Talk:Clitomachus (philosopher)

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This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as stub, and the rating on other projects was brought up to Stub class. BetacommandBot 03:51, 10 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

When did he come to Athens?[edit]

The introduction says "came to Athens around 146 BC", but under Life it says "He came to Athens in 163/2 BC, when he was about 24 years old."

In Dictionary of Greek and Roman Biography and Mythology, the source of this article, Adolph Stahr writes "came to Athens in his 40th year of his age, previously at least to the year 146 BC". (My note: I.e. previously to the year of the fall of Carthage.)

Diogenes Laertius says "had reached his fortieth year when he went to Athens" and this might be (or, rather, probably is) the source of Stahr's "40th year of age".

No reference is given in this article for 163/2 and 24 years old, but a little detective work shows that "146" (in the Life-section) was changed to "163/2" by Singinglemon on 16 December 2009 (i.e. the contradictory years have been unnoticed for almost three years!). Singinglemon gave a reference, Dorandi, page. 49, for the years of birth/death in the introduction, but not for the emigration. But in that same table of Dorandi it says "163/2 Clitomachus goes to Athens". On page 33 Dorandi writes "Clitomachus (born in Carthage, 187/6) had originally come to Athens at the age of twenty-four, in 163/2, and four years later, in 159/8, started to attend the lectures of the elder Carneades." (In the footnote to this sentence he writes "These dates are only approximate, because of the problem connected with exclusive versus inclusive reckoning".) Dorandi continues "His reasons for founding his own school, nineteen years later, in 140/39 (Hagnotheos' archonship) are obscure".

German Wikipedia says: "Im Alter von 24 Jahren, also wohl 163/162, kam er nach Athen." and gives the reference "Eine anderslautende Überlieferung, wonach er bei der Übersiedlung bereits 40 Jahre alt war, ist nicht glaubwürdig; siehe Görler (1994) S. 899."(ref)Woldemar Görler: Die Akademie zwischen Karneades und Philon. In: Grundriss der Geschichte der Philosophie, Die Philosophie der Antike, Bd. 4/2: Die hellenistische Philosophie, hrsg. Hellmut Flashar, 2. Auflage, Schwabe, Basel 1994, ISBN 3-7965-0930-4, S. 898–914)(/ref) - free translation (as well as I can with my rudimentary German... and rudimentary English...): "A different wording according to which he should have been 40 years of age at his emigration is not trustworthy, see Görler (1994) p. 899."

--Episcophagus (talk) 18:07, 27 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]