Talk:Dragon's Lair (1983 video game)/Archive 1

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Released on Steam!

The game was Greenlit on steam. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.168.58.99 (talk) 23:55, 18 May 2013 (UTC)

Broke from Overuse?

I question the validity of this statement. Highly successful games like Street Fighter II required much more control motion per play and were not out of order nearly as often as Dragon's Lair. If I recall correctly, Sega displayed laserdisc games at trade shows prior to Dragon's Lair, but did not release first because of issues with the reliability of early laserdisc units.

The issue is that "overuse" put too much of a strain on the laserdisc player. Street Fighter II didn't have a laserdisc player, so the comparison is meaningless. And it doesn't matter if SEGA or anyone else displayed laserdisc game prototypes at trade shows; the fact is, Dragon's Lair was the the first laserdisc game to market. Druff 04:24, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

Stub?

I see that the article still has the stub message. I don't tknow, I don't think it is all that stubbish anymore. Perhaps some screenshots would help it? —Frecklefoot 16:35, Apr 10, 2004 (UTC)

2 x Dragon's Lair II

Why are there two Dragon's Lair II? --Abdull 20:45, 4 September 2005 (UTC)

I'm not sure, but I couldn't find info on Dragon's Lair II: Escape from Singe's castle, so I removed it. It might have been a working title for the game or an alternative name. — Frecklefoot | Talk 18:16, September 6, 2005 (UTC)

Actually Dragon's Lair II: Escape from Singe's Castle did exist. I don't recall all the platforms it was released for but I do know that it once existed for the PC. In came on several 3.5" floppy disks and contained animation from the original arcade game that wasn't included on the original PC release of Dragon's Lair. Graphics cards, memory, and storage compacities of PCs were not up to snuff at the time so they created Escape as a sequel in order to include more footage. I also believe that their was some original footage created for that game that didn't exist in the arcade version. I think Digital Leisure was the company that released Escape and I do remember the cover of the box featured an image similar to the one in this article where Dirk is taking on the spectre with the sicle amongst the thorns. I have no proof to provide anyone other than I remember owning and playing the game as a teen. -- Deadeye, December 2005

Dragon's Lair v. Dragonslayer

While I agree that the name "Dragon's Lair" is not a parody of the movie titled "Dragonslayer", the font Don Bluth chose as the logotype for "Dragon's Lair" bears an uncanny similarity to the font for the logotype of the movie, "Dragonslayer". As evidence I submit this image from a movie poster for "Dragonslayer"

http://www.impawards.com/1981/dragonslayer_ver2.html

Compare that to this picture of the marquee from a "Dragon's Lair" cabinet:

http://www.dragons-lair-project.com/tech/virtual/images/dl/marquee.jpg

The resemblance is too close to attribute to coincidence; the logotype for "Dragon's Lair" was clearly derived from "Dragonslayer". Edgewise 02:13, 26 September 2005 (UTC)

It's not "too close to attribute to coincidence." Both fonts bear resemblence to mideval font types. And since they are both set during the mideval period, it's not really a coincidence that they look similar. I'm not saying that it's impossible that Bluth was "inspired" by the font used for Dragonslayer, I'm saying it's possible he and his studio developed it independantly.
Despite that, Wikipedia policy is striclty against original research. So unless you can find a site that definatively states that DL's font was based on the one used in Dragonslayer (such as from Don Bluth's own personal website), it should be left out. Until then, it's just an opinion. — Frecklefoot | Talk 14:18, 26 September 2005 (UTC)

Medieval font types? What does this mean? Neither logotype resembles anything used in medieval times. Please supply an original cite for this; otherwise, it is just an opinion. Edgewise 12:02, 27 September 2005 (UTC)

Oops! I think you're right--the font used is not a traditional medieval type. However, this doesn't mean that Bluth & Co. used Dragonslayer as their inspiration. You need to cite the fact that they did if you want to include it in the article. It is very possible that they both developed a similar logo independantly. — Frecklefoot | Talk 14:20, 28 September 2005 (UTC)

Wow, the first person is correct. The two logos/fonts are 99% identical! See: http://www.digitpress.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1755725&postcount=22 Should we mention this in the article? 76.124.10.172 (talk) 02:00, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

Once again, it is very possible and probable that Bluth used the Dragonslayer logo as an inspiration for the Dragon's Lair logo. But unless it can be cited from a verifiable source, it is original research. The link you provide, though very convincing, is from a forum post, which is not considered reliable. Sorry, I don't make the rules. — Frεcklεfσσt | Talk 11:55, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

Perspective

Perhaps more of a balance might be struck between eulogising the importance of videogame FMV, and pointing out how horribly the game sucked.

Making games by stitching together FMV was a brief phase that a small section of the industry went through, and everyone was glad when the novelty wore off and they gave up on it. --Klassobanieras 05:55, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

I agree, the industry has a tendency to latch on to faddish game mechanisms and exploit them long after the public realizes they suck, much like they did with kick/punch fighting games and first person shooters.Edgewise 15:20, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

Misquote?

"Dragon's Lair is this summer's hottest new toy: the first arcade game in the United States with a movie-quality image to go along with the action... The game has been devouring kids' coins at top speed since it appeared early in July," said Robert Romano, 10, who waited all day in the crush at Castle Park without getting to play, "It's the most awesome game I've ever seen in my life."

Unless this 10-year old was speaking of the game "devouring kids' coins at top speed," I'm somehow thinking these were meant to be two sentences, with the second one beginning at "said." :) J21 15:53, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

This part bothers me...

"In the episode "My Peeps" from The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy, Billy plays "Grim Manor" where a dragon scurries a princess away." in Cultural References. Not nessicarily a Dragon's Lair parody, it could also be seen as spoofing Dragon Warrior, Hydylide, or any other game that features a princess-capturing dragon. It's sort of a cliche segment.

What about the Cheat (Commandos)

On one of the Everything Else DVDs from Homestarrunner.com, there is a DVD game much like Dragon's Lair but with (somewhat irronicly) the evil blu-laser.

Robot Chicken

A parody of Dragon's Lair appears in the Robot Chicken episode "Celebrity Rocket" (2006). It is described in the show info as "Dirk the Daring fights middle age."

There was also a Sega CD version of the game.

PlayStation 1 port?

I'm absolutely sure that I've played this on PSOne. Could anypne provide info about this port? 213.208.171.146 (talk) 08:32, 29 December 2007 (UTC)


Fair use rationale for Image:Dl.JPG

Image:Dl.JPG is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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BetacommandBot 03:32, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Gameplay screenshot

Definitely needs a screenshot for the gameplay. - A Link to the Past (talk) 20:59, 29 November 2008 (UTC)

In Canada

I found this material in the article in the Overview section. It is unencyclopedic and unreferenced and POV. I have no idea how it got in the article:

In Canada Dragon's Lair was the first game we put out on $1 play, then when the ROM change was issued we were able to add 50 cents to continue, this was all on quarters, 5 years before our loony ($1 coin). We had so many coin jam problems due to the small coinbox that we removed the boxes, lowered and tilted the shelf which held it then put a 6" board across the back of said shelf so as to contain the quarters. This game made $1200+ a week for the first 2 to 3 months, mind you our first game (we bought 5 total) was a first production model and cost $9500 Canadian.

I don't see how it could ever be fixed up to be re-inserted. It is a personal anecdote. If it were said in a book or a magazine article, it'd be fine (and then it'd need to be quoted and referenced). But as it is, we can't use it. — Frecklefσσt | Talk 20:11, 5 February 2009 (UTC)

Who portrayed the voice of Princess Daphne?

On Dragon's Lair wikipedia page, it says Princess Daphne was portrayed by Lucille Bliss. But I've always heard it was Vera Lanpher-Pacheco. (See IMDB.) Will the real Princess Daphne please stand up? --Rrand (talk) 22:54, 15 February 2010 (UTC)

Per the Don Bluth official website, Vera Lanpher voiced Daphne in the arcade game. Lucille Bliss was her voice in the spinoff TV show.--Edgewise (talk) 03:19, 16 February 2010 (UTC)
Hello, I believe you are right so I added the information and am looking for a Lucille Bliss citation. I updated Dragon's Lair and Lucille Bliss articles. But I have no citation showing that Lucille Bliss did the voiceover for Daphne on the television series. Do you know where I can find a citation for that? I'll keep looking myself, but I'm surprised she's not in the IMDB for that. Thanks. In any event, things are better than they were. --Rrand (talk) 02:21, 17 February 2010 (UTC)
Hmm, now I'm a little worried. ThisIMDB page says that Princess Daphne was played by Ellen Gerstell in the cartoon. --Rrand (talk) 02:30, 17 February 2010 (UTC)

Reception

Um, is it just me, or does the 1st Reception section seem a little unbalanced? It just talks about Princess Daphne and how hot she is, not about the game as a whole. I remember when the game was released, it was greeted with unabashed enthusiasm and excitement. The only thing that really comes close to covering this is the quote in the Overview section. Does anyone have any references for its REAL reception at the time? — Frεcklεfσσt | Talk 14:09, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

Yes, I agree it needs more general reception info on the game in that section. I don't feel, given the references already provided, that removing material on a specific character's reception is warranted however. See Lara Croft for precedent on that kind of material. I'll see about digging up some more reviews and references from some of the news services and periodical archives I have access to. --Marty Goldberg (talk) 02:49, 2 August 2010 (UTC)

Ok, did a major overhaul of the section. Added in much more on the reception of the game itself, a statement regarding Dirk's reception as a character, and reworked the section on Daphne which is now tied together with a statement by Bluth and the view by some critics of the game being sexist and violence. Also removed the statement by the Dragon's Lair champion, as it was trivial at best and did nothing to enhance Daphne's reception in the context of the sexist critique. --Marty Goldberg (talk) 04:02, 2 August 2010 (UTC)

Wow, that is much better! Thanks for the edit. I went through and formatted a few of the refs, but the text you wrote remains largely unchanged. I don't really care for it's placement as a sub-subject of "Legacy", but that's not a big deal right now. — Frεcklεfσσt | Talk 12:23, 2 August 2010 (UTC)
Thanks. Moved the section to its own per your suggestion. Also did a little combining of some other sections. --Marty Goldberg (talk) 20:45, 2 August 2010 (UTC)

ZX Spectrum Error

This game was only ever released on cassette unless otherwise proved. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.232.185.102 (talk) 00:25, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

It was also available on Opus disk, as proven by the instructions: [1]. This info should be re-added. 81.132.183.41 (talk) 06:09, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

Playability, or lack thereof

It doesn't seem clear from the text that the gameplay, at least on the home computer conversions (C64 and, Atari ST/Amiga IIRC) was almost non-existent. Walkthroughs were simply a list of joystick movements to be executed in the correct order, like "left, left, fire, up, left, down, down, right, the end". In terms of playability, it was regarded almost as a joke, an interesting graphical experiment, but not really a game. The unexpected supremacy of the game's graphics caused a polarising effect, with some reviewers giving extremely high scores (92% [2]) and some panning the game for its wooden playability (32% [3]). I'll try to put a mention of this in the body, since it was one of the defining aspects of Dragon's Lair really. Destynova (talk) 20:19, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

Ok, worked some of it into the text of the 'Legacy' section. It'd be nice to give more perspective on this divide, if it existed at the time the Laserdisc version was released. Destynova (talk) 20:32, 26 March 2011 (UTC)
Agreed. I remember when the game hit the arcades and it was amazing looking and we were all excited to play it. That lasted about the 30 seconds each 50 cent play gave us when we realized the gameplay itself was too difficult unless you already knew what the scripted moves were supposed to be.HanokOdbrook (talk) 21:15, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

Free on a magazine CD.

Late 1990's one of the computer magazines had Dragon's Lair as a freebie on a pack-in CD. I don't recall which magazine it was but I do recall the bleeping thing would crash right after starting. Supposedly the entire original arcade version was on the disc. I may still have the disc somewhere. Bizzybody (talk) 10:39, 1 May 2011 (UTC)

No sources,so it goes.

There are no sources for -It was arguably the most successful game on this medium. There are no sources for this,and it reads like PR Fluff,so I am removing it.--99.177.248.92 (talk) 20:47, 6 January 2012 (UTC)

Memorization

I've editted the text - "The screen shows animated cutscenes, and the player executes an action by selecting a direction or pressing the sword button with correct timing, requiring the player to memorize each scenario in order to clear each quick time event." It was quite thoughtless for someone to have written that this game requires memorization. Some scenes of the game need only one joystick move to be completed successfully. Any able-bodied person with an I.Q. of 80 or higher can use logical reasoning to move a joystick in the direction opposite from a burst of fire and successfully complete a scene on their first-ever attempt at playing it without memorization. Accidental success is also possible. Memorization is not required, and that text was removed. The game was intentionally animated with visibly apparent, frequently obvious resolutions to the threats presented, and whoever decided to write that memorization is a requirement must have lacked the skill of proper quick response to the game's events. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.232.154.100 (talk) 17:01, 24 September 2012 (UTC)

I own the original machine in my gameroom. I also played the game in the 80s. If the game did not require memorization, I would think that someone could easily play the game all the way through in the first few times they played it by, as you say, by using "logical reasoning" and having an IQ more than 80. There are some choices which seem to defy being an obvious choice. There are also misleading choices, like the initial flash of the "Drink Me" potion. There are other choices which, while they could be deduced, there is not enough time available to reason it out. Memorization is key to getting through the game. I would probably quote a source like IGN (because Wikipedia loves sources for things and not personal opinions) and reference it to say that the gameplay is based on memorization. Jmccorm (talk) 03:44, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
After reading the actual edit, I'm not going to challenge this. The game pretty much requires memorization. But memorization isn't required to clear *an* event. (But it is required for a player to have a reasonable change of clearing the sum of all events.) Jmccorm (talk) 13:20, 8 January 2014 (UTC)

Wrong Release Date

Dragon's Lair was released to arcades on July 1, 1983. The article currently states the release date as June 19, 1983. Since this mistaken date is coming up soon, this should probably be corrected quckly before blogs start referencing it and Wikipedia for 30th anniversary posts EightTrackMind (talk) 17:00, 17 June 2013 (UTC)

Do you have a verifiable reference that supports July 1, 1983? Also, please add new topics to the bottom of the Talk pages. : ) — Frεcklεfσσt | Talk 02:59, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

There's a quote right in the wikipedia article itself, from Newsweek, that pegs it to early July: "Dragon's Lair is this summer's hottest new toy: the first arcade game in the United States with a movie-quality image to go along with the action... The game has been devouring kids' coins at top speed since it appeared early in July. "

Also: "Dragon's Lair, which rolled off the line and into arcades at the beginning of July, is generating as much as $1000 per unit per week" Wisconsin State Journal (Knight Ridder News Service), "Dragon's Lair: Hot Animation", by Steven X. Rea, Aug. 14 1983

And: "Dragon's Lair, in which Dirk must use both brain and brawn to overcome an army of goons, ghouls and beasties to rescue a fair princess, created a sensation when it was introduced last month." Titusville Herald(AP), "Industry Has High Hopes For New Video Games", by Jay Arnold, Aug. 19, 1983

Further: "We've had 7,300 purchase orders from arcades and distributors on 'Dragon's Lair' since July 1,", Bluth said. (referring to animation creator Don Bluth) Harrisonburg Daily News Record (N.Y. Times News Service), "Laser-Disk Game Scoring Big", by Aljean Harmetz, Aug. 3, 1983 EightTrackMind (talk) 03:37, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

Hey, I've recently found another one, if anyone wants to give the DL article here more specificity regarding the release date (July 1, 1983) "Cinematronics promised distribs and ops it would deliver its first laserdisc game, "Dragon's Lair," in July - and sure enough, container loads (rather than sample shipments) of the new piece have been in delivery since just after the first of July." Compasio, Camille. "Around the Route." Cash Box 6 Aug. 1983: 31. — Preceding unsigned comment added by EightTrackMind (talk • contribs) 19:21, 30 January 2020 (UTC)

I know this issue is a bit dated, but does someone with good release date hunting skills have time to look into this? I don't know where the June release date came from, but it looks like EightTrackMind has a pretty good case that the June date is incorrect. — Frεcklεfσσt | Talk 13:05, 17 June 2014 (UTC)

Dragon's Lair for Sega Genesis?

I found a unreleased Sega Mega Drive / Genesis version of Dragon's Lair! No matter it's proto or not, but sure it looks like a fully finished port of the SNES game with the exception of a glitch. The game is playable all the way through. Here is a gameplay video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9xWbIhC-0Q — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.174.113.63 (talk) 11:17, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

Dual Cabinet Setup

If memory serves, Dragon's Lair was released in a then-unusual -- perhaps even unique? -- cabinet style with a video screen above the gameplay screen, perhaps to lure additional players, on which cut-scenes would be played. Not all cabinets had this second screen. Does anyone else recall such a setup? Perhaps it was unique to the arcade on the Ocean City, MD, boardwalk? Czrisher (talk) 20:00, 6 November 2014 (UTC)

These extra monitors mounted on top of the cabinet were done by the arcade operators to appease the throngs of people that would gather around as someone played the game. They were not shipped that way by Cinematronics. EightTrackMind (talk) 17:40, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

A lot of arcades used to put TVs on top of their Dragon's Lair cabinets to let spectators watch without disturbing the player. You're probably remembering that. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2607:FEA8:9620:3674:14DC:941A:6D5A:B2D5 (talk) 19:39, 8 May 2020 (UTC)

Useful magazine source

Came across an extensive article on Dragon's Lair from a scan of an old video game magazine (Video Games #15, December 1983, pages 33-36, written by Mary Claire Blakeman). Looks to be quite a bit to sift through, so I'm just going to leave it here for someone with more time on their hands to work with: http://oldgamemags.tumblr.com/post/158517690112/video-games-15-dec-1983-a-young-donbluth Cat's Tuxedo (talk) 18:37, 17 March 2017 (UTC)

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Stranger Things

The opener mentions that the game was featured in Stranger Things. This seems out of place and unnecessary (although it could be added somewhere else). --Wodgester (talk) 16:58, 29 November 2017 (UTC)

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Aspect ratio question

As I have noticed this game is freaking cropped in both 4x3 and 16x9 modes! The original master was probably filmed in a squeamish aspect ratio close to 1:37:1, which it explains all the cropping madness. Btw some scenes look really silly with both these crops such as close-up of the princess. Could have been nice if a newer HD release would have contained that fourth uncropped 1:37:1 mode, which I will really be happy with it and even Don Bluth himself. Although it would required have to ditch out the 5x4, 4x3 and 16x9 modes in order to save the disc space. Cheers for some interesting facts. Same situation goes for Space Ace and Dragon's Lair II: Time Warp. 94.180.96.158 (talk) 17:58, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

Prototype footage preservation status.

Does the original master for the prototype footage still exists? Or it's lost forever? I found a cel of prototype Giddy Goon death scene with Dirk stabbed with a spear in his throat. Also I found a cel of prototype Tentacles and Halberd scene, where Dirk breaks the said halberd. Also Dragon's Lair 3D menus use a few of prototype backgrounds such as the one from prototype Catwalk scene with the magical backdoor exit that appears right, after Dirk kills the bats. Will we see these prototype scenes in a greater quality anytime? IMHO I prefer them over the linear final ones. Also I recently found prototype laserdisc footage but it's even more incomplete than the VHS Starcom footage found in 2002. 94.180.96.158 (talk) 17:57, 23 August 2020 (UTC)

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