Talk:Christmas with Friends (India.Arie and Joe Sample album)/GA1

GA Review[edit]

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Reviewer: Premeditated Chaos (talk · contribs) 22:23, 16 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Pleased to see this as a GA nom, considering I did the DYK hook review! Looking forward to going over it more thoroughly. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 22:23, 16 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you! Aoba47 (talk) 00:11, 17 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Rate	Attribute	Review Comment
1. Well-written:
	1a. the prose is clear, concise, and understandable to an appropriately broad audience; spelling and grammar are correct.	Having read the article a few times now, I find it feels somewhat disorganized. Information about putting the album on hold after Sample's death, then reaching out to collaborators, would be better placed under "Background and recording" to make the timeline clear. The lead mentions that the album is mostly Christmas standards, but the body doesn't discuss that. It's obvious but still needs to be stated. The original song should be a separate paragraph because it's a distinct topic. This may not be plausible, but I wonder if the composition/collaboration section would be better served on the whole if it was rewritten to go track by track, integrating reviewer comments and collaborator information for each track together? ie, "Track 3 features Guest A, and reviewers called it sultry, track 4 features Guest B..." etc. I think at the least, Sample's info should be in a separate paragraph from the rest of the collabs for clarity, since he's the main collaborator and everyone else was kind of an afterthought. Organization is much clearer now.
	1b. it complies with the Manual of Style guidelines for lead sections, layout, words to watch, fiction, and list incorporation.	~~Lead is a good summary except as noted above.~~ Addressed. No concerns with words to watch or list incorporation.
2. Verifiable with no original research:
	2a. it contains a list of all references (sources of information), presented in accordance with the layout style guideline.	Reference list exists and is formatted clearly.
	2b. reliable sources are cited inline. All content that could reasonably be challenged, except for plot summaries and that which summarizes cited content elsewhere in the article, must be cited no later than the end of the paragraph (or line if the content is not in prose).	Citations needed for the following: studio locations from "Background and recording", sentences starting Charles described "Let It Snow" as..., She said that it would be her only Christmas album., Arie promoted the album by performing.... Addressed in comments.
	2c. it contains no original research.	~~Can't confirm 100% until citations for the above are included.~~ All good.
	2d. it contains no copyright violations or plagiarism.	As noted on the DYK nom, Earwig's shows red for the credits and personnel section, as it is adapted from Allmusic.com. Also as noted in that nom, I believe per the copyright FAQ that it falls under simple factual information without creativity so it should be ok. Also, it is explicitly stated in the text and sourced.
3. Broad in its coverage:
	3a. it addresses the main aspects of the topic.	Yes, sections included are typical of albums.
	3b. it stays focused on the topic without going into unnecessary detail (see summary style).	Yes.
	4. Neutral: it represents viewpoints fairly and without editorial bias, giving due weight to each.	No concerns with puffery, advertisement, or weasel wording. Fairly includes both positive and negative reviews.
	5. Stable: it does not change significantly from day to day because of an ongoing edit war or content dispute.	No edit warring.
6. Illustrated, if possible, by media such as images, video, or audio:
	6a. media are tagged with their copyright statuses, and valid non-free use rationales are provided for non-free content.	Lead image is correctly tagged fair use, McDonald picture is a free-use Commons image.
	6b. media are relevant to the topic, and have suitable captions.	~~Although could we include an image of Mr. Sample, if we're going to have one of McDonald?~~ Not needed.
	7. Overall assessment.	Excellent work, this is a really lovely article. Thank you for your responsiveness and I'm very pleased to pass it!

I have revise this part according to your suggestion. Aoba47 (talk) 01:41, 17 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Unfortunately, that cannot be done unless it is cited in a source. I do not believe that any of the source straight up just say that this album is primarily Christmas standards. However, I would argue that this verges on this type of argument Wikipedia:You don't need to cite that the sky is blue in which is it truly necessary to cite information that is very clear in the track listing. Aoba47 (talk) 01:41, 17 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I don't necessarily need it to be cited, but if the lead says it, the body ought to as well, since the lead summarizes the body. Even if you just say "Christmas with Friends comprises ten songs, nine of which are Christmas standards and one is an original track." I would argue that doesn't need its own citation per BLUESKY. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 02:00, 17 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Revised as suggested. Aoba47 (talk) 03:41, 17 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I have reorganized the section somewhat. I made the third paragraph about the critics' comments on the sounds/genres associated with the various songs as that was a common pointed brought up in their reviews and articles. Let me know what you think. Aoba47 (talk) 01:41, 17 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Agreed; revised as suggested. Aoba47 (talk) 01:41, 17 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Studio locations are already cited by Reference 4, which appears later in the paragraph (as all of the information is supported by that citation). Added the citation for Charles. The "she said that it would be her only Christmas album." part is already supported by Reference 16 and the "Arie promoted the album by performing..." is already cited by Reference 1. Aoba47 (talk) 01:45, 17 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Fair enough. I did add a ref for the only Christmas album bit, only because I clarified the origin of the statement in the body and wanted to make sure that was clearly reffed. On the topic of citations, "They worked together on music without much success;" wasn't supported by Ref 1, the Billboard ref, so I replaced it with Ref 16 (now Ref 2), the Ebony ref, which does support it. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 18:37, 17 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I do not see a need to include an image of Sample as he is visible on the album cover. That is also the reason why I did not add an image of India.Arie to the body of the article. Aoba47 (talk) 01:47, 17 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

No problem, just a thought, ♠PMC♠ (talk) 18:37, 17 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]