Talk:Berliner Motor Corporation

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ToDo[edit]

  • I'd like to include Berliner's notorious and highly collectible advertisements. They had a number of memorable magazine ads with women in suggestive but also sort of weird and off-putting poses. There was also one with a woman as a Roman charioteer with 3 Ducati motorcycles as horses. Don't know if I can find a reliable source to versify it; you find it mentioned on discussion boards though. Dbratland (talk) 05:37, 14 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Figure out if Berliner ever stuck to a single logo or typeface. Dbratland (talk) 05:37, 14 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]


Usage of "Berliner" and "the Berliners"[edit]

As far as I can tell, the Berliner brothers, Joseph and Michael, called all the shots at Berliner Motor Corporation, so in factual terms it hardly matters if you say the Berliners did something or Berliner Motor Corporation did something.

An exception is when Berliner Motor Corp chose to give Evel Knievel his first fleet of motorcycles, and a Berliner employee (not Joseph or Michael) who suggested Knievel's old nickname Evel would better than Bobby as a stage name.

Grammatically, it can be confusing. When in doubt, I think it is best to say Berliner Motor Corporation because even when Joseph or Michael Berliner made a big decision, in fact it was carried out by their company, not themselves personally.

If you're sure the brothers were personally involved, say "the Berliner brothers" or "Joseph and Michael Berliner", or "Joseph Berliner, President of...". I'd avoid just "Berliner" and instead say "Berliner Motor" or "Berliner Motor Corporation". BMC is sometimes used, but rarely.

Just "Berliner's" means something possessed by Berliner Motor Corporation -- it's confusing; avoid it. If you include the definite article as in "the Berliners' ", it means something possessed by the brothers -- confusing; avoid. "The Berliner's" is incorrect usage of plural possessive; best avoid it anyway. "The Berliners" can only mean the two brothers, not the company, but it's confusing and should be avoided. Better to say Berliner Motor Corporation's to mean possessed by the company, and "the Berliner brothers' " to mean possessed by the brothers, and "the Berliner brothers" to just mean the brothers, plural. Dbratland (talk) 20:00, 14 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Reference notes for possible use[edit]

Falloon, Ian (2006). The Ducati 750 Bible. Veloce Publishing Ltd. p. 46. ISBN 9781845840129. Retrieved 2009-04-15. The US distributor Berliner had traditionally influenced the direction of Ducati's production line-up. It was instrumental in the creation of the Apollo, the fan-cooled two-strokes, and the Ducati 450 R/T, and as such, was indirectly responsible for the dire financial crisis Ducati was faced with at the end of the 1960. {{cite book}}: Check |authorlink= value (help); Cite has empty unknown parameter: |coauthors= (help); External link in |authorlink= (help)Dbratland (talk) 22:20, 24 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Falloon, Ian (2006). The Ducati 750 Bible. Veloce Publishing Ltd. p. 49. ISBN 9781845840129. Retrieved 2009-04-15. All US Amal carburettors had the 3.5 slide, and most 1972 US 750 GTs were also fitted with Metzeler tires; this seemed to be a Berliner initiative as it was also a Metzeler tyres distributor at that stage. {{cite book}}: Check |authorlink= value (help); Cite has empty unknown parameter: |coauthors= (help); External link in |authorlink= (help)

Information Access Company (2002). Cycle World. Vol. 41. The University of Michigan: CBS Publications. Retrieved 2009-04-15. Berliner agreed to finance the cost of the prototype. Berliner also agreed to... {{cite book}}: |archive-date= requires |archive-url= (help); Cite has empty unknown parameter: |coauthors= (help)

Falloon, Ian (2007). The Moto Guzzi Sport & Le Mans Bible. Veloce Publishing Ltd. p. 16. ISBN 9781845840648. Soon after joining Moto Guzzi, Tonti set about developing the V7. At the time the United States was the largest market for the model but Berliner, the US importer, wanted a larger capacity motorcycle. The V7 proved too slow in police acceleration tests, and Berliner needed a faster machine to secure the big police contracts. Guzzi responded by sending two tuned 750s to the US, specifically for police speed trials, and quickened development of the 750. {{cite book}}: Check |authorlink1= value (help); Cite has empty unknown parameter: |month= (help); External link in |authorlink1= (help)Dbratland (talk) 19:03, 24 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Falloon, Ian (2007). The Moto Guzzi Sport & Le Mans Bible. Veloce Publishing Ltd. p. 33. ISBN 9781845840648. In 1972 Moto Guzzi's US distributor was the Premier Motor Corporation, part of the Berliner group. As with the Ducatis it distributed, Berliner -- or the factory -- placed a plate over the stamped frame number. (This identification plate was available as an official spare part, as were the rivets.) Because of the riveted plate the VIN (Vehicle Identification Number) for US V7 Sports was always the engine number. {{cite book}}: Check |authorlink1= value (help); Cite has empty unknown parameter: |month= (help); External link in |authorlink1= (help)

Falloon, Ian (2007). The Moto Guzzi Sport & Le Mans Bible. Veloce Publishing Ltd. p. 81. ISBN 9781845840648. As the high compression, big valve, 850cc engine couldn't satisfy US emission standards imposed on motorcycles manufactured after January 1, 1978, a specific Le Mans was created for the US for 1979. American buyers also required larger displacement engines, and the importer, Berliner, asked for a 1000cc Le Mans. {{cite book}}: Check |authorlink1= value (help); Cite has empty unknown parameter: |month= (help); External link in |authorlink1= (help)Dbratland (talk) 19:03, 24 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

"Tire Kickin': Guzzi Gratification", American Motorcyclist, vol. 38, no. 3, American Motorcyclist Association, p. 60, 1984, ISSN 0277-9358, retrieved 2009-04-15, Guzzi gratification -- Benelli/Moto Guzzi North America, a division of Maserati Automobiles Inc., will now import and distribute Moto Guzzi motorcycles and replacement parts. A result of the changeover from Berliner Motors of New Jersey, according to George Garbutt, president of Maserati, is an expanded motorcycle parts inventory and, possibly, a larger dealer network. {{citation}}: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |coauthors= (help); Unknown parameter |month= ignored (help) Dbratland (talk) 18:26, 15 April 2009 (UTC)Dbratland (talk) 22:20, 24 April 2009 (UTC) "1963 Matchless Models Introduced" (PDF), CYCLE Magazine, 1962, retrieved 2009-04-15, During the recent visit to the United States of Matchless Motorcycles Limited Managing Directors, J.B. Smith and A.A. Sugar, arrangements were completed for the sole distribution of Matchless Motorcycles in the United States by the J. B. Matchless Corporation of Hasbrouck Heights, N. J. They visited the West Coast with Mr. Joe Berliner, President of Berliner Motor Corporation, U. S. Norton distributors -- who is also president of the newly formed J. B. Matchless Corporation. {{citation}}: Unknown parameter |city= ignored (|location= suggested) (help); Unknown parameter |month= ignored (help); Unknown parameter |state= ignored (help)CS1 maint: extra punctuation (link) Dbratland (talk) 23:04, 15 April 2009 (UTC)Dbratland (talk) 22:20, 24 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

"Berliner Named Sole Norton Distributor", American Motorcycling, vol. 15, no. 10, American Motorcyclist Association, p. 40, 1961, ISSN 0277-9358, retrieved 2009-04-15, The Berliner Motor Corp., following their successful appointment as sole distributor of Norton motorcycles for the 25 Easter states plus Colorado, Kansas and Washington last year, have now been appointed Norton's sole distributor for the entire United States. {{citation}}: Unknown parameter |month= ignored (help)

"Bonds and Bikes", American Motorcycling, vol. 15, no. 10, American Motorcyclist Association, p. 40, 1961, ISSN 0277-9358, retrieved 2009-04-15, A recent letter by Walter von Schonfeld of Berliner Motor Corp. to their dealers stated: "Please inform every motorcyclist that Mr. Berliner, President of Berliner Motor Corporation, who is celebrating 13 years of freedom under democracy in his adopted country, the United States of America, has announced that every rider who purchases one of the new electric-starter 250cc Zundapp 'Super Sabre' models will receive an outright gift of a $25 U.S. Treasury Defense Bond. ¶ "This is being done in appreciation for all the democratic principles that enabled him to grow and become the leader in the lightweight motorcycle field in the past 15 years." {{citation}}: Unknown parameter |month= ignored (help) Dbratland (talk) 04:08, 16 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Giulio, Decio; Carugati, Decio G. R.; Sadleir, Richard (2001), Ducati: Design and Emotion, MotorBooks/MBI Publishing Company, p. 64, ISBN 9780760311998, In 1961 the 250cc version of the Scrambler fulfilled the dream of Ducati lovers across the Atlantic, thanks to its importer Joe Berliner; this was even before it was marketed in Europe, where it arrived later among the symbols of the American dream. "In the 1965s-'60s Joe Berliner was far and away the best of Ducati's customers," states Livio Lodi, "and so he had the power to influence the firms policies. He encouraged the project of an all-purpose bike that would appeal to young people but also revive the youth of the not-so-young. Remember that in those years in Europe and above all in Italy, the utilitarie [23] like the new Fiat 500 penalized sales of motorbikes with medium-large engines. Berliner knew that in the states cars would never affect motorcycles sales, the two market segments were nurtured by completely different dreams..." Page 102: "But while Ducati owed the Scrambler to the insistence of Joe Berliner, the firm's American importer, the Monster was the fruit of the intuition of Miguel ..." {{citation}}: External link in |quote= (help) Dbratland (talk) 04:34, 16 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Brown, Barry (April 1966), "The Mystical, Magical Motorcycle [column]", Car and Driver Magazine, vol. 11, no. 10, pp. 20–24, ISSN 0008-6002, Joe was the first child of a crippled Hungarian war hero who settled down with a radio-bicycle-motorcycle store, and as the family grew into five sons and a daughter Joe took over more and more responsibility for the business. He attended high school and later studied mechanics and business to help his father.{{citation}}: CS1 maint: date and year (link)

Brown, Barry (April 1966), "The Mystical, Magical Motorcycle [column]", Car and Driver Magazine, vol. 11, no. 10, pp. 20–24, ISSN 0008-6002, [Joseph Berliner said,] 'One Sunday in 1941, I was dragged from my home in chains and taken to a slave labor camp. During the years 1941 to 1944 I spent 14 months in this camp, on and off.' Then came the occupation by units of the German Army.{{citation}}: CS1 maint: date and year (link)Dbratland (talk) 22:20, 24 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

During the first hour at Auschwitz, 16 of Joseph Berliner's 22 immediate family members were killed, including both his parents and both his children. Joe and one of his brothers were spared because they were mechanics, and the two of them convinced the S.S. that their youngest brother, Michael, was also a mechanic. Only Michael would ultimately survive with Joseph, though after the war he was able to locate his wife who had been liberated by the Swedish Red Cross. Brown, Barry (April 1966), "The Mystical, Magical Motorcycle [column]", Car and Driver Magazine, vol. 11, no. 10, pp. 20–24, ISSN 0008-6002, [Joseph Berliner said,] 'All Jews were sent to Auschwitz. My whole immediate family, 22 of us, arrived on May 22, 1944 -- a Monday afternoon.' There, in one hour -- only 60 minutes -- Joe Berliner lost 16 members of his family: his son, his daughter, his father, mother, grandparents, mother-in-law... all burned as he watched. Joe and a brother were saved and became auto mechanics. The two convinced the S.S. that the youngest Berliner boy, Mike, was also a mechanic, and the three of them were safe for a time, maintaining a fleet of German Army trucks. [...] 'on April 25, my brother died of hunger and typhus. I buried him beside the stable.'{{citation}}: CS1 maint: date and year (link)

Brown, Barry (April 1966), "The Mystical, Magical Motorcycle [column]", Car and Driver Magazine, vol. 11, no. 10, pp. 20–24, ISSN 0008-6002, Joseph Berliner is Berliner Motors -- the largest independently-owned motorcycle and motorcycle parts distributor in the world.{{citation}}: CS1 maint: date and year (link)

Brown, Barry (April 1966), "The Mystical, Magical Motorcycle [column]", Car and Driver Magazine, vol. 11, no. 10, pp. 20–24, ISSN 0008-6002, At this point, Joe Berliner weighed 80 pounds and was racked with typhus. He was put in a Red Cross death house as a hopeless case, and one of his remaining brothers, Mike, was told that he was dead and buried. [...] Eventually, Joe was released on crutches. He couldn't sit for six months.{{citation}}: CS1 maint: date and year (link)

Brown, Barry (April 1966), "The Mystical, Magical Motorcycle [column]", Car and Driver Magazine, vol. 11, no. 10, pp. 20–24, ISSN 0008-6002, Joe got into the importing line, and after six months more, the company was sold to a dry goods dealer, who made Joe a partner because he knew the business. Jawa later cancelled, and Joe struck up his pre-war contacts with Zündapp, a German firm. In December 1951, Joe's company became Zündapp's American importer.{{citation}}: CS1 maint: date and year (link) Dbratland (talk) 00:55, 21 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Salvadori, Clement (November 2001), "Zundapp Citation 500 1958", Rider, vol. 28, no. 11, pp. 78, 77, And it [the Zundapp Citation 500] did not sell worth a damn. The Berliner Motor Corp., which was importing Zundapps at the time, thought it had a hot number here that would compete with the Brit bikes. Full-page ads appeared in the motorcycle magazines in 1958 for this pseudo-Zundapp, and the price was a very tempting $899, and this should have served to give the Limey OHV vertical twins some competition. 'Twas not to be.{{citation}}: CS1 maint: date and year (link)

Salvadori, Clement (November 2001), "Zundapp Citation 500 1958", Rider, vol. 28, no. 11, pp. 78, 77, By 1957 the Kleeman family decided to get out of the motorcycle business, selling the main part of the factory to Daimler-Benz for automotive production, but making another deal with Zundapp to buy the motorcycle tooling. The Berliner boys had been screaming at Zundapp for something to compete with the British twins in the 500cc and over class, and all the Imperator needed was a modest enlargement, and it could be a done deal.{{citation}}: CS1 maint: date and year (link)

Salvadori, Clement (November 2001), "Zundapp Citation 500 1958", Rider, vol. 28, no. 11, pp. 78, 77, Americans were not too familiar with the Horex name, though some of the single-cylinder models had been imported by the Foreign Motorcycles Corp. of New York. The idea was that the better-known Zundapp name, which also had a good dealer network, would be attached to a revised Horex Imperator, so for 1958 the Citation 500 appeared, heavily touted by Berliner. [...]Berliner Motor Corp. hoped the Citation would take America by storm; it did not. [...] Berliner stuck with the Citation notion for one year, and then gave up.{{citation}}: CS1 maint: date and year (link) Dbratland (talk) 16:27, 21 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Alan, Cathcart (May/June 2009), "Ducati's amazing 1,260cc V4 Apollo", Motorcycle Classics, Back in the late 1950s, Ducati was one of dozens of small Italian manufacturers struggling to overcome the success of the Fiat 500 minicar, which stopped the postwar boom in Italian biking. This collapse in sales forced Ducati to focus even more on their export markets, particularly the U.S. This meant even greater dependence on its U.S. importer, New Jersey-based Berliner Motor Corporation, which was selling roughly 85 percent of Ducati's total production; brothers Joe and Mike Berliner effectively called the shots at recession-hit Ducati. {{citation}}: Check date values in: |date= (help)CS1 maint: date and year (link)

Alan, Cathcart (May/June 2009), "Ducati's amazing 1,260cc V4 Apollo", Motorcycle Classics, Joe Berliner was convinced of the potential of the U.S. police market, especially since U.S. anti-trust legislation required police departments consider bikes other than Harley-Davidsons. Official police department specifications were increasingly standardized across the U.S., favoring the large-capacity Harleys. [...]In 1959, Berliner contacted Ducati chief Giuseppe Montano to see if the firm was interested in producing a machine for this market. Montano and Ducati engineer Fabio Taglioni agreed, certain they could produce a more efficient and modern design that Berliner could sell at a reasonable cost. {{citation}}: Check date values in: |date= (help)CS1 maint: date and year (link)

Alan, Cathcart (May/June 2009), "Ducati's amazing 1,260cc V4 Apollo", Motorcycle Classics, Iwashita acquired the Daytona showbike, second of the two Apollos built (the whereabouts of the original metallic gold example are unknown, if indeed it still survives) in 1986 from Cincinnati-based vintage parts specialist DomiRacer Inc. Owner Bob Schanz had acquired the contents of the Berliner warehouse when the company finally closed down in 1984, including the Apollo prototype, "somewhat neglected and shop worn, but missing only the original [fuel] tank," according to Schanz. {{citation}}: Check date values in: |date= (help)CS1 maint: date and year (link) Dbratland (talk) 16:47, 21 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

"BERLINER MOTOR CORP. ACQUIRES NEW PLANT", Berliner Motor Review, vol. 1, no. 3, Hasbrouck Heights, NJ: Berliner Motor Corporation, p. 6, 1959, ...has acquired a new building having a floor space of 30,000 sq. ft. The new building has 22 ft. ceiling, is of brick and steel construction, has fully air-conditioned offices and show rooms. Storage facilities for over 3000 units is available, as are adequate receiving and shipping platforms allowing for both railroad and trailer truck transport. The new building is located on route 17 in Hasbrouck Heights, N.J. {{citation}}: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |1= (help)

"ZUNDAPP - DUCATI - SACHS DEALERS SET FOR INTERNATIONAL CONTINENTAL VACATION", Berliner Motor Review, vol. 1, no. 3, Hasbrouck Heights, NJ: Berliner Motor Corporation, p. 6, 1959, As has been the custom in the past, Zundapp-Ducati-Sachs dealers from the United States will again fly to Europe this fall. Arrangements have been concluded with Scandinavian Airlines Systems to transport over 80 dealers to Italy and Germany in October. In addition to visits to the Ducati factory in Bologna, Italy, and the Zundapp plant in Munich and Sachs headquarters in Schweinfurt, Germany, Berliner Motor Corp. dealers will make many visits taking in historical sights of the old world. {{citation}}: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |1= (help)

Hello Ed, just a small foot note to your article regarding the history of Triumph in America. Don't know if you are aware that the Berliner Brothers, Joe and Michael, were the last to own the Triumph facility in Baltimore. I was working for Berliner/Premier Motor Corporation when I traveled with Michael and other Berliner employees to Baltimore. Our job was to clean out the building Freddy and Renoand close it down. As a side bar, the Berliners were also the last owners of the Indian factory in Springfield, Massachusetts.

Michael Berliner is still with us and a wonderful source of American motorcycle history. Joe Berliner has passed on, and their sister, Rose, who worked for her brothers just passed away a few weeks ago. Just think about what the Berliners have done for Motorcycling in the USA, including the importation of Zundapp, Jawa, Sacks, Norton, Matchless, Ducati, Moto Guzzi, and Metzler and Pirelli tires. And did you know that the Berliners supplied Knievel with Nortons, and provided a Norton for the movie “Bye Bye Birdie?” Also, the Berliners gave many young riders the opportunity to ride great equipment. This included Freddy Spencer, Frank Scurria, Mike Baldwin, Jimmy Adamo and many more. Michael is not getting any younger, and I for one think it is time the Motorcycle Hall of Fame recognize what these two Hungarian emigrants did for American motorcycling.

http://www.motohistory.net/news2007/news-mar07.html

--Dbratland (talk) 23:40, 4 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

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