House of Representatives.


3 questions for someone who lives on Malta

1.What is average salary per month in Malta(when you make it into Euros)?

The minimum wage is around €150 per week. I would say the average is around double, but this is only me.

More or less correct, excluding earnings from the black market economy, that is.


2.Does many people in Malta speak Italian amongst themselves?

Maltese and English are the languages used in normal conversation, but most people can speak Italian discretely and virtually everyone understands Italian.

Saying that Maltese and English are the languages used in normal conversation is a bit exxagerated. English is spoken in normal conversation by no more than 10% of the people (probably a lot less.) English is spoken by no more than 75 % of the people at best. Also saying tha virtually everyone understands Italian is incorrect. I guess no more than 50 - 60 % of the people do so. (Do not forget the large number of uneducated people in Malta, especially in the south)


I agree with the above comment. Most people (maybe 90%) understand English but FEW can speak fluently (Maybe 40% at most; the truth is most people are much more comfortable speaking Maltese and find expressing themselves in English somewhat tough). When it comes to Italian, I'll guess around 60% have a decent understand of the language, but VERY FEW can actually speak it (Maybe 20% at most). Just my two cents.

Drew88 18:55, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

I think that the number of uneducated poeple in Malta is constantly being reduced, and that more and more poeple are managing to understand english and italian. However I think that the above statistics are the best. Keith Azzopardi 22:40, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

3.How do you get a work permit for working in Malta?

From the ETC, see http://www.etc.gov.mt/site/page.aspx?pageid=2128

Thank you very much 212.200.215.162 03:23, 6 June 2006 (UTC) Answered by: └ VodkaJazz / talk ┐ 20:07, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

dictionary online from english to maltese

I would like to suggest this site for inclusion: It is a free translator from the english language to the maltese language :

http://malta.atspace.com/english-maltese-dictionary.htm

what u think?

thank you

No, the link is more relevant under Maltese Language. Maltesedog 14:08, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

Vandalism

I added some information about Malta, it was deleted twice for me and to add insult to injury I was sent a message telling me that I was vandalising the page. I think it is the other way round here - other people are vandalising my work? Didn't you read the Guidlines of Wikipedia that you should NOT delete other people's work but add to it or make changes so that a compromise should be arrived at. I hope this does not happen again as it does not reflect well on our country.


Thanks Macros 23:31, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Macro's the article is about Malta not about speedcameras. Your work is purely vandalism. Maltesedog 21:31, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Vandalism yes, but probably unintentional. Macro seems to be new to wikipedia, so I don't think that it is appropriate for him to be shouted at (or in this case, written at) Keith Azzopardi 22:43, 15 December 2006 (UTC) :-)

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