Talk:Hjalmar Johansen

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Added Seamount Reference[edit]

The approval of Hjalmar Johansen Seamount by the IHO/UNESCO Subcommittee of Underwater Formation names passed by with little fanfare in 2005. I submitted the proposal, so I thought I'd post it here. A fitting tribute to a man who was not made for this world, a flawed hero who never really enjoyed the fruits of his heroism. Jonathan Snow, University of Houston. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.250.112.161 (talk) 21:47, 25 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I asked at Reference Desk[edit]

about a reference for Hjalmar Johansen being world champion in gymnastics. No point leaving the comments there to be archived; I'm copying them here:

HISTORY and/or SPORT

We have an article about the Norwegian Fredrik Hjalmar Johansen, polar explorer with Nansen and Amundsen. There is no doubt that he was also a gymnast. According to Norwegian Wikipedia, he won the Norwegian Championship in 1885 in Fredrikshald and the World Championship in 1889 in Paris. It's this last item, the 1889 World Championship, I'd like to have a reference for. Thank you, - Hordaland (talk) 07:32, 9 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Here's a reference to him getting a gold medal in Paris, without a name for the event or a year given. Do you know the name of the event? Possibly it was at the World's Fair? Best, WikiJedits (talk) 13:37, 9 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
You're good, thanks. Took a little looking to find out more about the book: Fridtjof Nansen in the Frozen World. The Fram Expedition. Fridtjof Nansen; S. L. Berens (Editor) To quote the lengthy title page when this book was originally published in 1897: "The 'Fram' Expedition, Nansen in the Frozen World, preceded by a biography of the great explorer and copious extracts from Nansen's First Crossing of Greenland; also an account by [Eivind] Astrup of life among people near the pole, and his journey across northern Greenland with Lieutenant Robert E. Peary, United States Navy, arranged and edited by S. L. Berens, Cand. Ph.D. Followed by a brief history of the principal earlier arctic explorations from the Ninth Century to the Peary Expedition, including those of Cabot, Frobisher, Bering, Sir John Franklin, Kane, Hayes, Hall, Nordenskjold, Nareds, Schwatka, DeLong, Greely, and others; by John E. Read, Assistant Editor of the Columbian Cyclopedia. Paperback, 536 pp, International Law & Taxation, 2003, English, ISBN: 9781410209832 (Available for 303 Norwegian crowns.)

NorwWikipedia says that in 1889 "he was part of the Norwegian national gymnastics team at the World's Fair in Paris, where he became World Champion in gymnastics." As you guessed.

The ref linked above is to page 228 in that book. Rather amusing:
"... As before mentioned, it was no easy matter to make your way about on the deck of the Fram; so I remarked jokingly, "One would need either four legs or a pair of wings to get about among all this litter."
"You should do as Johansen did," answered the mate. "He walked on his hands the other day up the steps from the fo'c'sle, across the whole of the forward deck, up the steps to the after deck, and down the companion into the cabin: and I'm bothered if he was even red in the face when he put his feet down again upon the floor of the saloon."
"Oh, that's nothing for Johansen, he's the first gymnast in Norway," remarked Gjertsen. "In Paris, he made a clean somersault over forty-two men, so that the Frenchmen thought there would be nothing but a wet spot left when he came down. But he fell on his feet, as right as possible. He got a gold medal for that, too!"
Best reference on Johansen is Ragnar Kvam's 1997-book "Den tredje man" (http://catalogue.bl.uk/F/TDRT3EXJIE315Y72EFJ8JVPT4R9EY22Q5CLB7ILEMS67DUJ1B3-22771?func=full-set-set&set_number=106730&set_entry=000008&format=999). Here you find details about Johansen's career as a gymnast. He died Jan 3, 1913 and was buried Jan 9.
Dr Jostmann --188.23.39.238 (talk) 14:16, 19 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Wiki entry on Hjalmar Johansen[edit]

This article seems very biased in favor of the subject of article, and very unfavorably against Roald Amundsen. While certainly a man who was a product of the times, Amundsen seemed above all to be a pragmatist. The biggest sin of Amundsen's seemed to be that he consumed working dogs who were dead, used up, or un-needed. Very few readers contemplate the alternatives-leaving them to starve, killing them and wasting the "food", or feeding them food stores that was needed for the rest of the humans AND animals.

The article vilifies Amundsen for behavior towards Johansen and Prestrud. While leaving men to die would be reprehensible, the fact that they made it (certainly with difficulties) proved that this was not the case. The article also provides many statements on what Amundsen was thinking and feeling - unless taken from the man's autobiography, I cannot fathom how the author determined these "facts".

This article seems very light on corroborating data. Although I do not speak or read Norwegian, I translated the few footnoted entries, and discovered little corroboration. Perhaps providing corroboration from English sources would be more appropriate, seeing as the Wiki article is written in English.

Lastly, the article uses many negative statements towards Amundsen, using perjorative phrases attempting to bias the reader unfavorably towards Amundsen ( such as "without regard for his men", "the mishap enraged Amundsen", "He further disciplined Johansen", "ordering him to subordinate himself", "the triumphant leader made the entire remaining crew sign a paper", "the vengeful Amundsen". These statements are clearly opinions rather than facts, and should not be included.

To their credit, the author does include data about Johansen's faults as well, particularly his drinking and lack of success in many endeavors. However the perjorative adjectives are usually missing in these descriptions.

Although not an issue in this article, writing about Amundsen and Scott tended to show similar biases. While this has been changing slowly in recent times, both of these fallacies tend to follow a similar vein - a concept that it is "Better to be a dead lion, than a live jackel." Personally, I'd rather be a live lion, but that's just me.

Disclosure - I am a descendant of Amundsen, which is how I got to the article. While Roald was certainly NOT a "gentleman", he was a successful, experienced explorer and expedition leader. He was, by dint of his successes, adept at getting the mission completed, and without unnecessary deaths and suffering. While he certainly created his share of controversy, we should be careful to judge him by the standards of his era rather than our own - this tendency seems to be a common mistake in the current PC climate. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 107.138.89.245 (talk) 17:02, 24 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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Obscurity[edit]

What kind of obscurity is the article referring to? I knew his name as the partner of Nansen even as a child in Czechoslovakia around 1990 from books that were widely available (Centkiewicz & Centkiewicz - Na podbój Arktyki translated to Czech). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.102.97.15 (talk) 21:59, 1 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

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