Talk:Jersey pound

mistake?

The Queen is wearing a crown in the new issue notes, but officially she is the Duke of Normandy. I think this may be a mistake, or a popular myth. (Fdsdh1 (talk) 17:09, 11 December 2012 (UTC))

?

What's not clear here is whether the Jersey pound is legal tender in the UK. LeoO3 03:43, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)

The article links in the first sentence to Legal tender where the UK legal tender situation is explained. Man vyi 06:33, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Blush, oops. Slogged through the whole thing looking for that and it was right up top. Thanks. LeoO3 18:10, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Coin Motto

The article says "The motto round the milled edge of Jersey pound coins is: Insula Caesarea ("Island of Jersey" in Latin)." However, Insula Caesarea means "islands of Caesar" in Latin, and History of Jersey says Jersey got its name from Vikings, and also says "The tradition that the Island was called Caesarea by the Romans appears to have no basis in fact." Can this part be clarified? --Awiseman 17:25, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

To clarify: Caesarea is the traditional (late) Latin name for Jersey, hence the adjective Caesarean to refer to things pertaining to Jersey (rather old-fashioned, but for an example see [1]). The Romans called Jersey something else (probably Andium, but it's a matter of academic opinion - see also Talk:Guernsey#Guernsey_not_Sarnia.3F). Insula is singular; plural is insulae. Caesarea is grammatically in apposition to noun insula. Meaning is Island (of) Caesarea viz. Island of Jersey. Man vyi 20:30, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

I mistyped Islands rather than Island. But can you clarify that in the article then? Since technically it says Island of Caesarea, which is an old name of Jersey. --Awiseman 20:38, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

Since Caesarea is the Latin name for Jersey, the translation is technically Island of Jersey, I'd say. There's more in-depth, but hardly exhaustive, discussion of at least one theory of the toponymical history of the Island over at fr:. Man vyi 21:38, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

Treasurer's Holding of BoE notes

I can't find any other source that backs this claim, and it is at odds with the Tresurer's report stating a 'profit' from increased issues of Jersey pounds (holding an extra £0.10 sterling for each new £1 Jersey issued would result in a 'cost', not a 'profit') 82.152.96.238 15:31, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

Contradictions in "History" section

The history section says: "The livre tournois had been used as the legal currency in Jersey for centuries... it remained the legal currency in Jersey until 1837.". But then we read "The livre tournois circulated officially alongside British currency in Jersey until 1834..".

1. One of these dates must be wrong, but I don't know which.
2. The phrase "the legal currency" implies that the livre tournais was the only legal currency up until 1834 or 1837 (whichever it is). However, this is contradicted by the statement that it "circulated officially alongside British currency" up until that date (which implies that British currency was legal tender too).

Ideally this needs clarifying but unfortunately I don't have the specialist knowledge to know how to fix it. Maybe someone will!

Matt 14:27, 5 September 2006 (UTC).

Sinel's chronology Jersey through the centuries (1984) doesn't disperse the clouds of confusion. According to Sinel, "English money declared the sole legal tender" 1 October 1834. But "French coinage no longer legal tender" 16 September 1923. Man vyi 14:30, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

Balleine's History of Jersey confirms that the States adopted accounts in £.s.d in 1834 with a fixed conversion for sous - but that De Gruchy's (department) store only stopped accepting French currency in 1851 and "in the early years of the 20th century French copper coins were still accepted as legal tender in Jersey". Man vyi 16:45, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

Does it confirm what the status of British currency was on the island prior to 1834? Was it in official or unofficial use? Matt 17:41, 5 September 2006 (UTC).

Research in the library, looking up the various legislation and contemporary reports, gives the following information. Until the 1720s, the currency used was the livre tournois (divided into 20 sous, which were each divided into 12 deniers) but the commonest coin in circulation was the liard (1/4 of a sou). However the copper coinage had devalued against silver and by the 1720s liards were being exhanged in St Malo at a rate of 6 to the sou. The consequent cross-border financial speculation given the discrepancy in coinage values was threatening economic stability. The States of Jersey therefore resolved to devalue the liard to 6 to the sou. The legislation to that effect brought in in 1729 caused popular riots that shook the establishment. (reference: Balleine) The devaluation was therefore cancelled and the liard remained officially at 4 to the sou until 1834 (and liard remains the Jèrriais word for a farthing). The Code des Lois of 1771 codified the value of the livre tournois against sterling in order to regulate the exchange of sterling paid to the British garrison and the currency used by the population. (reference: Code des Lois 1771). By the 1830s the surviving livre tournois coinage was in such short supply and so worn as to be unusable that the States passed a law on 18 September 1834 that sterling would be sole legal tender as from 1 October 1834 (this law was confirmed by Order in Council 24 June 1835). However, although sterling was sole legal tender, French coinage continued to circulate in Jersey. On the 7 February 1923 the States passed a law to ban the import of foreign copper coinage in sums exceeding 20 sous. This law was confirmed by Order in Council 12 March 1923 and registered in the Royal Court 7 April 1923. The States then proceeded to take steps to remove French copper coinage from circulation. On 2 August 1923 the States authorised the Finance Committee to exchange French copper coins for Jersey copper coins. Between 27 August 1923 and 8 September 1923 the Treasury carried out at their office the exchange of 2 sous and 1 sou French coins for Jersey coins and placed advertisements in the press to that effect with an additional reminder that French coinage remained not legal tender (reference: Les Chroniques de Jersey). Man vyi 14:00, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

Wow. It would be good to merge this info into the article, if anyone's feeing brave! Matt 14:01, 17 September 2006 (UTC).

If anyone thinks it's all relevant to Jersey pound, go ahead. (I've now corrected some typos). Some of it may be better off in Livre tournois or Economy of Jersey. Man vyi 15:20, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

I've created a new article, Jersey livre, based on the text above from Man vyi. I'd be gratefull if Man vyi could check it over and supply details for the references to Balleine and Les Chroniques de Jersey. I've consequently slimmed down this article to remove the discussion of the early use of the livre.
Dove1950 21:22, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

Mention of Scottish notes

From the article:

"Both Jersey notes and Bank of England notes are legal tender in Jersey and circulate together, alongside the Guernsey pound and Scottish banknotes."

The mention of Scottish banknotes here seems surprising, given that Scottish notes barely "circulate" even in England. Some further explanation would be useful.

Matt 14:32, 5 September 2006 (UTC).

I get Scottish notes in my change about as often as Guernsey notes - not very often but occasionally. Guernsey coinage is more common. In the past week I've spent some Northern Ireland notes in Jersey with nobody turning a hair in the shops. Man vyi 16:45, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

That's most interesting. In England I don't think I have ever received Scottish notes in change, and it can be quite hard to spend them - many people are unsure what they are and what they are worth. On the face of it one would expect Scottish notes to be even rarer and even more unfamiliar in the Channel Islands. Any idea why they are circulating there? Matt 17:09, 5 September 2006 (UTC).

The more logical question is why Scottish notes don't circulate more in England. Scottish tourists and Scottish people working in Jersey who return from trips to their homeland probably account for most of the Scottish notes. Man vyi 14:00, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

I live in Guernsey and there definately are Scottish notes going around here. I would not say that they are anywhere near as common place as a Jersey one, which I see very often, and I can't recall seeing one in my change, but when you work in a shop, you see a few of them. I am quite surprised that you never see them in England. Ortac (talk) 17:23, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

Matt is probably from some isolated village in southern England or Wales with a "local shop for local people"... he might not even know that England has a border with Scotland! He talks about "people are unsure [...] what they are worth"? The text and numbers on the notes gives a clue usually. I agree it may be a problem for illiterate people. When I was in the Lake District, Scottish notes accepted and are given out as change alongside English notes. But even down in this suburban town near London, you see Scottish notes now and again and they are not even "quite hard to spend". 91.85.57.191 (talk) 21:43, 17 December 2012 (UTC)

'Fourth'?

"In 1877, a penny of 1/12 of a shilling was introduced. However, denominations continued to be written as fractions of a shilling, with threepence coins issued in 1957 carrying the denomination "one fourth of a shilling"."

Did it say one fourth? The standard usage in the UK is quarter, rather than fourth...

Yes "one fourth" - a quick search on eBay will probably bring up a pic of one for sale. Man vyi 15:34, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

non fractional reserve?

Is it true that these notes are created not via the fractional reserve banking scheme?--Namaste@^? 20:17, 1 October 2011 (UTC)

Holographic pig

Everyone knows that the queen normally doesn't have a crown on, on the Jersey notes.... but why is there a pig in the hologram, where there would be the Queen as seen otherwise on English notes. This should be added to the main article. Brydustin (talk) 23:25, 27 February 2012 (UTC)

Frequently/Rarely used coins?

Are there any sources for the division used here? It's surprising that the 20p is listed as rarely used. CMD (talk) 01:09, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

I've shifted 20p to frequently used, and moved £1 to rarely used, as the notes remain very common. CMD (talk) 20:11, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

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