Talk:Hamburg/Archive 1

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Archive 1

Burg ---> borough

My English isn't that good, so I won't add anything to the article, but as far as I know, the ending -burg means "castle". Might be that it is related to borough, but in "Hamburg" it definetely means castle. The arms of Hamburg shows the "Hammaburg" or "Hammerburg" castle, which was situated by the Elbe river and more than likely gave name to the town. Shortly archeologists found some parts of the castle under a construction ground. --84.144.90.165 23:55, 10 October 2005 (UTC)

I would just like to add that according to the offical website it is fortress, so I can see the confusion there. Also in the article it call the fortress "Hamma Burg" I beleve it should be one word "Hammaburg". I'm not changing anything in the article incase I'm wrong but if some one knows for sure please change it. Big-Pat 16:46, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

firestorms

I don't quite find that firestorm discussions should take place in an article about Hamburg. To me, the bombing of Hamburg is way too long and explicitly discussed. --mattinaetnea

This might be, but even you or others should know something about it...

--Modgamers 08:34, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

Light rail

Why are S-Bahn and AKN referred to as light rail systems? JensMueller 08:58, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

Point taken. Wikipedia article on Light rail would suggest that S-Bahn is heavy rail, and more specifically "mass transit". AKN two-car units have light-rail characteristics. --PubliusTacitus 15:47, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

Suburbs

Does anyone know the history behind any of the suburbs of Hamburg? Mainly Eilbeck? I see from the map on the page it was a village on the outskirts in 1800....any other information? --Davideilbeck 14:34, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

Humongous Lists

Prose above lists and all that...

The culture section especially needs some attention, does anyone really need that huge list of dance clubs with their websites linked? That could even count as advertising.

The lists could also be cut down the most culturally significant theatres/clubs, as well as an explanation as to why they have been included.

I personally don't know the city well enough to write prose on these subjects.

If someone else can that would be great. --Evilhairyhamster 12:41, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

I'm going ahead and deleting the dance clubs section, there's no real factual merit, no prose on any of the clubs and an unnecessary amount of links. --Evilhairyhamster 00:05, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

yeah.12.34.47.30 15:21, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

-- I think the club list would be good stuff for Wikitravel...

inner city lakes

The so-called "lakes" Außenalster and Binnenalster are NO LAKES, but only very wide, lake-like parts of the river Alster. They only appear to be lakes to guests. Maybe a native can phrase this more perfectly?

Kajjo —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 84.143.122.69 (talk) 21:20, 8 January 2007 (UTC).

They are indeed lakes, because there is a tide lock at the end of the Binnenalster. I live in Hamburg btw.

I don't know whether there is a real technical definition for "lake", but the Alster is a storage lake. The river alone would not be as wide in the region, if there weren't a dam for hundreds of years. So I guess, lake should be correct. "We" in Hamburg consider them to be lakes at least :) -- Ulkomaalainen 09:59, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

Culture

What's wrong with the culture paragraph? "Landon. Landon. Lanon. Landon. Project. School. German. Laptop." Can somebody revert this. I don't know how to. You can delete my post after you've done that. Thanks! --125.237.6.196 (talk) 04:56, 20 January 2008 (UTC)

Missing

There is no geography section in the article and climate data is also missing. I looked up the average monthly temperatures for for city: [1]. If anyone knows how to make nice tables and charts, please don't hesitate to help out. Thanks, (Einstein00 (talk) 19:39, 21 January 2008 (UTC)) Aswell I have to say that the Coordinates are not completley right. It is not 9deg'59" but exactly 10 degrees east , as the meridian goes exactly through the City(as seen on the Lombards bridge or in a shop on Hamburg mainstreet.)

Sports

Hamburg has actually more Cricket clubs than two. Being a member of one of the clubs ("Alster CC", now: "Alster Rot-Gelb" as being part of the "THC Rot-Gelb Hamburg" hockey and tennis club of klein flottbek)I can say that there is also the club :"Pak Alemi " and "Hamburg International Cricket Club" They play in the North German League(of the North German Cricket Federation(NDCV)which is a subpart of the German Cricket Federation(DCB). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.83.115.216 (talk) 14:48, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Czech territory in Germany

The Czech Republic article currently states: "The Czech Republic also possesses a 30,000-square-metre (7.4-acre) exclave in the middle of the Hamburg Docks, which was awarded to Czechoslovakia by Article 363 of the Treaty of Versailles to allow the landlocked country a place where goods transported downriver could be transferred to seagoing ships. The territory reverts to Germany in 2018."

Is the above true? While it may have been in the Versaille Treaty, is this still legally the position? Can any one provide a source for this? I have found one source:[2], but it is a magazine article and I would not consider it reliable. The Czech-German territory is not on the list of exclaves so if it can be properly shown that it is true, it should presumably be added to the list. The topic is also being discussed at Talk:Czech Republic. Could any one help in verifying the claim? Redking7 (talk) 17:55, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

You can read an German-language article about it on the website of the Czech world service (http://www.radio.cz/de/artikel/58990). It is not an exclave since it is no sovereign Czech territory but German territory leased to Czechoslovakia for 99 years. It will revert in 20 More information can be found in the article on Moldauhafen. MaartenVidal (talk) 15:48, 14 May 2008 (UTC)
In the German-language counterpart of this article I searched for "Tschech" (as in "Tschechien", German for "Czech Republic") and found nothing. Michael Hardy (talk) 17:22, 14 May 2008 (UTC)
You can read about it in the German article about the Port of Hamburg. MaartenVidal (talk) 22:07, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

Ohlsdorf Cemetery

I've created a very stubby article on the second-largest cemetery in the world: Ohlsdorf Cemetery. It has a link to its counterpart on German Wikipedia, which is a fairly long article. It's a stub and needs more work. Michael Hardy (talk) 20:30, 22 July 2008 (UTC)

lists in this article

maybe somebody can put all these wunderfull lists like theatres and museums in a short sentence? like in the berlin or chicago article. (I shall not do it myself but my english as you can see is horrible) thank you Sebastian scha. (talk) 00:01, 4 August 2008 (UTC)

museums and universities done. now there are theatres, events and this list of persons Sebastian scha. (talk) 17:31, 5 August 2008 (UTC)

University of Applied Science

Folks, the University of Applied Science is not private, but public. It is the successor of the "Fach-Hochschule Hamburg" (Hochschule is not a high school in German, but a University), which is the successor of the "State Engineering School", the "State Nautic School" and others under a common umbrella. It kept its public status. Just called them to verify this. (Office of the President) Changed it. 70.137.149.127 (talk) 09:05, 11 August 2008 (UTC)

Automated peer review September 2008

The following suggestions were generated by a semi-automatic javascript program, and might not be applicable for the article in question.

  • Please expand the lead to conform with guidelines at Wikipedia:Lead. The article should have an appropriate number of paragraphs as is shown on WP:LEAD, and should adequately summarize the article.[?]
Expanded Sebastian scha. (talk) 14:02, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Per Wikipedia:Manual of Style (headings), headings generally should not repeat the title of the article. For example, if the article was Ferdinand Magellan, instead of using the heading ==Magellan's journey==, use ==Journey==.[?] The category is called [People from Hamburg], the book is called People from Hamburg, I think it's okay to let it be. Sebastian scha. (talk) 16:14, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Per WP:WIAFA, this article's table of contents (ToC) may be too long – consider shrinking it down by merging short sections or using a proper system of daughter pages as per Wikipedia:Summary style.[?]
  • There are a few occurrences of weasel words in this article- please observe WP:AWT. Certain phrases should specify exactly who supports, considers, believes, etc., such a view.
    • is considered
    • might be weasel words, and should be provided with proper citations (if they already do, or are not weasel terms, please strike this comment).[?]
  • Please make the spelling of English words consistent with either American or British spelling, depending upon the subject of the article. Examples include: harbour (B) (American: harbor), neighbour (B) (American: neighbor), aluminium (B) (American: aluminum), meter (A) (British: metre), defense (A) (British: defence), organize (A) (British: organise), organise (B) (American: organize), realize (A) (British: realise), isation (B) (American: ization), program (A) (British: programme), programme (B) (American: program ). Done. If found onle Cemetery ,-) Sebastian scha. (talk) 16:11, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Watch for redundancies that make the article too wordy instead of being crisp and concise. (You may wish to try Tony1's redundancy exercises.)
    • Vague terms of size often are unnecessary and redundant - “some”, “a variety/number/majority of”, “several”, “a few”, “many”, “any”, and “all”. For example, “All pigs are pink, so we thought of a number of ways to turn them green.”
  • As done in WP:FOOTNOTE, footnotes usually are located right after a punctuation mark (as recommended by the CMS, but not mandatory), such that there is no space in between. For example, the sun is larger than the moon [2]. is usually written as the sun is larger than the moon.[2][?] All but one in the history section (to be rewritten) Sebastian scha. (talk) 18:26, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Please ensure that the article has gone through a thorough copyediting so that it exemplifies some of Wikipedia's best work. See also User:Tony1/How to satisfy Criterion 1a.[?]

You may wish to browse through User:AndyZ/Suggestions for further ideas. Thanks, Sebastian scha. (talk) 15:32, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

Plural of "Autobahn"

Webster mentions both "Autobahns" and "Autobahnen" as (English) plural forms of "Autobahn" (while of course in German only "Autobahnen" is correct). I think that as long as the same plural is used consistently within the article or at least within a section, we should leave the version the original author has written. --Austrian 19:46, 10 October 2005 (UTC)

Its "Autobahnen" and not "Autobahns". The plural version of a word ist mostly with "en" but very seldom with "s" (taxis, pizzas) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 134.102.123.211 (talk) 22:06, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

Untitled

John Lennon Grew Up In Hamburg,Born in Liverpool,England. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.208.230.242 (talk) 16:09, 6 February 2009 (UTC)

The Barbarossa charta was forged 1265 together with pertaining letters and other documents. They blew because they used the wrong seal. Frank A

Frikandel

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frikandel

It is completely unpopular in Germany. It is known in the Netherlands and has nothing to do with Frikadellen or Germany or Hamburg. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.244.75.238 (talk) 10:17, 29 May 2009 (UTC)

24h bus service?

Who wrote that there is a 24-hour bus service operating every two minutes? What does that refer to? Because actually, during the day there are several metro bus lines with a two minute interval, but between 1 and 4 A.M. on weekdays only night buses operate (with 30 min. or 1 h intervals, respectively). Would be clarifying this if I get no answer within two or three days. -- mattinaetnea (talk) 00:17, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

GAL/Alliance '90/The Greens

I have clarified that the governing Green party in Hamburg is actually the GAL and not simply Alliance '90/The Greens. That makes a difference, although they play the Greens' regional role. And furthermore, I changed the expression into the party's actual name, because there have been claims by other parties to be "green" or even "the Greens". -- Robertrusso3323 (talk) 02:13, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

Since a few years, the Greeans also in hamburg calls their party "Alliance ´90/The Greens". -- Minemanx10 00:13, 30 December 2015 (CET)

language revision

I would like to suggest improving the language. It is sometimes simply wrong (working on that) and very often unsophisticated or "german-y". Any comments, otherwise I would tend to rewrite certain formulations to improve readability. -- 80.171.95.252 (talk) 14:32, 29 December 2009 (UTC) (Sme, my bad -- Robertrusso3323 (talk) 14:34, 29 December 2009 (UTC))

Freie Stadt or not?

The Groß-Hamburg-Gesetz article [3] says the city lost its Freie Reichstadt designation under this 1937 statute, but this article says it still (or again) has it. Did the city get this name back after WWII or what?--Fitzaubrey 02:59, 2 July 2006 (UTC)

I guess this is refered to their trade system (duty free zone etc.). Also this "Freie" City refers to the time when the french occuiped Hamburg. After the town was freed again it should mean that it belongs to nobody.. and today you can see that as a tradition, or if you want a stylistic device and refers more to their special role in oversea trade (duty free etc.).

--Modgamers 06:29, 2 July 2006 (UTC)

Firstly, it has to be clear that this is only a name and it indeed comes from tradition. During the middle ages and later in the Holy Roman Empire, cities could become (by various ways) independent from their former rulers and would then only be subject of the emperor. These cities got the title of a Free City or an Imperial City.[1] Anyway, of these cities only Bremen and Hamburg managed to stay independent and proudly retain the title in their names. It has nothing to do with the duty free zone or the french occupation. --Jonathan Jacobsohn (talk) 23:40, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

It's Freie und Hansestadt Hamburg source: Constitution of the Free and Hanseatic City of Hamburg (German: Verfassung der Freien und Hansestadt Hamburg) (1956) (in German). But it is correct the Greater Hamburg Act (1937) didn't mentioned the free part. Greetings. Sebastian scha. (talk) 16:54, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
It's not only a name. The status of this city is still somehow special. For example its citizens usually refuse decorations from foreign rulers, which includes the head of the Federal Republic of Germany. Even Helmut Schmidt, former major of Hamburg and later chancellor of Germany, did so whenever Germany offered him a decoration. His refusals were accepted without any noise. --85.179.247.136 (talk) 12:16, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

References

  1. ^ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Imperial_City

History of Hamburg during the war

I have just inserted a basic information about Operation_Gomorrha and also created a separate article. Does anyone have pictures from the areas that were wiped off by the Firestorm, like Hammerbrook or Billbrook? I am curious what they look like today. PeterBln (talk) 13:20, 31 August 2010 (UTC)

Section: language (deleted sentences)

I deleted:

In addition, immigration brought dialects from all over the German-speaking world used to Hamburg, also a large number of foreign language communities. Hamburg has a sizeable population of Sinti and Roma (“Gypsy”) people, some of them sedentary (mostly Sinti) and some of them nomadic or semi-nomadic (mostly Roma), camp grounds being set aside by the state and municipal governments. Hamburg is thus one of the few locations in the world in which both Sinti and Romany are spoken, and it is also one of the major headquarters of international Roma organizations.

{Fact} tagged since September 2008, a question at the Roma and Sinti wikiproject brought no reference, IMHO there is no need to single out this community. Sebastian scha. (talk) 16:34, 13 September 2009 (UTC)

Why? If someone can confirm that the sentences are based on facts, I don`t see any reason why they should be deleted - it`s interesting enough! --Sushi Leone (talk) 15:00, 7 November 2009 (UTC)

I think these are very important demographic facts. Why did you delete these facts? PeterBln (talk) 13:22, 31 August 2010 (UTC)

Infobox image

I have reverted a recent edit that had changed the single panoramic photograph in the infobox to one of those new-fangled "collage" things. My thoughts on the matter (sorry for the rant) are at Talk:Paris, a parallel case. Fut.Perf. ☼ 19:10, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

Regarding the Port of Hamburg

1.) This article is far superior to the articles on Bremen and Bremerhaven, in content, organization, and citations. Congratulations to the authors!

2.) However, like the articles on Bremen and Bremerhaven, the role the ports played as the stepping-off point for the tidal wave of many millions of German emigrants (the largest relocation seen in the world) to new homes in America, Australia, Canada, South Africa, South America, and other places is glossed over. For example, far more Germans migrated to America than any other European group, many of whom left from Hamburg. More history of the port would enhance the article, in my opinion.

3.) There's an inconsistency noted in port statistics. Numbers mentioned in the lede contradict numbers mentioned in the "Port" section, which at least has a citation:

  • Lede:

"The port of Hamburg is the third-largest port in Europe (third to Port of Antwerp and Rotterdam), and the eighth largest in the world."

  • Port:

"The most significant economic unit for Hamburg is the Port of Hamburg, which ranks 2nd only to Rotterdam in Europe and 9th worldwide with transshipments of 9.8 million Twenty-foot equivalent units (TEU) of cargo and 134 million tons of goods in 2007.[83]"
83. Van Marle, Gavin (2008-01-31). "Europe Terminals stretched to limit". Lloyds List Daily Commercial News: pp. 8–9.

Cheers, Wordreader (talk) 14:54, 30 March 2011 (UTC)

History / the name "Treva"

Someone saw fit to claim, at the beginning of the history section, that "The first historical name of the modern city is, according to Claudius Ptolemy's reports, Treva."

The truth is that medieval reconstructions of Ptolemy's maps (the originals are lost) show a location called "Treva" roughly around the place where Hamburg is situated today. These maps are not very precise, but German scientists claim to have "decoded" them, and some people apparently think that Treva might have been the precursor to the city of Hamburg. (The work is mentioned in Geographia_(Ptolemy).) This is disputed, foremost on the grounds that there is no archeological evidence that there was a significant settlement at the confluence of the Alster and Elbe rivers in Ptolemy's time (see [4]). It's for a good reason that the article History of Hamburg starts with: "The history the Hamburg begins with its foundation in the 9th century ..." Ptolemy died in the 2nd century.

So this passage is very questionable and should at least be modified, but I'm for removing it from the main "Hamburg" article altogether, as it's an arcane, disputed part of ongoing research that can, if at all, be dealt with in the "History of Hamburg" article where the same claim has already been inserted as well (without doubt by the same person).

That the term "Treva" was inserted in the list of names at the start of the main "Hamburg" article as a supposed "rom." name of Hamburg is complete nonsense, I'll remove it. --SKopp (talk) 23:10, 19 June 2011 (UTC)

DUPLICATION, as usual

This is one ot the things I hate with Wikipedia: messy duplication/confusion.

There is already a History of Hamburg page, yet, this Hamburg page here, has a history section nearly half as long, which at times is at variance with the other page (called "main" page). One who wants to read about the history of Hamburg is not too sure where to go. Same thing if he/she wants to edit. This situation, of course, is widespread inside Wikipedia.

This page here is about present-day Hamburg and the whole lenghty section on the history of the city should be deleted. --Lubiesque (talk) 12:40, 15 April 2012 (UTC)

Saint Jacobi - Saint James

I replaced the Name "Saint James' Church" in the part on architecture with "Saint Jacobi Church". While it might correct to call the apostle "James" in the english language, this is the original name of the church. Its own wikipedia article is also called St. Jacobi, Hamburg. You should try to ask even english speaking people in Hamburg for the way to "Saint James' Church"... --Phileasson (talk) 22:20, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

Simple answer - I would use the terms given by the Wikilink. Editing just about now. Period. -- Robertrusso3323 (talk) 17:29, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

you look funny :) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.51.132.115 (talk) 19:17, 15 April 2012 (UTC)

HafenCity

The project HafenCity is very important for the port of Hamburg. That is why I added a short passage about it. --Jummy20 (talk) 15:52, 9 June 2012 (UTC)

"Hamburgers"

"An international trade city, Hamburg is the commercial and cultural centre of Northern Germany. Its citizens are known as Hamburgers."

---> Uhm, sorry. but we are not known as "Hamburgers". Someone living in Hamburg is a Hamburger without the "s". But you cant eat us. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.177.204.244 (talk) 09:08, 28 January 2008 (UTC)

In German, one may write "Viele Hamburger sind..." and the form of the adjective and that of the verb make it clear that it's plural whereas the noun is still "Hamburger"; certainly NOT "Hamburgers". But this article is written in English. In German the plural of "Songwriter", a borrowed English word, is "Songwritern" with a final "n". If Germans can do that to an English word, how is the present case different? (Well, OK, they don't sell "Songwritern" at MacDonald's....) Michael Hardy (talk) 02:39, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
Correction "Songwritern" is dative singular; it's not the plural. Michael Hardy (talk) 04:18, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
Correction No, it's not. It's dative plural. You don't really have a clue, do you? Btw, are you really sure of that plural form for Hamburger? 82.82.71.127 (talk) 03:33, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

I would like to add, as a real Hamburger from Hamburg/Germany, that we're called Hamburger, in singular and in plural, and definetly not Hamburgers! It's like with J.F.K. and "Ich bin ein Berliner" and not "Ich bin ein Berliners" (the plural is also Berliner) - remember: German is a different language, a plural "s" is not used very often. (f.e: bottle means flasche in german, the plural is flaschen and not flasches)

Ah, yes, English German and German English translations: like public viewing all over Germany in 2006? A person from Hamburg is just that a 'person/inhabitant from Hamburg' (maybe a Hamburgian like Bostonian). Show me a reference for 'Hamburgers' or 'Hamburger' and I'll be happy. All other is original research. (And no, wiktionary is no source.) Sebastian scha. (talk) 22:03, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

Okay, I am a german, bremen in particular, and it means "Hamburger" and definitly not "Hamburgers". Its the same like "Bremer","Berliner", "Dortmunder", "Münsteraner" etc.. This should be evidence enough. Just for your information, in germany its very popular to use english words without kowing their translation, or they use it wrong like "handy"-> "cellphone" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 134.102.123.211 (talk) 22:04, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

I don't want to go WP:OR here, but I would think that "Hamburghers" would be more appropriate in English for people from the city. English readers could have no doubt that it was the people we were talking about and not an entree. Student7 (talk) 16:02, 5 July 2012 (UTC)

main picture captions not in English

Expressions like "view of night" and "second of left" aren't English. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.189.103.145 (talk) 07:40, 15 August 2012 (UTC)

The numbers in the "religion" section are wrong

The numbers in the "religion" section, purporting to say what percent of the populace belongs to each of several religions, add up to more than 100%. If this were about a city in China I might just think maybe it's one of those situations where some people belong to more than one religion, but that sort of thing doesn't apply to Christianity or Islam, so there's a problem here. Michael Hardy (talk) 21:50, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

I've changed it so that it now says 41% are Christians, including 10% who are Catholics. That's what German Wikipedia says. Michael Hardy (talk) 04:38, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

I think things are more complicated: 31.7 % of the population belong to the lutheran "Landeskirche", 10.2 % to the roman catholic church. Source [5]. All other figure may be estimations only. There ist no official statistics of religious affiliation in german census. So the rest on 38.1 % includes mainly mulims, members of smaller christian churches and those without any affiliation, but also buddhistm sikhs, hindus, jews and others. --Catrin (talk) 21:34, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

Either you must have meant 58.1% rather than 38.1% or else I've misunderstood something. Michael Hardy (talk) 00:16, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

You are right. Should by 58.1. --Catrin (talk) 17:05, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

31.7% are only the members of the EKD Evangelical Church in Germany. It is a large group of the Lutheran, Reformed and United Protestant churches, but even not all Protestant churches. Not a member are the Evangelical Methodist Church, the Independent Evangelical-Lutheran Church (SELK), Baptists organized in the Union of Evangelical Free Church Congregations in Germany, Pentecostals organized in the Bund Freikirchlicher Pfingstgemeinden (Union of Pentecostal Free-Churches), Seventh-day Adventist Church and the New Apostolic Church. Both the Bund evangelisch-freikirchlicher Gemeinden and the Pfingstgemeinden have a relatively large parish in Hamburg (but this is WP:OR ;-) Nevertheless 41% are Christians is still wrong. I will try to change in a few days. Maybe into the original figures: 31.7 % of the population belong to the lutheran North Elbian Evangelical Church, 10.2 % to the Roman Catholic Church and delete all other data. Greetings Sebastian scha. (talk) 21:22, 12 August 2008 (UTC)


WHAT ABOUT JEHOVAH WITTNESSES??? LOOK THEM UP HERE IN WIKIPEDIA!!!! they are good people —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.208.230.242 (talk) 16:14, 6 February 2009 (UTC)

WHAT ABOUT JEDI??? LOOK THEM UP HERE IN WIKIPEDIA!!!! they are good people — Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.71.245.129 (talk) 20:12, 31 August 2012 (UTC)

The muslim community is definitely much bigger than only 70.00 people. I mean data about ethnicity and religion is allways a problem in germany, but there are an estimated 80.000-110.000 people of turkish descent, around 25.000 people of iranian descent and around 22.000 of afghan descent living in hamburg. the city is also THE centre of the huge (kosovo)albanian community in germany( couldn find any estimates to their number in hamburg, but there are at least 15.000 probably way more!) and has sizeable arab, pakistani and bosnian communities! i have no idea who came up with the number of 70.00 but its a crass example of underestimation concerning minorities in germany! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.113.106.185 (talk) 13:34, 3 February 2010 (UTC)

This entire section is based on the concept that most members of a community belong to some form of organized religion, which are to be broken down into different denominations in the "religion" section of a city. However, just like in most (or all?) German cities, the group of non-religious (atheist/agnostic/...) is the second largest subgroup after Christians (protestant/catholic/...) - Therefore, this group should be mentioned in the very beginning of the section, right after the Christians. Only including them at the end of the "others" list is a clear misrepresentation. Atheism is just as much a "religious belief" as Christianity. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 93.242.62.4 (talk) 15:22, 26 May 2011 (UTC)

German pronunciation

It says [ˈhambʊʁk] - shouldn't this be [ˈhambʊɐk]? Lfh (talk) 10:43, 29 August 2009 (UTC)


Absolutely, Standard German is non-rhotic. I did edit that a few months ago, but it got quickly reverted. Uh oh! 46.37.39.20 (talk) 00:57, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

Largest Non-Capital City

The claim that Hamburg is the largest city that's not a capital is based on another wikipedia page that's highly contentious, as there's no clear definition of what a city is. So in this case, for example, the whole population of the Hamburg bundesland (so all of Harburg, the Vierlande, Bergedorf etc that wouldn't normally be considered part of the true Hamburg) is included in that list as a "city", but the population of Greater Manchester is not. Cavort 14:15, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Being from Harburg - yep, we'd like, no, love to tear down the bridges and get back to Lower Saxony. By the way, by now we'd take most of the harbour with us. While it is true that definitions in some countries differ significantly (Barcelona would be another candidate), there is absolutely no need to discount Harburg or Bergedorf - why didn't you mention Altona and Wandsbek by the way? They are part of Hamburg city proper, not only the "Bundesland". All those cities ceased to be entities of their own in 1937 and are nothing but boroughs of Hamburg, which (like Berlin but unlike Bremen) is the same whether city or Bundesland.
Of course, if you'd talk about the historical Hamburg, you should not count anything outside the Wallanlagen. Maybe include Rothenburgsort, St.Georg and St.Pauli, (and Moorburg in Harburg) which were founded "by Hamburg". All other parts used to be different cities. So no, this is no valid objection, though of course the statistic is debatable. -- Ulkomaalainen 22:46, 16 June 2007 (UTC)
This is exactly my point. I'm sorry for picking on Harburg. The definition of Hamburg as "largest city" is based on the definition of Hamburg that includes all its constituent boroughs such as Harburg, etc (the etc is for Wandsbek and so on). However the definition of Manchester used, by comparison is only for the borough "City of Manchester" - which is only a name, in the same way as the "City of London" - and leaves out all the other boroughs of metropolitan Greater Manchester. Cavort 11:39, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
In case of Hamburg, the population of the suburban areas are not counted, because they are not part of the city of Hamburg. If so, the population in the list mentioned would even be higher. In example, Norderstedt belongs to Schleswig-Holstein, although it could easily be a part of "Greater Hamburg", which doesn't exist as in case of Greater Manchester. Maybe Hamburg Metropolitan Region is compareable to Greater Manchester? Bergedorf, Mitte and Altona are boroughs that grew together and shaped Hamburg. In fact, a comparison between cities of different countries is usually difficult. But within Germany Hamburg may be the only city besides Berlin that feels like a cosmopolitan city of international importance and size. 85.178.20.190 07:33, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
"But within Germany Hamburg may be the only city besides Berlin that feels like a cosmopolitan city of international importance and size." --> No, Frankfurt does too, even if it's smaller. But it's a very important city in fact to be one of the financial centres of europe. 87.245.35.106 (talk) 13:50, 8 August 2010 (UTC)
what about Cologne or Munich?78.43.149.67 (talk) 09:03, 6 February 2014 (UTC)
Shitholes, provincial shitholes... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.70.147.217 (talk) 07:18, 3 January 2015 (UTC)

Timeline of Hamburg

What is missing from the recently created city timeline article? Please add relevant content. Contributions welcome. Thank you. -- M2545 (talk) 14:02, 19 May 2015 (UTC)

8th not 9th largest city in the EU

It is written, in the beginning, that Hamburg is the ninth largest city in the European Union, but according to both the link in the reference (number 5) and the link of the article in Wikipedia about the largest cities in the EU, Hamburg is the eighth largest city in the EU, not ninth. Xorman (talk) 16:17, 24 June 2015 (UTC)

Why is it Free AND Hanseatic?

Why not just "Free Hanseatic"? Sincerely, a concnered citizen. 24.240.74.8 (talk) 23:42, 10 February 2016 (UTC)

"Free" stands for "self-administered", which in medieval times meant they were not "owned" by a bishop and did not have to pay taxes to the emperor. "Hanse" means "member of the Hanseatic League". Those are two totally different things. Cheers, Grueslayer Let's talk. 06:58, 11 February 2016 (UTC)
Well, I don't think that answers the question asked. As far as I know, "Free and Hanseatic" is simply to stress those two qualifiers as distinct from each other, while for the Free Hanseatic City of Bremen they are (at least linguistically) sort of more intertwined. Still, historically and constitutionally, Bremen and Hamburg share a lot of the same history. --94.220.159.192 (talk) 20:26, 13 February 2017 (UTC)

Property Seizures?

It's recently been reported that the Hamburg council has initiated a program of seizing residential property to house migrants. The council started seizing commercial property in 2015, but has now extended the right to seize any residential property that has been vacant for 4 months. Given Germany's history of property confiscation this strikes me as highly disturbing and worth noting. Since it seems Hamburg specific I figure this would be the correct article to mention it it. Others concur? 人族 (talk) 11:30, 16 May 2017 (UTC)

It's not a Hamburg thing. Municipalities in Germany are obligated to house refugees, and so is the municipality of Hamburg. Since municipalities utilize all other possibilities of providing housing space first, seizing property is ultima ratio and happens in a few cases only - nationwide. A background report (in German): [6]. Kind regards, Grueslayer 05:01, 17 May 2017 (UTC)
Thanks for the link. I ran it through Google Translate so my understanding is probably a tad limited. I've not heard that German municipalities have any responsibility for housing asylum seekers. What I have read is that when Berlin attempted to pass similar legislation it was rejected on the grounds of being unconstitutional. While it is recognised that more rental accommodation is desperately needed in Hamburg, local government has imposed rental caps making it impossible to recover construction costs so the seizure option has been pursued instead. Will sit on this and see if there are developments. 人族 (talk) 13:59, 17 May 2017 (UTC)
The responsibility for housing asylum seekers is regulated in § 45 AsylG (law text) and is based on the "Königsberger Schlüssel" (de:WP) which basically determines a federal state's share by financial power. Rental caps are a federal decision executed on federal state level, so they exist everywhere (de:WP). The success of this 2015 law is... Look, a distraction! ;-) Kind regards, Grueslayer 16:32, 17 May 2017 (UTC)


Ancestry vs Foreigner numbers.

Which numbers for ancestry should be used , the migration background or the foreigner number? German kids born to turkish parents ie have a migration background but are Germans. Thus the would be counted to " German" in the chart. Also the asian etc numbers are only available for foreigners not for people with migration background. Also seeing theres already the table to the side is it even necessary to have the additional chart as well?Morri (talk) 11:04, 25 July 2017 (UTC)

What i could do is one chart for foreigners in Hamburg[1] and one chart for people of migratory background. [2]Morri (talk) 11:43, 25 July 2017 (UTC)

I strongly suggest to use single-foreign passport numbers. Most cities in Germany use this number. To compare only apples with apples and make numbers comparable, I will change the numbers to single-foreign passport holders. User:Peter.fritz.de (talk) 11:04, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

References

  1. ^ https://www.statistik-nord.de/fileadmin/Dokumente/Jahrb%C3%BCcher/Hamburg/JB16HH_Gesamt_Internet_min.pdf
  2. ^ https://www.statistik-nord.de/fileadmin/Dokumente/Statistik_informiert_SPEZIAL/SI_SPEZIAL_V_2017_Korrektur.pdf

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Proposing split

I think that there is more than enough significant coverage from independent reliable sources on the Economy of Hamburg. In fact, I bet there is an abundance of content by scholars who have never been within 300 miles of Hamburg. So I think there ought to be a split. — Mr. Guye (talk) (contribs)  22:27, 19 November 2017 (UTC)

I'm not sure how to use this site...

I'm a first time user... I tried to delete the... weird... last sentence on the "Religion" part but had some problem... I think it's a rather unfortunate word choosing... can someone please edit it? Or even just delete it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Slonim (talk • contribs) 01:29, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

What about Jehovah Wittness?? They are good people Dont they have their Percentage?? Trolling is not a legitimate use of talk pages. (Struck by  — Mr. Guye (talk) (contribs)  on 22:45, 19 November 2017 (UTC) )

What about Jedi?? They are good people Dont they have their Percentage??

The numbers in the Demographics section are wrong

Or more likely, the genders are reversed. The first line says there are more males than females and the second line says the opposite. The citation is broken so I can't confirm which is it. The main page for Hamburg Demographics cites the same numbers and says there are more males but the citation is broken there too. I'm not an expert on demographics or Hamburg so I don't want to edit the page. kanoa (talk) 22:50, 1 September 2017 (UTC)

@KanoaWithington: I think it is the females > males. See [7].  — Mr. Guye (talk) (contribs)  23:27, 19 November 2017 (UTC)

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Music

"Wir sind Helden" are from Berlin, Annett Louisan has nothing to do with Hip Hop and I think Ian O'Brian is not even from Germany so cut them off please. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.185.54.2 (talk) 14:28, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

east or west

Was Hamburg part of east or west germany?--Gbleem 14:09, 22 November 2005 (UTC)

West. Ianb 21:02, 22 November 2005 (UTC)
neither nor. ... and what a question !! It was and is north Germany (LOL) 19:30, 16 September 2011 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 31.18.145.214 (talk)
I guess Gbleem means if Hamburg was part of the German Democratic Republic or not. And it was not!178.210.114.106 (talk) 13:44, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
is this WP or elementary school?2A01:598:9908:A1B6:4965:3C17:A437:B0AF (talk) 02:19, 12 July 2020 (UTC)

Classification of the president of the hamburg parliament

In "normal" german states, the president of the parliament is the president of the parliament and nothing else. But in hamburg, the president of the "Bürgerschaft" is also the formal first person in the state (before the first mayor). This is historically grown because of the wish of the hamburg citizens of a balance of power. (-> after the [German revolutions of 1848–49], the senat started to form a constitution (cf: hamburg constitution of 1859) - with more rights for the parliament and the poorer citizens (BETTER not the same as the elite had)).

Unfortunately because of the standardised infobox of german states I´m unable to add this fact and don´t know how to deal with this problem. -- (Minemanx10) 00:50, 30 December 2015 (CET)

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