Talk:A grain of salt

This article is written in American English, which has its own spelling conventions (color, defense, traveled) and some terms that are used in it may be different or absent from other varieties of English. According to the relevant style guide, this should not be changed without broad consensus.

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the A grain of salt article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

English Language Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject English Language, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of articles related to the English language on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.English LanguageWikipedia:WikiProject English LanguageTemplate:WikiProject English LanguageEnglish Language articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the importance scale.

The origional content of "Grain of salt" (now at Grain of salt/Poetic interpretations), while perhaps providing interesting poetic, artistic, or philosophical commentary on why this phrase might be appropriate and its "deeper meaning", harded seemed the stuff of an encyclopedia article. Thus I moved it to a less central page.

I'm not even sure a page for this phrase is compatible with Wikipedia's anti-dictionary policy.

-- Ryguasu

I have to agree...Wikipedia is not a usage guide. --Larry Sanger

So: move it or delete it? Ryguasu, it looks like you originated the current contents. It now exists just because the original non-encyclopedia article existed, but there is no reason that I can see for having an excursus on "grain of salt" in Wikipedia. Do you have an opinion about moving or deleting it altogether? --Larry Sanger

I have no particular feelings for the article. We do have articles on foreign-language "proverbs", and I think it would be inconsistant with those if there were not some space for English-language sayings as well. But I don't care what form that space might take. In the end, this article took all of about a minute to write, so it's not exactly something I value. -- Ryguasu

Actually, the grain of salt thing probably isn't a proverb. Perhaps a mere figure of speech, although I doubt there's a rigid distinction between the two. -- Ryguasu

Idioms have long been a part of every language. They have no relevant meaning on their own and thus should be considered a word or subject for study, a dictionary should not include idioms as they are considered "translations" of true meaning within a language, not words with factual meaning. I think it very appropriate of Wiki to include idiomatic phrases of any language in its repertoire. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tigereyedgirl1972 (talk • contribs) 03:19, 5 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I didn't know what this phrase meant.. now I do. Thanks wiki

me too - 210.69.138.108 15:46, 24 Nov 2004 (UTC)

I found this article very useful. As with the article for "Greatest thing since sliced bread" and others like it, it helped to find the origin of the saying and to verify proper application. I also routinely will point others to these articles, and many have found them entertaining and beneficial. -- An honest quixtar ibo 15:02, 28 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Usefulness is not a sufficient criteria for inclusion here. I was surprised to find the article here. (John User:Jwy talk) 02:04, 14 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Historical Meaning[edit]

Are we sure that the Romans believed the head to be filled with salt? I have trouble believing that. That explanation also doesn't jive with the history given by dictionary.com, that it was part of an antidode. According to dictionary.com, Pliny used the phrase (possibly first) in that manner.

Dictionary.com (with a grain of salt) (scroll down)
Dictionary.com (grain of salt)
Knowwhat.com archive (grain of salt) Excellent History, if accurate
Other 'pliny + "grain of salt"' results

No one's replied in almost a week, so I editted the stuff out and replaced it with info about Pliny. The info came from the above sources. Please feel free to comment if you disagree with the changes. -- Dpark 03:52, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

-- Dpark

Not an antidote to poison.[edit]

Barbara Shack 15:35, 4 February 2006 (UTC)I added that salt is not really an antidote to poison. Some child, silly adult or self-destructive adult might try messing with poisons and salt and might end up dead.[reply]

Are we sure that salt isn't an antidote to any poison? — The Storm Surfer 00:41, 16 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Is this article even close to accurate?[edit]

What I learned in Latin classes is that the phrase refers to the practice of paying Roman soldiers in salt; thus, a grain (or a pinch) of salt equivalently means "worthless" and is the rise of other phrases such as "Not worth his salt". The Latin word salt, salus, is from where English derives the word 'salary'. So taking something 'with a grain of salt' essentially means to take something but to afford it little value. Conversely, the somewhat new phrase to take something with a 'BIG grain of salt' is simple nonsense.

This explanation makes a lot more sense than anything written on the article page, and can be corroborated in the articles both on 'Salary' and 'History of salt'. I would take dictionary.com's There is also a story... with a grain of salt. (Updating History... page) — 72.40.155.239 19:17, 7 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Funny. I had always thought it meant to take something unpleasant. bad news or whatever could taken 'with a grain of sale' to lessen the harshness. Perhaps that just comes from my penchant for tequila, however and I have no clue where I might have otherwise got that idea.... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 72.45.66.141 (talk) 07:10, 3 May 2007 (UTC).[reply]

"to take something but to afford it little value" seems a much more accurate, concise and complete definition than the waffle currently in the first paragraph of this article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.154.33.122 (talk) 11:30, 11 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Did Pliny ever use the expression "cum grano salis"?[edit]

I've just browsed the whole of Pliny's Naturalis Historia (http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/Roman/Texts/Pliny_the_Elder/home.html) and was unable to find the phrase "cum grano salis". There is "cum mica salis" (book 25, 169), "cum salis mica" (book 24, 74), and "addito salis grano" (book 23, 149), but no "cum grano salis" as far as I could see. I think that someone needs to provide a direct reference to the expression "cum grano salis" in Pliny's NH or reconsider the origins of the expression to make sure we don't perpetuate a myth through this article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.79.246.179 (talk) 12:37, 12 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

correct, the phrase in Pliny is "addito salis grano” when talking about a cure for snake bite poisoning - here it is unclear as to whether the salt should help the recipe be more effective or whether Pliny was being ironic (and not having much faith in the cure) - the orig. phrase seems to have been altered to the current usage —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.176.211.144 (talk) 19:23, 22 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Can we then clean up the article? If Pliny did not say cum grano salis, than it would seem that the article should not be having this argument with itself.--NapoliRoma (talk) 14:58, 31 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Lipstick on a pig[edit]

Hello, fellow editors … I just put some lipstick on this pig, but I'm dubious about the first reference … maybe Some Other Editor can track down the correct page on that site (Bartleby.com), or else remove it as WP:SPAM … I have no objection to the other two URLs as external links, in spite of them not being reliable sources. :-) Happy Editing! — 138.88.93.15 (talk · contribs) _{11:04, 2 July 2009 (UTC)}[reply]

If the original source is not available online, sometimes a "convenience link" to a reliable third party hosting the original content is acceptable (google books for example). I do not know about Bartleby's reputation for accurately housing the third party materials, but for it to be a "convenience link", it would need to go directly to the material cited, and this link doesn't. It's been removed. -- The Red Pen of Doom 11:28, 2 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I found this cached version … maybe Some Other Editor can find a valid URL instead of the (obviously) default 404 error page reached with the one supplied. :-) — 138.88.93.15 (talk) 11:36, 2 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Done … time for me to MOVE ON! — 138.88.93.15 (talk) 12:28, 2 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Salting the Earth[edit]

Proposing that lands that were taken with a grain of salt might have a connection for the history. I have no evidence to support this, it's just a theory. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.105.33.21 (talk) 05:28, 21 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Grain[edit]

The article adduces no evidence for the unlikely-sounding claim that the "grain" in the phrase refers to the unit of mass, rather than the more usual sense of a single crystal. It's certainly possible that that's true, but I don't see any support for it in the text or the references, barring the unsourced speculation that a pinch is about the same as a grain in the sense of a unit of mass. --Trovatore (talk) 02:05, 2 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]