Talk:Barbara Hershey

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Good articleBarbara Hershey has been listed as one of the Media and drama good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.
Article milestones
DateProcessResult
February 18, 2012Good article nomineeListed

NPOV[edit]

In reference to NPOV, some examples, but not all, from the text:

which was being directed on the cheap by a fresh-out-of-film-school talent named Martin Scorsese.

Adapting that book into a film would become a 16 year labor of love for Scorsese, who would eventually cast Hershey as Mary Magdalene - though not before making her audition, to prove that she had earned it.

In characteristically free-spirited fashion, they would later recreate their love scene in a hay-filled boxcar for a Playboy magazine pictorial.

However, the hippie label soon became a career impediment and by the late 1970s she was reduced to appearing in made-for-TV embarrassments like Flood! and Sunshine Christmas. But her excellent work in Richard Rush's 1980 critical favorite The Stunt Man - her first big screen appearance in four years - served as a reminder to Hollywood that there was still a notably beautiful and talented actress in their midst.

and so on. Well written, but seems more like a piece for People Magazine. Steve-O 00:56, 18 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

All those "People-isms" were mine, I'm afraid. If there was a "neutrality" reminder when I threw this together a few years ago, I was too amped by the novelty of discovering Wikipedia to pay any attention to it. I've done my best to tone it down - and added the discreditable note on Mr. Andrews. Thanks for the constructive criticism. - Ribonucleic, 2 March 2006

I've been doing a major over-haul on this article, but I did not read this thread until just now (several days into the project). I found all these statements to be of non-neutral POV. I've been doing my best to re-write or add citations to most but I tried, and I can't deal with this: Hershey's appearance in the horror film The Entity (1981)—where she played a woman repeatedly raped by an unseen supernatural force—sufficiently impressed Michael Douglas, who a decade later fought to have her cast as his estranged wife in Falling Down'.. If you read it, and you add it, you can also cite it, that way someone like me doesn't wasted time looking for where you read it. I just could not find it.--Ishtar456 (talk) 22:31, 9 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Revisions?[edit]

I think this article should be tagged as needing major revisions (I don't know how one does this tagging thing). The introductory sentence is already unintentionally funny: "Barbara Hershey is an American actress, known for her many film roles." Is anyone able to do a major overhaul? Johannes Wich-Schwarz 01:42, 17 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Coral Kattner[edit]

There was a reference to a 'Coral Kattner', as "Her best friend was Coral Kattner". It was out of context as a non-sequitur, and I couldn't find any other reference to this person.

This may well be fact, but I thought it didn't belong where it was, and didn't have anywhere else to put it, so deleted the phrase. Blugreen 13:25, 6 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

need photo(s)[edit]

I have pretty much busted my tail on this article, but the images I have uploaded, I know, are problematic. I have scoured the internet and sent out several requests for permission to use photos of Hershey, but have received no response. I really want to nominate this for GA, but I'm not going to until I least find an acceptable image for the infobox. If there is anyone that can help, I will be very grateful.--Ishtar456 (talk) 02:04, 3 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I sadly cannot help, but I wish you luck. This is a fantastic article on an iconic actress. Bruce Campbell (talk) 23:07, 18 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

removed from lead[edit]

I removed: "Her career was again revived by the release of Black Swan, for which her portrayal of an overbearing mother and former ballerina has received critical acclaim and a BAFTA Award nomination. She also had a supporting role in her most recent box office hit horror film, Insidious." Because 1. I do not think that her career was in need of revival at that point. I think it has been pretty steady for the past several decades. 2. This is not summation of the text, in fact, it is not in the body of the text at all. It is a new, un-cited detail. I have not seen it, but was "Insidious" really one of her major accomplishments? Does it have to be mentioned in the lead? Was it more significant that "Murder or the Orient Express"? Also I think " She was alway photogenic" is an opinion that has no place in the article, let alone the lead. And A Killing in a Small Town has been renamed Evidence of Love a detail I had there, but has been removed, I don't know why. Opps, forgot. --Ishtar456 (talk) 14:38, 19 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

GA Review[edit]

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Reviewing
This review is transcluded from Talk:Barbara Hershey/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Ian Rose (talk · contribs) 23:41, 3 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Don't mind Barbara Hershey as an actress, and I've never plucked the oldest unreviewed article from GAN before, so that's two good reasons to take this one... ;-) I'll probably do this in a couple of passes, firstly checking that everything in the main body is cited to reliable sources and getting you to take care of any outstanding issues there, then reviewing and perhaps copyediting for prose, along with verifying image licensing. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 23:41, 3 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Toolbox check
  • No dab links reported.
  • Ref #11 reported dead by EL checker but no issue when I link to it myself.
Referencing
  • Good practice to finish each paragraph with a reference; currently this is missing from:
    • 1970s -- third para, last sentence.
      • DONE: didn't sound like a big deal, but it has been a while since I did any editing here. Most of this article I did a long time ago. I forget how to do a lot of it, so this could take a while. Slow and steady, thanks for your review.--Ishtar456 (talk) 22:07, 7 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
        • Not quite -- just need citation for the Golden Globe nom at end of third para. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 01:34, 13 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
    • 1990s -- first para, last sentence, and last para.
      • DONE
    • 2000s -- first para, last sentence.
      • DONE
  • All awards in the Filmography section and in the Awards section should be cited unless you've already done so for each of them in the main body. For example, the Laurel award for Last Summer is not cited anywhere; pls rectify that and pls also check that all other awards are cited somewhere per above.
  • DONE
    • I will add citations as I move the awards section to the filmography as you suggested.
      • What do you think of the reliability of this[[1]]site?
        • Disregard the above question, I have found plenty of sources, but the day is over. I will work on this some more tomorrow.--Ishtar456 (talk) 02:32, 8 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
  • Some references are too brief and should be made consistent with others:
    • DONE
    • The Variety citation (ref #2) needs page number or at least article title.
      • That was not even a citation but a wikilink to the Variety article. Pre-dates my edits, I am sure. They have been replaced with real citations.
    • Refs #42 and #43 need more detail, e.g. website plus retrieval date.
      • They are now combined and are #45.
    • Ref #51 uses "Read" -- should be "Retrieved".
      • I could not find this one (number are different now, but I check with edit find and cound not find the word "read".
    • Please check that all other online refs have retrieval dates.
      • I have checked them, but my eye sight is not that good, so may have missed some. I think that they are alright now, though.
        • DONE
  • What makes NetGlimse a reliable site?
    • Oh, I don't know, I think that I was just trying to reference something someone else wrote, 'cause it is not something I would have written, but I would want there to be a citation for it. Hard to remember now how it went down, but happy to get rid on that phrase anyway. Sounded like POV. --Ishtar456 (talk) 22:37, 7 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
      • DONE
Structure
  • Generally looks fine, however I'd question why we need to list awards in both the Filmography and in a separate Awards section. Since all her awards seem related to specific productions, you could put everything in the Filmography and drop the Awards section.
    • DONE Everything is done so far. Thanks.--Ishtar456 (talk) 22:59, 8 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
      • Tks, aside from one little thing noted above, that looks good, tks. Will get onto prose/image review now. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 01:34, 13 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Prose/detail
  • Minor copyedit but I'm pretty happy with how it reads and the level of detail/coverage. You may want to check to ensure I haven't altered anything that looked odd to me but was deliberate on your part (in which case let's discuss). Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 12:26, 17 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Supporting materials
  • Infobox looks fine.
  • Image licensing looks okay for main picture but fair-use rationales for this article are missing from the poster shots of:
    • Last Summer
      • DONE
    • The Baby Maker
      • DONE
        • Under "Purpose" in your FUR, I would remove everything between (and inclusive of) "Main infobox" to "Additional" -- it just confuses matters; everything after "Additional" is fine. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 11:16, 17 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
    • Boxcar Bertha
  • As a suggestion, the article would look more balanced image-wise if we perhaps dropped the Boxcar image entirely (DONE) and added a poster featuring her likeness from one of her later films in the 1980s, 1990s, or 2000s sections (with suitable FUR for this article of course). Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 01:52, 13 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
    • I have been dreading this part of the conversation. I used to have several good images in this article, but I find the process of adding images to be extremely complex and confusing. I have tried my best to do it right, but I turn around and they are deleted without warning. I had to wait for two years for someone to add an image to the infobox before I even dared submit this article for review. Someone finally did, and then I added the other images as they were already used in other articles, and then I kept my fingers cross. Aside from my inability to prevent good images from being deleted, Hershey has not really been the featured star of anything in a long time, so any later images most likely do not depict her. I find that adding them is a little pointless in an article about her. I used to have a picture of her in "the hat" that she wore in the natural. I thought it was a really good addition considering what I had written about it and its importance, but it got deleted without warning and I haven't got a clue as to how to go about replacing it. If you think that this is worthy with the images as is then that is great, but I feel helpless to do any more about the images. --Ishtar456 (talk) 22:20, 14 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
      • It's not an issue, images are not strictly a requirement to pass GA and I know how problematic it is to provide them in an article such as this. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 11:16, 17 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Summary
  • Overall this looks quite good, pls acknowledge/action referencing and structure points above and then I'll get on with the remaining things. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 03:19, 6 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
    • I am okay with your edits, I just added the dates back to Black Swan and Insidious, because I believe that they have to be there for movies. As far as I can see, everything is done. Thanks. --Ishtar456 (talk) 22:05, 17 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
      • Heh, personally I think it looks odd putting the dates in parentheses after the film title when the date is given (expicitly or implicitly) elsewhere in the sentence but it wouldn't surprise me if it's just the standard no matter what in film articles, so not fussed. Did you see that comment on Baby Maker's FUR above? Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 23:44, 17 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
        • I got called on that date thing on another article, so I put them in now, regardless of the fact that the date is already there. I guess it prevents confusion with films of the same name. Anyway, I did not see your earlier comment about the image. I could not take "additional" out with the template I used. So I did the best I could. I hope it works. Thanks.--Ishtar456 (talk) 01:53, 18 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]
          • Good enough -- happy to pass this now, well done! Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 05:06, 18 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

removed because it had no citation[edit]

I have removed the following from the list of awards (there may be more to follow) because I could not find a citation for it. If you can add one, please replace it.

According to Internet Movie Database, she DID win the Avoriaz Fantastic Film Festival Award for Best Actress. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0082334/awards — Preceding unsigned comment added by 138.217.211.199 (talk) 05:21, 4 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Barbara Hershey, protected?[edit]

There are some controversial or political figures who need their pages protected due to vandalism. But Barbara Hershey? Why is this page protected? I was just going to add in a detail to her infobox and found I couldn't.

If this protection was the result of an old edit war, could the decision be reviewed and perhaps the page now unprotected? I can't figure out why anyone would vandalize this particular article. 69.125.134.86 (talk) 17:47, 17 July 2013 (UTC) I would also add, one of her most important roles was as Noor Khan in the 1979 miniseries, "A man called Intrepid."Andrew r carter (talk) 14:20, 5 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

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Start date of her relationship with Carradine; her son's name.[edit]

Greetings.
The film Heaven With a Gun was released in 1969, but its filming happened in May of 1968, before two other Westerns in which David Carradine worked immediately afterward, which were also shot in 1968 and released in 1969: Young Billy Young (July-August 1968) and The Good Guys and the Bad Guys (September 1968). It appears like that on IMDb:
Heaven With a Gun
<https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0064409/locations?ref_=tt_ql_sm>
Young Billy Young
<https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0065230/locations?ref_=tt_ql_sm>
The Good Guys and the Bad Guys
<​​https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0064379/locations?ref_=tt_ql_sm>

And, it is more or less told so by Mr. Carradine in his autobiography Endless Highway. He rarely puts dates in it, but as a reference, he mentions the year 1966 on page 291, and the following year he mentions is 1969, on page 328. The chapter Barbara, in which he tells the circumstances of their meeting and the beginning of their relationship, starts on page 298; on page 304 he tells about getting the roles in the following two Westerns. On page 307 he tells about the purchase of their house at Laurel Canyon. On page 311 he tells about the filming of the movie The McMasters (then titled The Last Cowboy), which happened in March 1969, according to IMDb:
<https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0064649/locations?ref_=tt_ql_sm>
He tells about that film's name change on page 312.

Therefore, it can be concluded that their relationship started in 1968, not in 1969.

Regarding Ms. Hershey's son, it is probably incorrect he changed his name legally. Indeed, on page 443 of Endless Highway, David Carradine tells about his son going by Tom, which really chagrined him, but later on, he mentions his "Free" identity appeared in their reunions. The young Mr. Carradine has one credit as an actor under the name of Free on IMDb (in a 2014 action short film, with his sister Calista), and appears with that name in an article about his father.
<https://www.imdb.com/title/tt3622954/?ref_=nm_knf_t1>
<http://mamuseum.cms.ipressroom.com/news/david-carradine-inducted-into-hall-of-fame-and-jacket-unveiled-at-museum>

Nowadays he leads a private life, he is a Registered Nurse since May of 2021, using the name "Free Carradine" on his Facebook (where he covers the given name in his diploma with a daruma doll) and "Free (Tom) Carradine" in his LinkedIn. One could assume he preferred to be called Tom in formal settings since his childhood, for rather obvious reasons, but still kept his given name legally. Maybe because his parents recorded a song about it.
<https://archive.org/details/david-carradine/03+-+Feeling+That+Grows.mp3>

Also, after seeing the pictures of him, you'll notice that the image that sometimes appears in searches about Free Carradine, also in some magazine articles, the one that always appears when searching Tom Carradine, the one that appears in Google's "knowledge panel" about "Tom Carradine. David Carradine's son" and is linked to "Barbara Hershey. Children: Tom Carradine," actually corresponds to Mr. Tom Carradine, British musician, who has nothing to do with David Carradine, American actor.
<https://www.carradinescockneysingalong.co.uk/tom-carradine​​>

I have given feedback to Google REPEATEDLY about the mistake, with links and everything, but it appears to be impervious to facts. Take that into account in future searches. And remember Free Carradine's face, even when the article says he changed his name to Tom for good.
<https://bodyheightweight.com/david-carradine-family-wife-kids/>
Thanks. Maykiwi (talk) 20:56, 9 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

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