Talk:Fluoride volatility

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Missing Elements.[edit]

Palladium (II) Fluoride has an MP of 952 C. Pd also forms a trifluoride. Marhault (talk) 10:36, 4 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks! Do you have references and stability information? --JWB (talk) 17:30, 4 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I think I got that number from Greenwood's Chemistry of the Elements. PdF2 decomposes before boiling. PdF3 decomposes before melting. Source is CRC. Europium makes a (II) and a (III) fluoride, also. EuF2 MP 1380, BP over 2400. EuF3 MP 1390 BP 2280. Cerium (IV) Fluoride is only stable in crystalline form with a water of hydration. In anhydrous or fluid form CeF3 is the stable species. MP 1460, BP 2300. TbF3 has MP 1172 and BP 2280. Marhault (talk) 00:58, 14 August 2009 (UTC) Thanks, I've updated based on this info --JWB (talk) 01:55, 14 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Removed some of the "top fluorides missing" section. XeF6 isn't going to form in the conditions found in a fluoride volatility refinery anyway. TcF7 is an exotic species, TcF6 is the stable one. Ag won't form a tetrafluoride, AgF2 will be the highest to be seen in these circumstances. Ce and Eu are addressed by your edits. Marhault (talk) 10:56, 15 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I did notice that your excellent Fission Yield chart had high Pd yield and low Sr yield, consistent with Pu-239, not U-235 fission. This did not match your yields in the BP/MP chart. Nevertheless, I should be able to scrounge up some fission yield numbers for both elements for the BP/MP chart, if you think it would be worthwhile to expand the chart to include both numbers. U-233 yields might be more of a challenge. Marhault (talk) 11:04, 15 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks! The IAEA page I reference in Template:Chain yield is a source for fission product yields for various nuclides and neutron energies. The Fluoride Volatility article is one of my earlier efforts. Also, in File:ThermalFissionYield.svg I give yields for those three nuclides plus 65% U-235 + 35% Pu-239, based on the Knolls chart.

If you do feel like inputting more yield numbers for this article, that would be great; alternatively we could include templates with yield figures. Since there are multiple isotopes per element I'm not sure what format would be best. --JWB (talk) 17:27, 15 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Volatilization without fluorination[edit]

Something is wrong with coloured graph: "red elements (...) themselves are volatile at very high temperatures" All elements are volatile at very high temperatures. Silver and palladium have boiling points above 2000 Celcius degree, caesium and rubidium have boiling points below 700 Celcius degree. I can't see any common property - why these four are marked red? And what happened with promethium-147? It has half-life 2.6 years and yield of about 2%. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.246.67.228 (talk) 12:50, 19 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The article is ridiculous, started by a do-gooder who did not know much chemistry. Anything that you can do to repair the article would be a good thing. Unfortunately in Wikipedia, it is easy to start silly articles (check out toxic metal). Fortunately, some silly articles eventually turn into useful ones. So by all means address the points that you raise and be bold.--Smokefoot (talk) 14:18, 19 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

See the study cited in Nuclear reprocessing#Volatilization in isolation where they achieved volatilization of these elements between 700°C and 1000°C in a vacuum.

Achieved volatilization of caesium and rubidium (boiling point below 700 Celcius degrees). Linked document says that silver and pallaidum (and also caesium and rubidium and some other elements) could be absorbed by zeolite filter from solution.-— Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.246.67.228 (talk) 10:47, 20 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Sections 4.1 says: From the oxygen stream it is expected that the following oxides will be present: Iodine oxide, rubidium oxide, and silver oxide. From the argon stream it is expected that the following additional oxides will be present: low amounts of oxygen (liberated from decomposing U3O8 and other oxides), tellurium, and molybdenum. What document are you looking at? The word "solution" appears only 4 times in this document and not in this context. --JWB (talk) 16:08, 20 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
OK. These 4 elements simply have oxides, that are volatile at low partial pressures. Description should probably be changed.-— Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.246.67.228 (talk) 12:02, 26 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

PmF3 is listed at the bottom of the table as one of the fluorides no data has been found for. If you can find a source for its boiling and melting points, please add it or discuss it here. --JWB (talk) 18:43, 19 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I meaned that there is no promethium on the coloured graph. It shoud be there with "afert 1 year" bar as half-life of Pm-147 is 2.6 years.-— Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.246.67.228 (talk) 10:47, 20 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

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Inappropriate Title[edit]

This is an interesting article, but is not nearly as general as the title suggests. This article is all about reprocessing of fission products in spent nuclear fuel from reactors, using Flourides. The only diagram lists elements by their Fission Yield as a function of element, covering only the significant elements found in fission products. The words Hydrogen, Sodium, Oxygen, Iron, and Copper don't appear, which would be strange in an article about general 'flourides'.

See, for instance, Fluorine_compounds which does talk about flourides generally.

This article needs a new title. Maybe "Fluoride Volatility in Fission Product Reprocessing". OsamaBinLogin (talk) 23:00, 12 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

This article is pretty awful, agreed. People just write articles on topics that they dream up vs building an article upon a foundation of core literature. Consequently Wikipedia gets stuck with a lot of such crap. And these articles are filled with big words and technical jargon, so naive readers conclude that these articles are legit. It takes a lot of time and knowledge to overcome the mediocrity. etc. --Smokefoot (talk) 12:54, 13 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
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