Talk:Cask ale

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Issues[edit]

A great entry, however much of it appears to be the same as http://www.ratebeer.com/Beer-News/Article-352.htm (an article from a couple of years ago) - is this a copyright issue? --Alex Whittaker 00:29, 3 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Not a problem. I wrote the RateBeer article. I have adapted it for the Wiki entry. SilkTork 00:29, 13 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This article seems to be completely lacking in any ability to be objective. I may be wrong, but I was under the impression that an encyclopedia was supposed to enlightne you as to facts, rather than the author's opinion, wherever possible. —This unsigned comment was added by Firenexus (talk • contribs) .

The article was originally written by User:SilkTork for RateBeer, so it has a more informal tone than some of the other beer articles. You are welcome to suggest improvements, or edit it yourself, of course. Be bold! --Dforest 14:46, 27 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, I like this article but it definitely needs major cleanup for tone in order for it to sound like an encyclopedia piece. Right now it's more a how-to for how to enjoy cask beer (which I certainly appreciate). — brighterorange (talk) 04:29, 13 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Headings[edit]

I've adapted a few of the headings in the article, to make them less informal and more suited to an encyclopaedia than a magazine. BrendanH 15:19, 30 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Definition[edit]

The definition says,"Cask ale or cask-conditioned beer is the term for unfiltered and unpasteurised beer which is conditioned (including secondary fermentation) and served from a cask without additional nitrogen or carbon dioxide pressure". In my view this is not quite true. It is the definition of Real (draught) Ale (Bottled conditioned beer being another form of Real Ale). Cask Ale is, "Cask ale or cask-conditioned beer is the term for unfiltered and unpasteurised beer which is conditioned (including secondary fermentation) and served from a cask" Cask Ale therefore only stays real ale if extraneous gas pressure is not used. If extraneous gas pressure is applied then it is simply referred to as pressurised beer. Of course bright beer (filtered or pressurised) can never be real ale whether pressurised or not pressurised. I hope that makes sense. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.153.42.50 (talk) 21:07, 1 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Pint[edit]

I've put a comment in the article pointing out that the caption is wrong - it says "a pint of real ale...". In fact, there is some ale in a pint glass, but there was less than a pint of ale - I assume some had been drunk. Maybe the comment doesn't belong in the article, but I couldn't find where to edit the caption appropriately —Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.153.42.50 (talk) 20:57, 1 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

My message above - but how do you amend a caption on a picture? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Peter Judge (talk • contribs) 21:48, 1 February 2011 (UTC) And how come my real name comes up here, but my nickname comes up in other places?[reply]

DrWhoFan (talk) 21:56, 1 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

And how come I got a box round my message that time?. I'm confused. DrWhoFan (talk) 21:58, 1 February 2011 (UTC) So, I've figured out that if I use the "tildes", then I get my nickname, but why do I get my real name otherwise? Surely the point of the nickname is to be anonymous to the "world", whilst Wikipedia have some control on who are registered contributors? I remain confused. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Peter Judge (talk • contribs) 22:01, 1 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Lines that begin with a space will have a box around them. I have removed the space before your comment; box has gone.
If you don't sign, the automated signing software, SineBot, will sign with your user account name. But if you sign your posts yourself then your custom signature will display instead. pablo 14:34, 12 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Neutrality[edit]

There's a lot of bias in this article- things like In fact, there is no drink more inviting and satisfying than a cask ale in good condition. I'm going to work on rewording some of these, but I'm putting a npov tag on the article also in hopes of getting others to help fix it also. Friday (talk) 16:34, 3 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Perhaps the descriptive elements can be retained along the lines of: "cask advocates find that keg beer contains metallic and cardboard notes that are not in cask ale." — goethean ॐ 16:49, 3 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
A bit weasel wordy maybe, but it's definitely better to attribute such statements to "cask advocates" than to present them as fact. (Maybe we can quote someone from CAMRA for some of this?) I like cask ale as much as anybody, but I'm not seeing how cask ale in a metal cask is going to be less metallic than beer in a metal keg. Friday (talk) 16:57, 3 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The last section, about the differences between cask and keg ales smacks of elitism. Now, I'm an uninformed American whose entire experience of English beer comes from Newcastle and a few others, but NPOV definitely seems to be an issue here. I'll leave it to someone else who is knowledgeable on the subject to fix it, but it does need fixing, I think. Ghamming 06:25, 9 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I second this, and that's speaking as someone who prefers ale. Not sure how best to change it though, perhaps someone with more experience? --jacksonj04 (talk) 11:56, 18 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

"The most important aspect of cask ale is the mouthfeel. It should not be fizzy. If your beer is fizzy then it’s either a keg beer or it’s a cask ale that’s been put on too soon. If you are used to carbonated drinks - keg beer, bottled beer, sparkling water, cola, etc - the mouthfeel of a cask ale may seem a little strange - even flat or boring - at first. There are some people who don’t even notice the mouthfeel. If they are just drinking the beer without paying attention - may they are chatting away, or maybe they are trying to catch the aroma or flavour of this cask ale they have heard so much about - the mouthfeel will pass them by."

I would challenge "the term 'traditional ingredients' is designed, like the Reinheitsgebot, to prevent artificial preservatives or cheap adjuncts or chemicals from being used". Chemicals such as yeast nutrients or liquor treatments are used by many UK real ale breweries without any concerns from CAMRA as are adjuncts such as maize or roasted barley. So much is fact, my opinion is that the term 'traditional ingredients' is intended as an inclusive term to bring in traditional UK ingredients such as sugar or isinglass (sturgeon's swim bladder). I'm new here, once I'm a bit more sure of the protocol, I'll have a go at editing the page.--David John Edge 13:19, 30 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, depends what is meant by 'traditional ingredients'. Until the end of the 19th century British Beers were generally brewed with just malt, hops, yeast and water but with the advent of artificial fertilisers, towards the end of the 19th century, many brewers began to experience persistent protein 'hazes' in their beers due to the fact that the new 'super barley' strains, when converted to malt, contained more starch-converting enzymes than previously and protein materials were carrying over into the beer. This could be fixed by adding extra starchy grains to the mash, such as maize and rice, which enabled all the enzymes in the malt to be fully utilised and not 'hang around' after the mashing process. Of course it soon became apparent that this was a way of producing more fermentable sugars, i.e. more beer, using cheaper ingredients. Ever since then, as far as I know, pure malt beers have been in the minority in Britain, Keg, real ale or otherwise. The mashing process can be very tricky which is why many 'brewpubs' in areas where beer is served cold (especially USA and here in Australia) often serve cloudy beer with a 'chill haze' resulting from an 'inaccurate' mash. --MichaelGG 05:01, 8 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Definately NPOV. I will have a look at trying to objectify this article when I get some free time --Astral (talk) 12:48, 8 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

NPOV, indeed. It's a CAMRA advocacy piece. Now, given that CAMRA coined the term "real ale", it's entirely reasonable to document their definition, and even their claimed advantages. The sad thing is, fixing it will eviscerate a rather nice essay. 71.41.210.146 (talk) 08:13, 19 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]
ISWYM, but it's not a wikipedia article at the moment. I'll start fixing it when I get some time. jamesgibbon 11:19, 15 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

This article is too UK biased... what about an international view ? What are pubs... you mean bar, tavern !! ELCouz (talk) 02:42, 2 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

A piece on cask ale is inevitably going to be UK biased as this is the only country where it's widely available!!Haldraper (talk) 20:45, 6 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

No proof whatsoever that use of a swan neck and/or aeration lessens the flavour of beer. Wine blenders aerate wine in their mouths to maximise the flavour of the wine so why not aerate the beer as it goes into the glass? Sandownboy —Preceding undated comment added 11:28, 3 July 2011 (UTC).[reply]

Wine isn't (generally) carbonated. Whilst using a sparkler might introduce a small amount of air into the liquid, this is far, far exceeded by the carbon dioxide it expurges.FrFintonStack (talk) 04:30, 29 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Disputed etymology[edit]

Wiktionary provides a different etymology for "cask". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.96.90.233 (talk) 14:27, 27 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

WikiProject Food and drink Tagging[edit]

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Needs sources[edit]

This article is a lovely read and it's plain a lot of work has gone in to it by numerous editors. It's still quite light on sources. A quick glance around the UK papers yielded these:

and an article about women brewing real ale from the Indie

Not exactly the kind of thing I was looking for, but I might try to work them in to give the article some RS over the next few days. 7daysahead (talk) 10:51, 23 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

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Can you legally call any beer "real ale"?[edit]

Is the term "real ale" trademarked or anything? If I sold some fizzy Euro lager as "real ale" it would annoy CAMRA but would they have any recourse against me? Equinox ◑ 13:28, 19 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

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