Talk:Fis phenomenon

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Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment[edit]

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 22 January 2020 and 8 May 2020. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): TexShisno, MartaHarrell, JamesBethany, Yamjimenez, Jessicamoire. Peer reviewers: Debbie RT.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 21:27, 16 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

[Untitled][edit]

I find that southern people have this problem too. If you repeat phonetically what they just said "your Prod?" they'll say "no, my PRAHHHD" meaning 'pride'. They still recognize the 'correct' way to speak even though none of them do it.

It's not a matter of "correct" there. They know that you don't have a Southern accent, and that the sound you're making ("prod") does not correspond in your accent to the idea they're communicating.

You might find it surprising, but people who speak with an accept that you consider "incorrect", are just as aware and intelligent about language as you are. --FOo 17:58, 20 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Good on you! Fight the prescriptivists!

One thing though; I thought David Crystal observed the fis phenomenon, not Berko and Brown?

Nope, even Crystal cites Berko and Brown: "The phenomenon was first reported by US psycholinguists Jean Berko and Roger Brown in 1960" — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.227.97.212 (talk) 00:09, 9 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Dubious/unclear statement[edit]

"This shows that although the child could not produce the phoneme /ʃ/, he could perceive it as being different from the phoneme /s/. This has important implications for the acquisition of phonology. In short, it means that children have more, not fewer, phonological processes (or rules) applying in their speech than adults, and that part of the task of acquiring a language is figuring out which processes to allow to apply and which to suppress."

Can someone elaborate on exactly what is meant by this, or clarify it? Adults can still distinguish the difference between 'fis' and 'fish', so I don't see how it show that children have more rules at work. Gzabers 06:28, 31 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

It's a rediculous-sounding idea, meaning that Children have the abstract phonemic construction /fɪʃ/ in their head but that a phonological rule has them turn /ʃ/ into [s]; this rule is then subsequently eliminated. That's not at all what's happening. — Æµ§œš¹ _{[aɪm ˈfɻɛ̃ⁿdˡi]} 00:45, 14 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, the idea that children do have their own set of rules that are eliminated or refined over time is supported in the book "Acquiring Phonology" by Neil Smith. Jessicamoire (talk) 17:52, 7 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]