Talk:Beachwood, Ohio

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Untitled[edit]

There should be at least some mention that the majority of residence in Beachwood are Jewish

Not only is there a mention, there are 2 mentions. Mention #1 says that Beachwood is 80% Jewish. Mention #2 says that Beachwood is 70% Jewish. Both facts cannot simultaneously be correct, and neither are supportred by citations. Bigturtle 00:58, 15 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Tell us more...[edit]

About the history of Beachwood. When was it incorporated as city? Etc..Kaltenborn (talk) —Preceding undated comment was added at 23:54, 14 August 2008 (UTC) Please note at the bottom, the link for Maltz Musium is incorrect and takes you to the Wiki article on "Shmaltz." 75.33.60.29 (talk) 20:53, 2 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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Inaccurate and/or irrelevant info (edits on Jews and Judaism section)[edit]

Okay.. let's look at this paragraph and I'll explain what is wrong with it.

In the late 1940s, during the social demographic shift known as White flight, Jewish families from inner city neighborhoods of Glenville and Hough followed the trend of other white families, and began relocating to established communities in the eastern suburbs such as Beachwood, as well as Cleveland Heights, Shaker Heights, and South Euclid.[1]

1. The article is about Beachwood, not the history of Cleveland's East Side or the paths migrating Jewish families took to get to Beachwood. A cursory mention of White Flight and the region is sufficient.

2. Several neighborhoods on the East Side (e.g. large sections of St.Clair-Superior and Collinwood as well as Little Italy, and Slavic Village) remained predominantly white until the mid-late 80s, so saying 'like other white families' you're implying that all white people left. I don't know if you're old enough to remember it, but I am and I do.

3. White Flight was a product of the late 1950's and gained steam well into the 1970s, and began largely after Brown v. Board of Education (1954) desegregated schools and kicked off the Civil Rights era. Regardless of how many times you want to say that it began in the 40's you're flat out wrong. And the Jews in the Eastern suburbs in the 1940s were largely doing what (to quote you again) 'other white families' with the means were motivated by: moving to bigger houses and less crowding in a prosperous post-war economy. Woodland, Mt. Pleasant, Kinsman, Hough and Glenville were all heavily Jewish until the 50s. Regardless of whatever misinformation you want to offer up, you can simply look at the population figures: Beachwood had less than 1,100 people in the beginning of the 1950's -- after a whopping 700 people had moved there during the 1940s. White Flight -- or any flight for that matter --had virtually no impact on Beachwood's growth until the 1950s. So again, only a cursory mention is necessary.

The bottom line is, what you're adding is misleading and inaccurate, which is why you can't cite it with any reliable historical sources (or accurately cite the source you did give). Please do not revert this again. Ryecatcher773 (talk) 17:42, 21 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

  • I'll add some observations: (1) The claim about "late 1940s" is not supported by the citation. The Encyclopedia of Cleveland (ECH) website says "Following World War II", which could mean "late 1940s" but could also mean early 1950s, mid 1950s, late 1950s, 1960s, late 1940s to 1970s, etc. If the "late 1940s" claim is to be made, a reliable, neutral, published source must be found. As it is, the citation says "following World War II", and that phrase (or something similar and vague) must be used. (2) The citation does not say anything about "white flight". If that claim is to be made, then get a citation; if not, remove the claim. My suggestion is that some research be done to determine the cause of Jewish community movement out of Cleveland and into eastern suburbs after WWII; if no sources identify such claims, the claim most definitely has to come out. We have violate the prohibition on original research otherwise. (3) The citation says "Following World War II, the Jewish community began to push into the Heights and eastern suburbs." That does not specify "inner city neighborhoods" like Glenville and Hough. The phrase "inner city" is neither supported by the cite nor needed. Additionally, we should try to avoid giving undue weight to Glenvill and Hough, and I would suggest that the sentence be edited to say "Jewish families from Cleveland began relocating". (4) While the citation specifically mentions Beachwood as a destination for Jewish people relocating from Cleveland, no mention of South Euclid is made. Unless an appropriate citation can be found, that claim should come out. The use of the phrase "as well as" in the article edit appears (to me) to place undue weight on Beachwood as a destination; I would edit the sentence to read "relocating to eastern suburbs such as Beachwood, Hunting Valley, Pepper Pike, and various Heights communities." At least those communities are mentioned, and it avoids debate over which of the many "Heights" communities are intended by the ECH article. As the article evolves toward B-class, editors should be encouraged to find sources that say exactly how many Jewish people in-migrated into Beachwood during a specific time-frame, how that migration compares to other suburbs, and how that migration altered (or not) the socio-religious makeup of Beachwood (did Jews become a majority? a significant minority? just one of many in-migration groups?) to indicate the relative (percentage) size of the in-migration. - Tim1965 (talk) 23:09, 22 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
I'd leave all that stuff out...more conjecture than fact. Vjmlhds (talk) 16:53, 26 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ "case.edu/ech/articles/j/jews--judaism/". case.edu. Retrieved 2017-10-12.
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