Talk:William, Prince of Wales

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by AirshipJungleman29 talk 16:29, 22 December 2023 (UTC)

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• Article history

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• ... that Prince William was the first future heir to the British throne to be born in a hospital?

ALT 1:... that Prince William reportedly used the name "Steve" while studying at the University of St Andrews to avoid attracting attention from the media?

• • Reviewed:
  • Comment: As per Reviewer's suggestion and also because it meets the criteria

Improved to Good Article status by MSincccc (talk). Self-nominated at 16:09, 14 November 2023 (UTC). Post-promotion hook changes for this nom will be logged at Template talk:Did you know nominations/William, Prince of Wales; consider watching this nomination, if it is successful, until the hook appears on the Main Page.

• Not a review, just a comment, but I do have two suggestions: 1. I think the first hook could go without the mention of the hospital's name since the main point is that he was the first British heir to be born in a hospital and adding extra detail somewhat detracts from the point, and 2. while I think the original hook is pretty good, since this is Prince William we're talking about here, are there any other possible alternative hook suggestions you could give? Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 03:24, 15 November 2023 (UTC)

Since this hasn't been reviewed yet, I'll leave this to another reviewer, but I do think ALT1 is the more surprising hook here and thus probably the better option. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 03:08, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

Article is evidently long enough and well written/sourced. It has recently been promoted to GA status. I'll trust that PQP isn't required yet for the nominator. Both hooks are interesting, though I have problems with both of them: the first (1st born in hospital) does not seem to be cited or mentioned in the article and surely, if this hook was to progress, it should say "heir to the British throne" or similar? The second hook (called himself "Steve") has a citation, but only to the homepage of the Herald Scotland, so without a full url, or page number, or access date, surely this citation isn't complete? I'd suggest the word "reportedly" is added to the hook if this one goes forward. Finally, the article has some issues which are being addressed on the Talk page, with reverts and heavy editing of the lede introduction. We might need to wait for this to be resolved before progressing the nomination. Sionk (talk) 21:45, 27 November 2023 (UTC)

Well Sionk the discussion regarding lead has been peacefully resolved and thus you can proceed with the DYK nomination process if possible. (talk)

I've made the change to ALT0. For what it's worth, the hospital thing has been reported in multiple sources before (I remember reading about it before), such as Time and The Independent, so a source should easily be found to report on that. Looking online there are also multiple other reliable sources that mention the Steve thing so this is probably also another case where a source could just be added. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 05:45, 28 November 2023 (UTC)

I've added a better reference for "Steve" (FWIW many of the reliable sources mentioning this trivia item give their source as the Daily Mirror which is of indeterminate reliability, so I've selected a magazine that ought to be reliable, doesn't cite the Mirror, and hasn't been discussed at RS/R). Rosbif73 (talk) 18:50, 28 November 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for improving the source for ALT 1. Before it's approved, I'm wondering whether it should say "Prince William, heir to the British throne, ... considering there are numerous Prince Williams. Sionk (talk) 22:21, 28 November 2023 (UTC)

Sionk Are we going to proceed with the nomination? The status shows that the hook has been reviewed. What's next? Will this ever appear on the Main Page of English Wikipedia. Just seeking an update from you. Regards MSincccc (talk) 10:04, 21 December 2023 (UTC)

DYK good to go with ALT1 hook. Citation query has been resolved. There's no great reason to further amend the hook because Prince William is blue linked. Sionk (talk) 16:54, 21 December 2023 (UTC)

"Unnecessary spaces"

Re this edit (and previous similar), some people find spaces between citation parameters as USEFUL. In fact, some editors actually go to the trouble of INSERTING them. What problem are we attempting to fix by removing them? Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 09:35, 30 April 2024 (UTC)

If we insert five spaces for each citation, totaling around 400 references, it adds 2000 unnecessary characters that are not needed. Removing these would reduce the article size in a positive manner without affecting the citation or the prose. Regards. MSincccc (talk) 09:41, 30 April 2024 (UTC)

Some citations even have a space each side of the parameter divider? Again this makes the citation easier to read. I suspect that, for most articles, "saving characters" is a bit of a non-problem? Even if it were a problem, it would be a task best assigned to a bot? Martinevans123 (talk) 09:47, 30 April 2024 (UTC)

If articles like these were to leave a space after each citation parameter, the article size would unnecessarily increase even before reaching its intended length. There are FAs that do not leave a space between citation parameters, and that is perfectly acceptable. Regards. MSincccc (talk) 09:54, 30 April 2024 (UTC)

Typically this sort of edit is deprecated because it has no effect on the page output. See Wikipedia:Bot policy#Cosmetic changes. Note also that every revision of a page is stored separately, so each time a cosmetic edit is made, an entire page is saved. The space saving by removing one odd unimportant character is countered by having to save a copy of the entire page each time such an edit is made. The servers end up storing more not less. Celia Homeford (talk) 09:56, 30 April 2024 (UTC)

Omitting unnecessary spaces after citation parameters aligns with several key Wikipedia policies and guidelines, promoting clarity, consistency, and readability in articles. The Wikipedia: Manual of Style serves as a foundational document, providing guidelines for formatting across Wikipedia articles. While it does not explicitly address spaces after citation parameters, it emphasizes the importance of clarity and consistency in formatting, principles that are compromised by the inclusion of unnecessary spaces.

Additionally, the Wikipedia: Manual of Style/Layout offers insights into the layout of articles, aiming to enhance readability and visual appeal. Including unnecessary spaces after citation parameters can disrupt the visual flow of the text, detracting from the overall readability of the article. Consistency in formatting contributes to a more cohesive reading experience for Wikipedia readers.

Furthermore, the Wikipedia: Manual of Style/Text formatting provides recommendations for text formatting, stressing the importance of judicious spacing to improve readability. By avoiding the inclusion of unnecessary spaces after citation parameters, editors can adhere to these guidelines, ensuring that articles remain clear, concise, and visually appealing to readers.

In essence, the omission of unnecessary spaces after citation parameters is consistent with Wikipedia's broader principles of clarity, consistency, and readability. By adhering to these guidelines, editors can maintain high-quality formatting standards across articles, contributing to a more cohesive and enjoyable reading experience for Wikipedia readers. Regards. MSincccc (talk) 10:04, 30 April 2024 (UTC)

I wholly take issue with the notion that removing spaces "promotes clarity or readability". Martinevans123 (talk) 10:09, 30 April 2024 (UTC) p.s. and I'm a bit unconvinced about any benefits for "cohesive and enjoyable reading experience for Wikipedia readers", as it's all invisible to the reader!

What is the "intended length" of this article? Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 10:07, 30 April 2024 (UTC)

Elizabeth II's FA-class article is 197,909 bytes in size, Prince Philip's is 161,159 bytes, while father Charles III's is 247,426 bytes long. William's is of comparable length, despite being only 42 and yet to ascend to the throne. Regards. MSincccc (talk) 10:14, 30 April 2024 (UTC)

So any space-removing activity might be better directed at those articles currently marked as "too big"? Even then, I suspect, much more radical action would probably be required e.g. splitting off material into new stand-alone articles. Martinevans123 (talk) 10:31, 30 April 2024 (UTC)

Agreed. We can revisit the topic of trimming down another time. For now, the article is fine as it stands. Additionally, when I remove spaces, I do so in bulk rather than individually, as I did when I was a new user. Regards and have a great day ahead. MSincccc (talk) 10:37, 30 April 2024 (UTC)

Coats of arms and copyright

A discussion is going on at the Commons concerning the copyright status of several coats of arms that are in use on pages related to British royalty. Please feel free to share your comments and input at commons:Commons:Deletion requests/Coat of arms of Queen Camilla.svg. Thanks. Keivan.f^Talk 18:30, 4 May 2024 (UTC)

Blues and Royals

How long was William's service in the Blues and Royals? The article just says he started in December 2006. Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 15:17, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

@Martinevans123 I'm currently looking for a citation. Once I've found it, I'll add it. Please refrain from re-inserting the tag you previously added, as I'll likely include the information in the article soon. Regards MSincccc (talk) 15:21, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

Thanks. I will also refrain from putting a tag in the infobox. Regards. Martinevans123 (talk) 15:48, 13 May 2024 (UTC)

2006–2008 (1, 2). Keivan.f^Talk 20:51, 13 May 2024 (UTC)