Talk:Belford University

Connection to other programs?[edit]

According to degreeadvice.com, Speedy Degrees (speedydegrees.com)is Affiliate of Ashwood University, Belford University, Affordable Degrees (affordabledegrees.com), and Rochville University are run by the same people. [1]

I've moved the above text from the article; in addition to the text itself being extremely unclear, Degreeadvice's information on Speedydegrees does not appear to be current; it no longer appears to be possible to link Belford to the other entities based on this source. Robertissimo 14:11, 14 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Link to official site[edit]

An editor has questioned on my Talk page the neutrality of including a link to this entity's own site. While Wikipedia is not a repository of links, neither is it a soapbox, and the presence of a link so closely related to the subject should not be construed as an endorsement. Links to debatable, even detestable sites abound, especially in regard to controversial matters. Westboro Baptist Church contains links to its own site, as does Amway. Including the site as a reference only provides context for the article, not least because the organization apparently does most of its business online. Robertissimo 09:50, 19 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This is obviously a flawed policy. Wikipedia is helping fraudulent sites by hyperlinking to them. Editors should have the option to not include a hyperlink if the source is verifiably fraudulent and/or criminal in nature. SarahTeach 19:55, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Belford and EssayRelief are owned by the same company. Therefore, the referenced information is accurate. SarahTeach 20:43, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Rochville, Belford, Ashwood, EssayRelief.com, etc. are all owned by the same company in Pakistan. Read below for ample proof.

It is not a coinicidence that Belford and Rochville received the exact same, fabricated number of applicants ("45,862") in 2001:

http://www.belforduniversity.net/university/InsideBelford.html

http://www.rochvilleuniversity.org/Rochville/abtRoch.htm#facts

"Message from the President" is the same:

http://www.belforduniversity.net/university/InsideBelford.html

http://www.rochvilleuniversity.org/Rochville/abtRoch.htm

Query Form:

http://www.belforduniversity.net/query/cform.asp?s=356&

http://www.rochvilleuniversity.org/query/cform.asp?s=307&

FAQ:

http://www.belforduniversity.net/university/faqs.htm

http://www.rochvilleuniversity.org/Rochville/qa.htm

Fee Structure:

http://www.belforduniversity.net/university/FeeStructure.html http://www.rochvilleuniversity.org/Rochville/Fee_Structure.htm

Faculty Area:

http://www.belforduniversity.net/university/FacultyLogin.html http://www.rochvilleuniversity.org/Rochville/Faculty.htm

ESSAYRELIEF SYNDICATE / ROCHVILLE AFFILIATION

http://www.originalthesiswriting.com

"I am a retired professor with a PhD and years of teaching experience. During my tenure as the senior faculty member at Rochville University . . . ."

http://www.originalthesiswriting.com/OTW/order.aspx

http://www.college-entrance-essays.com

"I am a PhD Professor and have a lot of 'writing college-entrance-essays' experience, as I am a senior faculty member at Rochville University."

http://www.college-entrance-essays.com/CEE/order.aspx

ROCHVILLE / ESSAY SITE FRAUD

http://scottsommers.blogs.com/taiwanweblog/2004/08/rochville_unive.html#comment-12808628

"FLEXIBLE PAYMENT PLAN"

COMPARE

http://www.accredited-degrees-assistance.com (ROCHVILLE)

http://www.accredited-degrees-assistance.com/ADA/flexible.asp

AND

http://www.affordabledegrees.com (ROCHVILLE)

http://www.affordabledegrees.com/ada/flexible.asp

TO

http://www.originalthesiswriting.com (ROCHVILLE "PROFESSOR")

http://www.originalthesiswriting.com/Essays/flexible.asp

AND

http://www.ivydissertations.com

http://www.ivydissertations.com/Essays/flexible.asp

SAME ORDER FORMS

http://www.essayrelief.com/ER/orderform.aspx?

http://www.essayrelief.co.uk/ER/orderform.aspx?

http://www.college-entrance-essays.com/CEE/order.aspx (ROCHVILLE "PROFESSOR")

http://www.originalthesiswriting.com/OTW/order.aspx (ROCHVILLE "PROFESSOR")

"BEST OF . . . ."

COMPARE

http://www.topessaysites.com

TO

http://www.degreebuyersguide.com

CURRENT IP, CREATION DATE, AND EMAIL CONNECTIONS

66.132.173.138 = essayrelief.com

66.132.173.241 = rochvilleuniversity.org

essayrelief.com

created on: 23-oct-03

care@essayrelief.com

rochvilleuniversity.org

created on: 09-jul-2003

care@rochvilleuniversity.org

These two domains/IPs were both created in mid-2003. Both are on the exact same server in the exact same location.

Now, compare these two URLS (cform + asp), and then compare the content of the pages side-by-side: http://66.132.173.138/ER/CCForm.aspx

http://66.132.173.241/query/cform.asp?s=307&

Also, here are EssayRelief's bogus accreditation "organizations":

ucoea.org

created on: 29-jul-2003

care@ucoea.org

boua.org

created on: 29-jul-2003

care@boua.org

YES, THEY ARE CRIMINALS

"[Degree mills] have been dubbed by John Bear, an ex-FBI consultant, as a 'huge crime wave...and almost no one has noticed.'" http://www.degreeinfo.com/article24_1.html

"Investigating further, [Tom] Kenny discovered a darker side of online degrees and potential abuses, such as pedophiles earning degrees in child counseling, opening up private practices and preying on unsuspecting victims. He also exposed federal government employees who knowingly received bogus online degrees to advance their careers, using nearly $100,000 of taxpayer's money. . . . Another unsettling discovery was made after Kenny noticed that the return address on the envelope of his false degree was from Pakistan. Forensic computer specialists confirmed the connection to Pakistan but were unable to determine exactly who the money went to and what it was used for." http://www.wiu.edu/newsrelease.sphp?release_id=3683

"The Virginian-Pilot reported that at least five Virginia Beach firefighters received “life experience" degrees from Almeda University and Rochville University, both online diploma mills, to qualify to take the department's captain's exam. The department's policy didn't specify which accrediting agencies were acceptable and caused a rift among firefighters, the newspaper reported, prompting the Human Resources Department to look into revising its standards." http://www.naplesnews.com/news/2006/may/21/officer_has_pay_back_raise_after_degreemill_probe/?local_news

"In the United States, unaccredited degrees may not be acceptable for state or federal civil service or other employment; in certain cases and circumstances; criminal penalties may even apply should such a degree be presented in lieu of a degree from an accredited institution. However, such degrees in and of themselves are illegal only in Oregon, New Jersey, Indiana, Illinois, North Dakota and Nevada, where they are considered as misdemeanors mostly punishable by relatively small fines [2]." http://www.homestayfinder.com/Dictionary.aspx?q=list_of_unaccredited_institutions_of_higher_learning SarahTeach 20:39, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

EssayRelief, and Belford have the same IP/DNS/MX/server[edit]

www.belforduniversity.net

http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/lookup.ch?name=belforduniversity.net&type=ALL

belforduniversity.net. NS IN 86400 a.ns.interland.net.

belforduniversity.net. NS IN 86400 b.ns.interland.net.

belforduniversity.net. NS IN 86400 c.ns.interland.net.

belforduniversity.net. MX IN 1800 mail.belforduniversity.net. [Preference = 5]

belforduniversity.net. A IN 1800 209.213.114.56

a.ns.interland.net. A IN 86400 64.226.28.33

b.ns.interland.net. A IN 86400 209.237.137.10

c.ns.interland.net. A IN 86400 209.237.137.10

mail.belforduniversity.net. A IN 1800 209.213.114.19

www.essayrelief.com

http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/lookup.ch?name=essayrelief.com&type=ALL

essayrelief.com. NS IN 86400 a.ns.interland.net.

essayrelief.com. NS IN 86400 b.ns.interland.net.

essayrelief.com. NS IN 86400 c.ns.interland.net.

essayrelief.com. MX IN 1800 mail.essayrelief.com. [Preference = 5]

essayrelief.com. MX IN 1800 mail1.essayrelief.com. [Preference = 10]

essayrelief.com. A IN 1800 66.132.173.138

a.ns.interland.net. A IN 86400 64.226.28.33

b.ns.interland.net. A IN 86400 209.237.137.10

c.ns.interland.net. A IN 86400 209.237.137.10

mail.essayrelief.com. A IN 3600 209.213.114.23

mail1.essayrelief.com. A IN 1800 209.172.33.204

www.academicprofs.com

http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/lookup.ch?name=academicprofs.com&type=ALL

academicprofs.com. NS IN 86400 a.ns.interland.net.

academicprofs.com. NS IN 86400 b.ns.interland.net.

academicprofs.com. NS IN 86400 c.ns.interland.net.

academicprofs.com. MX IN 1800 mail.academicprofs.com. [Preference = 5]

academicprofs.com. A IN 1800 66.132.173.168

a.ns.interland.net. A IN 86400 64.226.28.33

b.ns.interland.net. A IN 86400 209.237.137.10

c.ns.interland.net. A IN 86400 209.237.137.10

mail.academicprofs.com. A IN 1800 209.213.114.23

www.essays-heaven.com

http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/lookup.ch?name=essays-heaven.com&type=ALL

essays-heaven.com. NS IN 86400 a.ns.interland.net.

essays-heaven.com. NS IN 86400 b.ns.interland.net.

essays-heaven.com. NS IN 86400 c.ns.interland.net.

essays-heaven.com. MX IN 1800 mail.essays-heaven.com. [Preference = 5]

essays-heaven.com. A IN 1800 216.150.6.176

a.ns.interland.net. A IN 86400 64.226.28.33

b.ns.interland.net. A IN 86400 209.237.137.10

c.ns.interland.net. A IN 86400 209.237.137.10

mail.essays-heaven.com. A IN 3600 209.213.114.23

SarahTeach 07:35, 31 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Ownership/Connections[edit]

All of the above shows a series of connections among a range of online universities and essay-writing sites. However, it also seems to stray into original research, and certainly would if one went further and in the article claimed outright shared ownership. As it stands, the article has a "Connections" section, drawing on an appropriate source. If a further reliable source can be found to illustrate additional connections, it should certainly be added.

A note to those editing this page: other editors' Talk-page contributions should very, very rarely be edited. Wikipedia is not censored. Robertissimo 03:22, 4 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Link to official site[edit]

I do not think an edit war is the solution to whether or not the organization's official site should be included among the article's sources and references. As has been stated, Wikipedia is not censored. Editors' own feelings regarding any individual article subject's merits or lack thereof should not trump that fundamental, whether one is discussing religion, politics, or even the shadiest corner of academics. The article is quite forthright in discussing what Belford is and is not, and has drawn on good sources to do so. Robertissimo 02:23, 6 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

With all due respect, that has nothing to do with hyperlinking. A plain text URL is perfectly acceptable, but does not help the criminals increase their Google/Yahoo page rank. SarahTeach 02:43, 6 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I understand that you feel strongly about issues surrounding education and fraud; I share many of your concerns. However, I disagree that we should dilute the usefulness of Wikipedia as a source for information solely out of concern for something like search-engine ranking. The solution you are proposing regarding Belford University's own site (to write out the URL, but not hyperlink it) is not one I have seen anywhere else in Wikipedia, whether in articles on religion, sexuality, science, or any other controversy-engendering field that comes to mind. In all areas we can find articles that include related links that many would find potentially objectionable or legally dubious. The bottom line is that we seek to provide neutral, verifiable information about each article's subject. Finally, I hope you will assume good faith and not think that I am in way an apologist for any organization seeking to defraud consumers. I would also ask that you not simply revert out the official site, but, if you continue to have concerns in this regard, post a request for comment. Robertissimo 15:52, 6 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Spam, spam, lovely spam[edit]

Resolved

The current version[3] contains a spammy section. As I am at two reverts already I cannot revert the spammy text, but instead must seek a compromise version. Sorry about that. Weregerbil 18:40, 21 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Already taken care of; thanks! Weregerbil 18:41, 21 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Good call. Thue | talk 14:24, 22 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

George Gollin[edit]

The references proving that George Gollin was offered a doctorate is a dead link, so I've removed it, pending a reliable citation. Llamabr (talk) 22:49, 4 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I did find a source for the information -- George Gollin's website. From the context, I think the true source was his website, not the link formerly cited in the article, and the item on his website was just an offhand statement. While looking for the source, however, I found some other items that I thought would add far more information value to the article than the Gollin item, so I added one of those other items. --Orlady (talk) 17:20, 5 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

George Gollin is a dead link. http://www.illinois.gov/oeig/investigations/Documents/14EEC011_Gollin.pdf — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:5B0:2B09:620:4119:177C:2F38:3F90 (talk) 10:21, 17 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Original research[edit]

The following was copied from someplace above.

Comment redacted.

Wikipedia is not the proper place to publish original research. I suggest that you contact the authorities in Pakistan or a newspaper journalist in order to get this information published. Thank you, TallMagic (talk) 14:14, 6 November 2009 (UTC) This comment is referring to the redacted comment that contained original research. TallMagic (talk) 04:47, 4 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I'm redacting the comment made by 10.165. This talk page is for discussing our article about "Belford University". If have a reliable secondary source to support your assertions then please provide them and we will happily add it to the article. -----J.S (T/C/WRE) 03:33, 4 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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